Orton's Arm Posted October 13, 2014 Posted October 13, 2014 If you have to wait for a Luck or Rodgers you may have to wait a long time, possibly forever, especially if you don't know how to evaluate QBs, thus making the whole process even more of a crapshoot than it already is. If he's good enuf to win that's good enuf. People used to say things like that about EJ ie he just needs to be a game manager etc... Bottom line however was that, game manager or not, he wasn't good enuf to win However, even if KO lights it up, the Bills obviously need to avoid the errors of the past. They need to draft a QB. Right now they don't even have a reliable backup on the roster if Orton goes down. Good post, and I agree on all points. The people who chose E.J. Manuel shouldn't be the ones who get to choose his replacement. Partly because of that mistake, and also because there haven't been a ton of non-QB drafting successes recently. Orton is a better player than most people want to give him credit for. I can't think of too many post-Kelly Bills' QBs who would have equaled Orton's performance on that final drive. He's a gutsy quarterback who's noticeably more accurate than Fitz. The Bills have had one franchise quarterback in their history: Jim Kelly. If the opportunity arises to draft a QB at or above that level, they should seize it. But they shouldn't delude themselves into thinking that an opportunity like that is there when it really isn't. Which is the mistake they made with EJ Manuel. They need to wait until they can draft the right QB. In the meantime, they need to win with what they have. And what they have right now is Kyle Orton. Orton could be successful on a team like the Giants of the early '90s. A solid defense, solid running game, good pass protection. The Bills didn't achieve any of those things against the Patriots. Orton isn't Aaron Rodgers. It's not like you can make him the whole show--the whole song and dance--and expect him to be consistently successful.
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted October 13, 2014 Posted October 13, 2014 (edited) do I need to reiterate? Kyle Orton is not the long term answer. Hell he isn't even the interim answer. I saw a deer frozen in headlights? Two INT's in two consecutive games in the 1st QRT? Did the Ghost of RJ posses KO or was it the Ghost of Trent E? yes I'm beating this dead horse in numerous threads. Edited October 13, 2014 by BillsFan-4-Ever
ALF Posted October 13, 2014 Posted October 13, 2014 A good OL has to be a priority for any QB and running game to have a chance.
Storm Front Posted October 13, 2014 Posted October 13, 2014 I thought Orton played well yesterday. He was under constant pressure the whole game. The running game wasn't doing him any favors, and he did not have much time to throw deep passes. Orton made some nice throws that went further than 2 yard EJ specials. On the other hand, Brady sat back in the pocket with all day to pass, especially in the second half.
DirtDart Posted October 15, 2014 Posted October 15, 2014 What teams thought Orton was the answer? I agree. I wasn't terribly satisfied with his overall performance today, but he did some things that impressed me. I'm almost as bummed about not getting to see what he could have done in a 2 minute drill down 8 after that TD drive as I am about the loss. I'm curious if he took the reigns and started calling the plays at that point. I agree that he is not.
Casey D Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 hummmmmm Did we ever determine his contract status for next year. Is it a club only option to void the contract, or can Orton just walk away if he gets a better offer? Seems unlikely he would, but who knows.
Doc Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Did we ever determine his contract status for next year. Is it a club only option to void the contract, or can Orton just walk away if he gets a better offer? Seems unlikely he would, but who knows. It's his option to void next year. After the Fitz mistake, I'd wait until the end of the season to give him a new deal if he's still playing well.
Donald Duck Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Myself personally, Kyle Orton keeps playing the way he has been, I think we got our guy long term (3-5 years)
starrymessenger Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Myself personally, Kyle Orton keeps playing the way he has been, I think we got our guy long term (3-5 years) I agree. But can he do that? The problem that I have is that with these young players, the O-line such as it is for now, Nate calling plays etc...I really don't think that Peyton Manning or Tom Brady would have played any better these last four games. Maybe worse. That suggests to me that Orton is maybe hot right now but that eventually he will find his right cruising altitude, unless, of course, he's a late bloomer and suddenly in the top half of starting QBs in this league. That sure would be nice. Anyway we've got 8 more games to try and figure all of that out.
HOUSE Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Look guys, every situation is different, every team is different. Orton is an experienced QB and in the past he had some young quarterback weaknesses. I can tell you one thing for sure, you won't find a better QB in the NFL draft that is better then Orton and even if you did, it would take a new guy 3 years to match Orton's command of a pro style NFL Offense. -- Edited October 30, 2014 by HOUSE
Jim in Anchorage Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Myself personally, Kyle Orton keeps playing the way he has been, I think we got our guy long term (3-5 years) I agree 100% And now, instead of always having QB problems to address the Bills can work on the neglected pieces like OL. Orton's the foundation we need to build on. I think we [bills fans]] are going to be in for a great time.
xsoldier54 Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I agree with those that say he could be our starting QB for the next 2-3 years. I would like to see how it plays out over the rest of the season, but right now, he is head and shoulders better than anything we have had in quite some time. He had to shake off some rust those first couple of games, but overall he has been pretty good. If he continues to play well and help us win football games, then why not?
HOUSE Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 I agree with those that say he could be our starting QB for the next 2-3 years. I would like to see how it plays out over the rest of the season, but right now, he is head and shoulders better than anything we have had in quite some time. He had to shake off some rust those first couple of games, but overall he has been pretty good. If he continues to play well and help us win football games, then why not? I will never understand why fans watch a quarterback play very well, then preach doom and gloom down the road. Its not normal..
GA BILLS FAN Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I will never understand why fans watch a quarterback play very well, then preach doom and gloom down the road. Its not normal.. 15 years of watching since Kelly left town, that's why. It's a learned behavior that has been reinforced time and time again. I'm sure a QB will come to town at some point and prove us all wrong, I doubt that's Orton. He's played well, but he is NOT the long term answer.
filthymcnasty08 Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I will never understand why fans watch a quarterback play very well, then preach doom and gloom down the road. Its not normal.. Depression will do that.
BuffaloWings Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I agree with those that say he could be our starting QB for the next 2-3 years. I would like to see how it plays out over the rest of the season, but right now, he is head and shoulders better than anything we have had in quite some time. He had to shake off some rust those first couple of games, but overall he has been pretty good. If he continues to play well and help us win football games, then why not? For the time-being, yes. But he's 31 years old...he may or may not have 2-3 years left in him. We don't know. I think for now, the best thing that can happen is that he keeps playing solidly and EJ keeps learning. If Kyle gets hurt, then (hopefully) EJ is ready.
Storm Front Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) Wasn't Orton in the running for the Heisman at one point during 2004? He was leading an untalented team that year. I think Matt Leinart ended up winning it. Orton has had a lot of bad luck over the last 10 years, kind of like Bills fans! QB's are usually good up until they are about 35-40 years old. I don't see why Orton can't play at peek level for another 3-5 years, especially since he hasn't worn out his arm the last few seasons. Orton may not be like Jim Kelly HOF great, but he may be Joe Ferguson good (much better than average). Edited October 30, 2014 by distortions
Orton's Arm Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 Wasn't Orton in the running for the Heisman at one point during 2004? He was leading an untalented team that year. I think Matt Leinart ended up winning it. Orton has had a lot of bad luck over the last 10 years, kind of like Bills fans! QB's are usually good up until they are about 35-40 years old. I don't see why Orton can't play at peek level for another 3-5 years, especially since he hasn't worn out his arm the last few seasons. Orton may not be like Jim Kelly HOF great, but he may be Joe Ferguson good (much better than average). > Orton may not be like Jim Kelly HOF great, but he may be Joe Ferguson good (much better than average). Orton is already better than Joe Ferguson, and it's not even close. Ferguson was not "much better than average." Even calling Ferguson average would be generous. The scary thing is that Orton is averaging 8.0 yards per pass attempt this season. I call that scary for two reasons: 1) Yards per attempt does not change across eras. If you look at the best few quarterbacks from the '50s, or '60s, or '70s, their career yards per attempt numbers are comparable to those of Brady, Manning, or Brees. Unlike quarterback rating, yards per attempt can be used to meaningfully compare quarterbacks across eras. 2) In Jim Kelly's best season (from a yards per attempt standpoint) he averaged 8.2 yards per attempt. Given that Kelly was throwing to guys like James Lofton and Andre Reed, and playing behind guys like Kent Hull and Jim Ritcher, it's not obvious that Orton's supporting cast is better than Kelly's. Granted, Orton's average yards per attempt will probably fall significantly below 8.0 by the end of the season. But even if it falls to, say, 7.6, that will still be higher than Kelly's career average of 7.4. Am I saying that Orton is Jim Kelly? No. What I am saying is that if Jim Kelly in the prime of his career had been the starting quarterback for the last four games, he wouldn't necessarily have put up better numbers than Orton's. Nor would his play necessarily have looked better from an eyeball test standpoint than Orton's looked.
BmarvB Posted October 30, 2014 Posted October 30, 2014 I like Orton as the caretaker for the position until we can eventually develop our QB of the future. The team is mainly built to win NOW, and Orton is the right QB for right now. It's his position until (or IF) EJ is ready to take over. I don't see that happening anytime soon.
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