boyst Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 (edited) While TJ wasn't Tuel's only target he WAS the only target that was resulting in catastrophic results for Tuel. It started last year in preseason. Tuel would put up accurate, catchable deep passes for TJ, but TJ stopped or didn't realize the ball was coming. Then the KC pick 6, which happened to be targeting TJ. His fumble 6 lost Tuel that game. This year in preseason Tuel made some nice passes to TJ. One was a throw on the run on 3rd & 10 but TJ only ran a 9 yard route. Another was popped off of TJs stone hands for an INT. Perhaps his INT vs Cleveland was not to TJ (actually it was Hogan), but that is the only mistake of Tuel's NFL career that doesn't somehow involve TJ. Remember Jordan Palmer? Every single INT he threw was to TJ. He wasn't even capable of playing DB on those throws. Most of EJs INTs were contested balls to TJ. Russell Wilson was benched and transfered when TJ was his top WR. Without TJ he's a Super Bowl winning franchise QB. Between the losses, INTs and TJs constant fumbles, it could've destroyed Wilson's career had he not transferred. Even this year, TJ vs the Pats, he was awful! (he's not on the team yet still screwing us!) The Jets should have won but TJ was out there falling down on routes. It actually resulted in a botched defensive holding call on one of TJs falls, but that didn't offset all the poor routes and mistakes he made. No catching or route running ability. It's not fair to judge a QB who had to endure the suckiness that is TJ. You sounded great until you shot your credibility in the foot talking about Wilson. He played great football at NCSU and took advantage of the rule that if a player graduates in 4 years while playing all four years they can play a 5th school at a different school, even in a different sport. Greg Paulus did this at Duke, playing basketball then playing football at Syracuse. Coached by then Orange coach Doug Marrone. Edited October 29, 2014 by jboyst62
Kelly the Dog Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 You sounded great until you shot your credibility in the foot talking about Wilson. He played great football at NCSU and took advantage of the rule that if a player graduates in 4 years while playing all four years they can play a 5th school at a different school, even in a different sport. Greg Paulus did this at Duke, playing basketball then playing football at Syracuse. Coached by then Orange coach Doug Marrone. Agree on Wilson with a slight correction. He graduated in four years but he redshirted his freshman year in 2007. So he only played three years at NC State. He could have played his fourth year there but wanted to play baseball, too, and his HC in football wouldn't let him. So he transferred. It wasn't entirely a stupid move by the coach but it was stupid because Wilson was so good. The reasoning was that he was going to miss spring practice again, which the coach didn't want, and he also had Mike Glennon waiting in the wings. Wilson, however, went to Wisconsin and had one of the greatest college seasons of all time.
mountainwampus Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 You sounded great until you shot your credibility in the foot talking about Wilson. He played great football at NCSU and took advantage of the rule that if a player graduates in 4 years while playing all four years they can play a 5th school at a different school, even in a different sport. Greg Paulus did this at Duke, playing basketball then playing football at Syracuse. Coached by then Orange coach Doug Marrone. I see. I guess TJ didn't really slow down Wilson as much as everyone else, but he definitely wasn't helping. Wilson's year at Wisconsin was much better than his TJ years.
boyst Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 I see. I guess TJ didn't really slow down Wilson as much as everyone else, but he definitely wasn't helping. Wilson's year at Wisconsin was much better than his TJ years. Agree on Wilson with a slight correction. He graduated in four years but he redshirted his freshman year in 2007. So he only played three years at NC State. He could have played his fourth year there but wanted to play baseball, too, and his HC in football wouldn't let him. So he transferred. It wasn't entirely a stupid move by the coach but it was stupid because Wilson was so good. The reasoning was that he was going to miss spring practice again, which the coach didn't want, and he also had Mike Glennon waiting in the wings. Wilson, however, went to Wisconsin and had one of the greatest college seasons of all time. we were discussing it in the shoutbox a little. he was given the opportunity to play baseball that Spring and chose to do so and the coach did not agree. He was told Glennon would start that spring - Wilson was not even at camp. Wilson left.
Kelly the Dog Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 (edited) we were discussing it in the shoutbox a little. he was given the opportunity to play baseball that Spring and chose to do so and the coach did not agree. He was told Glennon would start that spring - Wilson was not even at camp. Wilson left. Right. But he would have started and stayed if he would have chose football. It was his decision. O'Brien would have loved to had him be their QB, he just wanted him to play football only. Edited October 29, 2014 by Kelly the Dog
zow2 Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 While TJ wasn't Tuel's only target he WAS the only target that was resulting in catastrophic results for Tuel. It started last year in preseason. Tuel would put up accurate, catchable deep passes for TJ, but TJ stopped or didn't realize the ball was coming. Then the KC pick 6, which happened to be targeting TJ. His fumble 6 lost Tuel that game. This year in preseason Tuel made some nice passes to TJ. One was a throw on the run on 3rd & 10 but TJ only ran a 9 yard route. Another was popped off of TJs stone hands for an INT. Perhaps his INT vs Cleveland was not to TJ (actually it was Hogan), but that is the only mistake of Tuel's NFL career that doesn't somehow involve TJ. Remember Jordan Palmer? Every single INT he threw was to TJ. He wasn't even capable of playing DB on those throws. Most of EJs INTs were contested balls to TJ. Russell Wilson was benched and transfered when TJ was his top WR. Without TJ he's a Super Bowl winning franchise QB. Between the losses, INTs and TJs constant fumbles, it could've destroyed Wilson's career had he not transferred. Even this year, TJ vs the Pats, he was awful! (he's not on the team yet still screwing us!) The Jets should have won but TJ was out there falling down on routes. It actually resulted in a botched defensive holding call on one of TJs falls, but that didn't offset all the poor routes and mistakes he made. No catching or route running ability. It's not fair to judge a QB who had to endure the suckiness that is TJ. That's good stuff. Exactly what i was trying to say but i could not articulate it like this. 99% of any play involving TJ turned to crap. I wish he was brought in by New England. They'd know better though.
Alaska Darin Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 Graham is like Leodis McKelvin of WRs. Virtually no ball awareness whatsoever.
Kelly the Dog Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 Graham is like Leodis McKelvin of WRs. Virtually no ball awareness whatsoever. Graham never shows it unless the ball is right in his hands on the run. McLuvin often looks bad but often looks good, too. The leaping INT was tremendous ball awareness. The second one against the Vikes he made a great break and angle on the ball to catch it right before going OB. The first one he adjusted as he was closing fast when the ball was tipped off the arm of Spikes. Leodis has football brainfarts. TJ lacks football brains.
Alaska Darin Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 Graham never shows it unless the ball is right in his hands on the run. McLuvin often looks bad but often looks good, too. The leaping INT was tremendous ball awareness. The second one against the Vikes he made a great break and angle on the ball to catch it right before going OB. The first one he adjusted as he was closing fast when the ball was tipped off the arm of Spikes. Leodis has football brainfarts. TJ lacks football brains. I think Leodis of today is much better at finding the football than he used to be - he started showing significant improvement last season but that was as much Pettine allowing him to face receivers in a zone and break on the ball. I'm sure I'm not the only person watching the game who saw the ball going towards McKelvin/Graham who thought it had at least a 50/50 shot of harmlessly falling untouched to the turf. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that someone yelled "ball" to get both of them to actually look for it.
eball Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 I think Leodis of today is much better at finding the football than he used to be - he started showing significant improvement last season but that was as much Pettine allowing him to face receivers in a zone and break on the ball. I'm sure I'm not the only person watching the game who saw the ball going towards McKelvin/Graham who thought it had at least a 50/50 shot of harmlessly falling untouched to the turf. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that someone yelled "ball" to get both of them to actually look for it. McCorner's elevation began with the arrival of Donnie Henderson. He's been a different CB since.
Kelly the Dog Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 McCorner's elevation began with the arrival of Donnie Henderson. He's been a different CB since. Yep. But it was also Pettine, and as AD says, playing facing the ball, and finally getting a pass rush so he had time to see the ball. His best season to date is last year, and he's playing his best ball ever now. Agree that Henderson is a very, very good position coach. Whaley and Marrone were smart to not let him go to the Browns.
Alaska Darin Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 McCorner's elevation began with the arrival of Donnie Henderson. He's been a different CB since. Good point.
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 Mccluvin's strength is now ball awareness; bet no one thought that would ever be said about him ever.
Gray Beard Posted October 29, 2014 Posted October 29, 2014 Mccluvin's strength is now ball awareness; bet no one thought that would ever be said about him ever. Oh no. Please don't say that a player may improve even though most people doubted him!The EJ people, the Hackett people, the Pears people (if there are any) will all grasp on to this straw and the woulda, shoulda, coulda arguments will all start over! Unless that is what you are trying to do.
johnwalter Posted October 30, 2014 Author Posted October 30, 2014 Oh no. Please don't say that a player may improve even though most people doubted him! The EJ people, the Hackett people, the Pears people (if there are any) will all grasp on to this straw and the woulda, shoulda, coulda arguments will all start over! Unless that is what you are trying to do. what?
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