Kyle Orton Haters

[bobobonators]

Kyle Orton is currently 3rd in the National Football League in completion percentage,

 

5th in yards/game...

 

And when he gets his team in the red zone and his WR's don't fumble: we score TD's. Someone remind me what his red zone stats are again?

[section122]

Much like some other posters I had a lot of patience with EJ because of his lack of experience. I don't have nearly as much with Orton. I really don't understand the posters who have the opposite opinion. Seems like there were plenty who wanted EJ gone at all costs while they'll overlook Ortons warts. If we should have patience with anybody it should be the young QB learning on the job as he has the ability to get better. With Orton this is what you get. I hope it's good enough for the playoffs.

This post sums up my entire thoughts on the situation. Well done.

[John Cocktosten]

Orton was signed on August 30th. He had no Spring, no summer, no mini camps and didn't get firs team reps until October. Take into account that our O line is horrible and our run game has been bad since he's been in. Considering all of those facts, he's done very well.

 

Look at some of his splits :

 

4th QTR +/-7 : 200 yds - 73% - 7.7 Per att - 1 TD no Int's - 108 QB Rating/ 113 QB in the 4th overall

 

2nd half of games: 570 yds - 70% - 8.3 yds att - 3 Tds - no Int's - 109 QB rating

 

3rd down and 1-8 yds: 171 yds - 15 for 16 - 94%!!!!!! - 9 yds att - 107 qb rating

 

Red Zone: 71% (12-17) 4 TDs NO INTS 115 QB rating.

 

 

I could keep going but his splits prove one thing, He's clutch on the money downs and money moments which is what wins games in the NFL. Last time I checked most spreads are usually a single score. 109 QB rating in the second half and people are complaining? He's not the future but he's been a lot better than some want to make him out to be given the facts.

[Big Gun]

What are you even arguing at this point bro? What do announcers have anything to do with this - in your warped mind you said EJ played tougher defenses. Facts prove otherwise.

 

Detroit is best defense we've played so far, and the Vikings and Pats are both better defensively than Miami/Chicago (pts/game). So EJ played San Diego which is ranked #3 - and we saw what happened.

 

Your post was factually incorrect. It was based on opinions (yours) and those opinions were factually wrong - much the same way your opinions on Orton are wrong.

 

Yep, and oh by the way Houston's defense was something like 25th when EJ lost to them.

Edited October 20, 2014 by old school

[PromoTheRobot]

 

 

Promo, I used to say the same thing about Fitz to defend him. Our standards need to be higher. Who really cares about yardage? We scored 1 td against Detroit. We barely scored 2 against Minnesota. Who cares about yards if you're handing the other team points with turnovers or turning the ball over in the red zone?

 

Why are you a hater because you want more? I generally agree fans are irrational about QBs. That's why I am so patient with EJ. But the reason we switched to Orton was to see a big improvement.

 

Again, it's not all on him. I think our OC is terrible and our oline has regressed. That's on the coaches. But to be happy with the current results is fool hardy. This team is playoff caliber except on offense right now.

Okay, now we don't care about yardage. This after crying for years we don't have a QB that can throw a 300 yard game. We also don't care about winning games when the pressure is on. We did that twice. We don't seem to care about anything we wanted before now that those things are happening. Curious.

 

Why do we rewrite the rules to make every player deficient in some matter?

[MarkAF43]

This "HATER, AND EJ LOVER" crap is idiotic. We're all Bills fans, and the fact is if someone is rooting for one player to be better than another on our team, then that person isn't a fan, they just want to be right. Bottom line.

[Malazan]

These are the same people who calling for him to start from game 1. They won't ever be happy. Ignore them instead of letting their insanity bog you down.

[bobobonators]

Orton was signed on August 30th. He had no Spring, no summer, no mini camps and didn't get firs team reps until October. Take into account that our O line is horrible and our run game has been bad since he's been in. Considering all of those facts, he's done very well.

 

Look at some of his splits :

 

4th QTR +/-7 : 200 yds - 73% - 7.7 Per att - 1 TD no Int's - 108 QB Rating/ 113 QB in the 4th overall

 

2nd half of games: 570 yds - 70% - 8.3 yds att - 3 Tds - no Int's - 109 QB rating

 

3rd down and 1-8 yds: 171 yds - 15 for 16 - 94%!!!!!! - 9 yds att - 107 qb rating

 

Red Zone: 71% (12-17) 4 TDs NO INTS 115 QB rating.

 

 

I could keep going but his splits prove one thing, He's clutch on the money downs and money moments which is what wins games in the NFL. Last time I checked most spreads are usually a single score. 109 QB rating in the second half and people are complaining? He's not the future but he's been a lot better than some want to make him out to be given the facts.

 

Awesome. Stats are there. Eyeball test is there. He's 31 not 41. He's led a team to the playoffs in the past. Argument is over as far as I'm concerned.

[dubs]

certain issues on this board get people dug in positions like religious or political issues. Sometimes it's better just to admit that your original opinion (Orton sucks) is wrong.

 

I'll start: Hello, my name is Dubs, and I was an idiot for wanting DaRick Rogers instead of Chris Hogan.

[Big Gun]

Orton was signed on August 30th. He had no Spring, no summer, no mini camps and didn't get firs team reps until October. Take into account that our O line is horrible and our run game has been bad since he's been in. Considering all of those facts, he's done very well.

 

Look at some of his splits :

 

4th QTR +/-7 : 200 yds - 73% - 7.7 Per att - 1 TD no Int's - 108 QB Rating/ 113 QB in the 4th overall

 

2nd half of games: 570 yds - 70% - 8.3 yds att - 3 Tds - no Int's - 109 QB rating

 

3rd down and 1-8 yds: 171 yds - 15 for 16 - 94%!!!!!! - 9 yds att - 107 qb rating

 

Red Zone: 71% (12-17) 4 TDs NO INTS 115 QB rating.

 

 

I could keep going but his splits prove one thing, He's clutch on the money downs and money moments which is what wins games in the NFL. Last time I checked most spreads are usually a single score. 109 QB rating in the second half and people are complaining? He's not the future but he's been a lot better than some want to make him out to be given the facts.

 

Game, set and match. Good job John!

[C.Biscuit97]

Okay, now we don't care about yardage. This after crying for years we don't have a QB that can throw a 300 yard game. We also don't care about winning games when the pressure is on. We did that twice. We don't seem to care about anything we wanted before now that those things are happening. Curious.

 

Why do we rewrite the rules to make every player deficient in some matter?

 

You will never see one post about me cryign about 300 yards. It's a silly bench mark. EJ had like 296 in one game last year. 4 yards would make it that much better? Nonsense.

 

Rodgers had like 150 and helped GB score 5 tds against Minnesota. That's real production.

 

It's not all on Orton. But it needs to get much better. Scoring points against a Ryan defense would be a good start.

 

This should be a playoff team. Anything else and this season is a failure.

[bobobonators]

certain issues on this board get people dug in positions like religious or political issues. Sometimes it's better just to admit that your original opinion (Orton sucks) is wrong.

 

I'll start: Hello, my name is Dubs, and I was an idiot for wanting DaRick Rogers instead of Chris Hogan.

 

LMAO.

 

1. I thought we should've kept Fitz as starter 1 more season w/ EJ.

2. I wanted DaRick too.

3. I wanted Geno Smith over EJ in the draft.

[C.Biscuit97]

This "HATER, AND EJ LOVER" crap is idiotic. We're all Bills fans, and the fact is if someone is rooting for one player to be better than another on our team, then that person isn't a fan, they just want to be right. Bottom line.

 

Agree 100% but there are those that do that. I freely admit I will be a lot more patient with EJ than Orton because of the perceived ceiling and years in the NFL.

 

That said, whoever takes us to the playoffs is my favorite QB. But if Orton does not do that (and the offensive problems are not all on him), this will be a wasted year on a journeyman. And I've had too many wasted years with Holcomb and other guys.

[hondo in seattle]

I've been seeing/hearing a lot of Kyle Orton hating, both on this forum and on WGR, and I'm curious as to where all of the hate is coming from. Over the past three weeks, Orton has averaged 297 yards, 1.66 TDs, and 1 INT per game. If you extrapolate his numbers over an entire 16 game season, he would finish with 4,750 yards, 27 TDs and 16 INT.

 

So, with that being said, I don't get how anyone can say that he's even been average. Honestly, Orton has performed like a borderline top 10 QB over the past 3 weeks, and he's done this while being with the team for less than 2 months.

 

Over the past three weeks, Orton has put up those numbers with terrible o-line play, and no running game to speak of. And then to top it off, he's done all of this against three top 10 pass defenses (based on YPG, 2 top 10 defenses if you go by passer rating against). Also, in regard to his turnovers, he's on pace for 16 INTs. Romo, Luck, both Mannings, Roethlisberger, Stafford, Rivers and Brees have all had 18+ INT seasons. So, does that mean that they're all average QBs?

 

Oh, and not to mention, the Bills are 2-1 under Orton, and in both games he played some of his best football when it mattered the most to lead the Bills to wins. So, lets hear it, why should I be underwhelmed with Orton's performances over the past three weeks?

 

You shouldn't be underwhelmed or surprised. Orton sucked his first year in the NFL but has gotten progressively better since. Signing him is proving to be one of Whaley's better moves.

[C.Biscuit97]

LMAO.

 

1. I thought we should've kept Fitz as starter 1 more season w/ EJ.

2. I wanted DaRick too.

3. I wanted Geno Smith over EJ in the draft.

 

Haha and I pretty much agree with all this. I do like EJ more than Geno now because I feel he is a better leader and has more intangibles.

 

You shouldn't be underwhelmed or surprised. Orton sucked his first year in the NFL but has gotten progressively better since. Signing him is proving to be one of Whaley's better moves.

 

And that's why I wanted EJ to play. And barely scoring 17 points does nothing to change that.

 

Fun (and awful) stat: since Marrone has arrived, we've scored 25 or more points 4 times, which is terrible. Guess who was the starter all 4 times?

[hondo in seattle]

You will never see one post about me cryign about 300 yards. It's a silly bench mark. EJ had like 296 in one game last year. 4 yards would make it that much better? Nonsense.

 

Rodgers had like 150 and helped GB score 5 tds against Minnesota. That's real production.

 

It's not all on Orton. But it needs to get much better. Scoring points against a Ryan defense would be a good start.

 

This should be a playoff team. Anything else and this season is a failure.

 

What helps your team more:

 

10 of 17 for 150 yards and 1 TD.

 

or...

 

20 of 34 for 300 yards and 2 TDs?

 

In terms of passer rating, they're identical. But in the real world, the quarterback with the 2nd line is more productive and contributing more to the team's success. You gotta move the ball up and down the field to score and the 2nd QB is doing that.

 

That's why 300 yards is a benchmark.

 

EJ's 296 yard game was a good game. The fact he missed getting 300 by 4 yards is meaningless. We'd all be thrilled if EJ could throw for 296 yards every time he took the field. The problem is that - so far at least - he can't. Or even close. He's young and still (hopefully) learning but thus far he hasn't been very productive.

[Storm Front]

Comparing Kyle Orton to EJ Manuel is like comparing Kurt Warner to Matt Leinart. If one can't tell that Orton is in a different league from Manual, you are either blind or dumb and should not be watching pro football.

[Alphadawg7]

Why is it if someone criticizes someone they are a hater of that player and a lover of the player behind him? Im so tired of this board mentality because no one can openly discuss the pros and cons of a player. Its either you love him or hate him by this boards barometer. No one talks football, people just want to bash people as hater or lover of this player or that player.

 

Bottom line, Orton has played bad enough for us to be 0-3. He's also came through when we got a break late at end of games to steal 2 wins which was great. What that means is that our OL, Hackett, and Orton are not playing well enough right now for us to CONSISTENTLY win while our Defense is playing playoff caliber ball. We lost the Detroit game, just no one told the Detroit kicker. We would have lost with that offensive effort yesterday against a team that wasn't terrible like Minn.

 

If Orton and the OL can't find some consistency, we won't win many more games going into our tough part of our schedule. I do not give 2 craps about who our QB is, I just want to win. Right now, our offense has been wildly inconsistent, undisciplined, turnover prone, and not good enough to get past good teams and into the playoffs.

 

That does NOT make me an Orton hater or and EJ lover. It makes me a realist that wants this team to improve. Some fool on here yesterday said I must have been bummed when Sammy caught that game winning TD. What a bunch of CRAP. I damn near put a hole in my wall when I slammed my hand into it out of excitement with my friends here. Just because people criticize Ortons play and question if he can get us to the playoffs does NOT mean we want him to fail...it means we have EYES and we can SEE that the offense is NOT playing playoff caliber football yet.

 

Bottom line, I hope Orton turns into Rich Gannon and finds some great Rhythm. But if we can't fix the OL issues, its going to be that much harder for him to do that considering he wears cement shoes in the pocket.

 

PS: Please fire Hackett

[Security]

I am happy. He does have 2 fumbles lost too in 3 games. He takes too many sacks, 13 sacks for 73 yards.

 

If the defense plays well, and Orton finds his way in the pocket a little better, and the Bills tell Dixon to run north/South, and then Brown uses his one cut and then run downfield style, the Bills can with with Orton.

 

I like Orton.

[bobobonators]

Why is it if someone criticizes someone they are a hater of that player and a lover of the player behind him? Im so tired of this board mentality because no one can openly discuss the pros and cons of a player. Its either you love him or hate him by this boards barometer. No one talks football, people just want to bash people as hater or lover of this player or that player.

 

Bottom line, Orton has played bad enough for us to be 0-3. He's also came through when we got a break late at end of games to steal 2 wins which was great. What that means is that our OL, Hackett, and Orton are not playing well enough right now for us to CONSISTENTLY win while our Defense is playing playoff caliber ball. We lost the Detroit game, just no one told the Detroit kicker. We would have lost with that offensive effort yesterday against a team that wasn't terrible like Minn.

 

If Orton and the OL can't find some consistency, we won't win many more games going into our tough part of our schedule. I do not give 2 craps about who our QB is, I just want to win. Right now, our offense has been wildly inconsistent, undisciplined, turnover prone, and not good enough to get past good teams and into the playoffs.

 

That does NOT make me an Orton hater or and EJ lover. It makes me a realist that wants this team to improve. Some fool on here yesterday said I must have been bummed when Sammy caught that game winning TD. What a bunch of CRAP. I damn near put a hole in my wall when I slammed my hand into it out of excitement with my friends here. Just because people criticize Ortons play and question if he can get us to the playoffs does NOT mean we want him to fail...it means we have EYES and we can SEE that the offense is NOT playing playoff caliber football yet.

 

Bottom line, I hope Orton turns into Rich Gannon and finds some great Rhythm. But if we can't fix the OL issues, its going to be that much harder for him to do that considering he wears cement shoes in the pocket.

 

PS: Please fire Hackett

 

I love how you criticize the board, but then post that jaded, one-side argument. Just look at the bold. It's trash. You're as much a part of the problem as those you seem to critique. Carry on though.