A Few Thoughts About The Game, in no particular order.....

[MattM]

Was anyone else furious about the timeout call on our 2nd to last drive after Orton hit Sammy over the middle to get us into Detroit territory? There's no way you shouldn't let the clock keep running there and ensure we are the last to hold the ball. Easily forgotten given all the craziness that ensued afterwards, but we could have had a first down at the Detroit 40 with appx 45 seconds left and instead we call timeout with - 1:18 maybe? - and promptly go 3 and out from there.

 

Oh, yes--Hackett did his best via horrible clock management at the end of the game to give the game away. Thanks God we overcame it. A HS coach wouldn't have given the ball back to the Lions in that situation, much less a pro coach.....

[RuntheDamnBall]

10) Marrone & Manuel's record when trailing by 10 pts or more: 0-10.

Marrone & Orton? 1-0

 

11) did you and many others here miss the 49 PASS ATTEMPTS??

Are those goalposts even still in the stadium at this point?

[CSBill]

Please don't extend spiller the guy just doesn't get it. We better make RB #1 Priority next year.

 

we have Dixon and Brown, time to use them!

[DC Greg]

Good stuff Bill.

 

Orton looked rusty early, then settled down. Already looks like he has been starting all year. Looks like EJ may make it to his 3rd season and be, still, "technically a rookie", eh?

 

Gilmore made an interdeption thrown right to him (and nowhere near the WR that had run by him. Nothing wrong with that. The holding penalty on him was bogus. But otherwise, he was not very good. Leodis had a nice play at the goal line (looked like a fumble to me). Otherwise, the usual--playing 5 yards off a guy catching a 3rd and 9 1st down pass. These guys shouldn't both be starting.

 

CJ is a third testicle at this point. People saying he can "rip off a 30 yarder" or "he can take it to the house at any time" are delusional. It just hasn't panned out that way, ever.

 

Having said that, this OC is still holding this team back, I think. This team has scored 7 offensive TDs in 5 games

 

Maybe with a new QB and a bit more time, his ideas will change. Running Spiller up the middle doesn't soften up the D for the passing game. It just wastes a down. If Fred needs a breather, put in a more physical back for tha play. Also, out FG kicker is the main source of points, still. If the Lions had a comepetent FG kicker, we lose this game.

 

Sammy will leave now doubt why he was picked where he was....

 

Yeah. Totally true... except for that little 100 yard kick return vs. the Dolphins. You know, the one where the Bills offens had sputtered all game and were up 9-7 and the Dolphins had all the momentum... UNTIL Cj Spiller just did something no one else could have done and burned everyone for a TD... something our offense has almost no ability to produce.

 

CJ may never be a "great" running back, but Hackett is not finding good ways to use him. You have to create some space for this guy. I'll talk all day about the need for more screens (like Gailey's O), but let's start w/ a simple solution... how about running him OFF TACKLE instead of inbetween the T-G or CG. Yes, he loves to bounce it. And he is actually good at it... imagine how good it could be if the blocking was actually to be favorable to the aforementioned scenario.

 

Please show me exactly where the holes were that he missed in the blocking schemes on those inside runs. What I saw was Fairly and Suh plugging the gaps and linebackers crashing hard. Nowhere to run inside.

 

All in all, good team win. Just have to contest this hatred.

[Jim in Anchorage]

Agreed. That talk should be confined to a separate thread or left til tomorrow. This was the most thrilling Bills win in a while. Let's enjoy it.

I Agree. I think some of the EJ fans are not pleased with this win. Enjoy the win, the fact the Jets got wooped and NE is about to. Got all week to talk EJ.

[Captain Hindsight]

KO made a few plays to keep us in the game but I'm not confident in him week in and week out. Felt like he was far to conservative at times, especially on third and long.

 

Defense is great. I'll take Schwartz anyday

[The Poojer]

I said he was no better and no worse. I didn't mean to imply EJ would have had the same outcome. I meant that this game was won by defense and a much better kicker, and they won without regard to who was behind center . I brought up Ej because I don't want to hear fans say that Orton is the answer.

 

 

Anyone that says that Orton was "no better than EJ" is really trying too hard to force-twist reality. I was really enjoying this thread until someone tried to sneak that into the conversation.

[thewildrabbit]

Orton is STILL undefeated against the Lions! cheers

[CSBill]

I said he was no better and no worse. I didn't mean to imply EJ would have had the same outcome. I meant that this game was won by defense and a much better kicker, and they won without regard to who was behind center . I brought up Ej because I don't want to hear fans say that Orton is the answer.

 

Bottom line, we all have more confidence and trust in Orton right now. Is he a physically better QB than EJ, probably not. But he is in a better place mentally, and that is exactly what this team needs right now.

[The Poojer]

I'm an EJ supporter and I agree 100%!

 

 

 

Bottom line, we all have more confidence and trust in Orton right now. Is he a physically better QB than EJ, probably not. But he is in a better place mentally, and that is exactly what this team needs right now.

[Bills Fan of St Augustine]

Nice post, Bill.

 

My thoughts on the game, in no particular order.

 

1] Robert Woods tries his ass off, always blocks downfield, works for every yard.

 

2] Dareus best game of his career.

 

3] This is exactly what we want from Orton, the good and the bad. That's the guy he is and that's all we need.

 

4] If EJ throws that pass to Sammy in the last minute and we win, fans say EJ still sucks because he threw a bad pass with a miracle catch.

 

5] It was amazing that with three guys (Hughes, Dareus, Mario) rushing, they bullrushed Stafford on almost every play. As fans, we constantly yell to blitz more, always. Well we never blitzed, I remember one, total, of one player. And yet we got a great rush, seven or so sacks and it won the game. Don't listen to fans.

 

6] That's why you make the Watkins trade. He's a star. It has nothing to do with QB or EJ or next year. For 5-10 years he's going to be a star. There are not a lot of stars.

 

7] Our OL stinks, interior of course.

 

8] Orton's audible on the 2 pt conversion was just brilliant.

 

9] Fred is immortal.

 

10] Marrone, Orton, Spikes, Fred, etc, kept the team focused after being down 14-0 on the road and the team responded well. That may have been the best and most lastly element of this game.

 

11] Carpenter's kick probably would have broken the all-time record in the NFL. It was good from 65.

 

12] Hackett was frustrating for sure, but the run, run, run strategy got some great plays like the TD to Gragg. We had 350 yards. We won the game. I was frustrated to no end, too. But they ultimately did it.

Nice post, but I can't buy into #6. Stars are plentiful in the NFL and you can count on one hand the number of stars selected by their team that cost two #1s. Look at 2011 draft, 12 of top 16 players selected have gone to the Pro Bowl. The teams that traded up struck out. "There were only four first-round trades in 2011. The Jacksonville Jaguars suffered the most. They gave up a second-rounder to move up six spots to acquire Blaine Gabbert, who washed out as a starter and was dumped in a trade to the 49ers this offseason. Missing out on two high draft choices in the rich 2011 draft set back a franchise that heading into last year had one of the thinnest rosters in terms of talent.

The Kansas City Chiefs moved up six spots in the first round to select wide receiver Jon Baldwin in 2011. That didn't work out for the Chiefs, and they ended up dumping him to San Francisco last year for equally disappointing wide receiver A.J. Jenkins.

Toward the bottom of the first round in 2011, the New Orleans Saints gave away a 2012 first-rounder to move up for running back Mark Ingram. The Saints recently decided not to pick up Ingram's fifth-year option."

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/10882006/clayton-mailbag-trading-nfl-draft-worth-risk

Not saying Sammy is a bust, but two #1s is huge for a team still rebuilding (for over a decade!) He needs to be the best WR in football, not just a PB selection to justify two #1s! I hope I eat my words, but I still have a hard time with the logic of trading away the 2015 #1 pick. I really hope it turns out to be north of #30! Nice win today, Go Bills!

[truth on hold]

- Thankfully Robey ran down Tate after the whiff by Williams or in all likelihood game over

 

- Credit McKelvin for being physical with Megatron and getting him out of the game

 

- I noted how we had depth on D last week when Kyle and Nigel went out .... Charles in charge showed why today

 

- Orton showed what an NFL-caliber QB looks like: ran uptempo offense, ball came out fast, tight spirals all over the field, calm when pressured, intensity and leadership

 

- Spiller's problem is that he lacks confidence to run up the middle even when there are at least a couple easy yards because he thinks he can't take on tacklers in the hole -- he's right. But better guard play could change that. He has some faults like most any back, but he's still a contributor and someone who the defense must account for. In all likelihood hes a bill next year (sorry haters)

 

- Carpenter great FA pickup last year -- strong leg, and delivers under pressure

 

- Matt Prater will be out of work for a week, he'll be announced as Lion as early as tomorrow (I predict)

 

- Never seen a catch like Sammy's in Q4. I think he's really spooking DBs. They simply don't know what to make of him, nor how to defend

Edited October 5, 2014 by Joe_the_6_pack

[The Frankish Reich]

Great post as always.

 

Spiller: I think that with Orton in we'll see Hackett start to use him more like Chan used him -- screens, getting the ball in open space, etc. The "we'll run him till he throws up" thing was stupid to begin with. He's not that kind of back. But neither is, say, Darren Sproles, and nobody would say he's useless.

 

Orton: took some huge heat in the first quarter and looked as bad as EJ. But unlike EJ, he didn't get rattled. He stood in there and made some throws. I was thinking about this -- 3 or 4 years ago I thought of him as no better or worse than Alex Smith. The last couple years my stock line has been, "just put Alex Smith on this club and we're a playoff competitor." So .... maybe?

[RuntheDamnBall]

I Agree. I think some of the EJ fans are not pleased with this win. Enjoy the win, the fact the Jets got wooped and NE is about to. Got all week to talk EJ.

Happy with the win. Does the win need to be accompanied with an inflation of the accomplishment, though, especially with "Orton did X thing that EJ would never do?"

 

That's about the size of it.

 

Orton was the beneficiary of 3 missed FGs, threw a pick-6, and drove his team to a pretty damn distant FG range to clinch it. And the Watkins pass was all on Sammy, making a great catch that he was unable to come up with last week on a ball where the QB did not make it easy on him. The Goodwin pass was awesome, though.

 

I hope the guy can take us far, but we are not winning many games like this. Hopefully it's just rust.

[Kelly the Dog]

Nice post, but I can't buy into #6. Stars are plentiful in the NFL and you can count on one hand the number of stars selected by their team that cost two #1s. Look at 2011 draft, 12 of top 16 players selected have gone to the Pro Bowl. The teams that traded up struck out. "There were only four first-round trades in 2011. The Jacksonville Jaguars suffered the most. They gave up a second-rounder to move up six spots to acquire Blaine Gabbert, who washed out as a starter and was dumped in a trade to the 49ers this offseason. Missing out on two high draft choices in the rich 2011 draft set back a franchise that heading into last year had one of the thinnest rosters in terms of talent.

 

The Kansas City Chiefs moved up six spots in the first round to select wide receiver Jon Baldwin in 2011. That didn't work out for the Chiefs, and they ended up dumping him to San Francisco last year for equally disappointing wide receiver A.J. Jenkins.

Toward the bottom of the first round in 2011, the New Orleans Saints gave away a 2012 first-rounder to move up for running back Mark Ingram. The Saints recently decided not to pick up Ingram's fifth-year option."

http://espn.go.com/n...raft-worth-risk

Not saying Sammy is a bust, but two #1s is huge for a team still rebuilding (for over a decade!) He needs to be the best WR in football, not just a PB selection to justify two #1s! I hope I eat my words, but I still have a hard time with the logic of trading away the 2015 #1 pick. I really hope it turns out to be north of #30! Nice win today, Go Bills!

It doesn't matter how you get them, you need them to win. You cannot win without them. It's not easy to find them. Most drafts there are not any surefire stars. Luck was one. But it was clear by most NFL evaluators that Watkins was a can't miss player, and equal to AJ Green and Julio Jones as star players. That's why you make the trade. #1 picks are 50-50. He's 98-2. And he showed it today. We don't win the game without him.

[xsoldier54]

I wish carpenter would have made that first field goal, it looked like he was upset beforehand. I think if calvin johnson and bush had stayed in the game, it would have been a much different game

Coulda woulda shoulda.... blah blah blah, just enjoy the win. They weren't in the game and neither was Kyle Williams. The Bills beat a very good team on the road today, so let's just enjoy it.

 

Happy with the win. Does the win need to be accompanied with an inflation of the accomplishment, though, especially with "Orton did X thing that EJ would never do?"

 

That's about the size of it.

 

Orton was the beneficiary of 3 missed FGs, threw a pick-6, and drove his team to a pretty damn distant FG range to clinch it. And the Watkins pass was all on Sammy, making a great catch that he was unable to come up with last week on a ball where the QB did not make it easy on him. The Goodwin pass was awesome, though.

 

I hope the guy can take us far, but we are not winning many games like this. Hopefully it's just rust.

Did you forget he was playing against the number one defense in the NFL and beat them at home? Was he perfect? No, but he absolutely made the throws when he needed to and enabled the playmakers like Watkins to make plays. He did a good job and there is absolutely zero chance the Bills win this game with E. J. Manuel at QB. I repeat, absolutely zero chance.

[stony]

Great post as always.

 

Spiller: I think that with Orton in we'll see Hackett start to use him more like Chan used him -- screens, getting the ball in open space, etc. The "we'll run him till he throws up" thing was stupid to begin with. He's not that kind of back. But neither is, say, Darren Sproles, and nobody would say he's useless.

 

Orton: took some huge heat in the first quarter and looked as bad as EJ. But unlike EJ, he didn't get rattled. He stood in there and made some throws. I was thinking about this -- 3 or 4 years ago I thought of him as no better or worse than Alex Smith. The last couple years my stock line has been, "just put Alex Smith on this club and we're a playoff competitor." So .... maybe?

 

Not to mention our run-blocking kinda sucks.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

@bill in NYC. Not too sure about Gilmore having a decent game. I thought the Tate TD was one of his worst moments. A guy runs a curl to the end zone and Gilmore is 3 yards from him. He continues to frustrate me.

[Bronc24]

@bill in NYC. Not too sure about Gilmore having a decent game. I thought the Tate TD was one of his worst moments. A guy runs a curl to the end zone and Gilmore is 3 yards from him. He continues to frustrate me.

 

He didn't want to get beat deep.

[Kelly the Dog]

@bill in NYC. Not too sure about Gilmore having a decent game. I thought the Tate TD was one of his worst moments. A guy runs a curl to the end zone and Gilmore is 3 yards from him. He continues to frustrate me.

They gave up seven freakin' points!