C.Biscuit97 Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 Rookie stats mean nothing, as Orton is still in the league after 10 years and EJ will be lucky to see 4 years. EJ has too many deficiencies to be a successful QB. All these other QBs who keep getting brought up as (not as good as EJ in their rookie year) obviously didn't have as many issues as EJ and are still playing. The guys that had lots of issues like EJ are long gone after a couple years. So even though EJ as far superior stats through the same amount of games, he will be out of the league while Orton was able to play for 10 years? How does that make sense? Only Kyle Orton can improve?
SmokinES3 Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 (edited) Rookie stats mean nothing, as Orton is still in the league after 10 years and EJ will be lucky to see 4 years. EJ has too many deficiencies to be a successful QB. All these other QBs who keep getting brought up as (not as good as EJ in their rookie year) obviously didn't have as many issues as EJ and are still playing. The guys that had lots of issues like EJ are long gone after a couple years. Not only that, but winning football games wasn't an issue for the '05 Bears. I know they dropped 3 out of their first 4 (they were stuck with Orton), but then won 8 straight. They won 11 games did they not? Same formula we need. Pound the ball and play excellent defense. Orton had major deficiencies it's true, but he seemed to have a leadership quality that seems to be currently lacking with EJ. Then again, he was benched after an 11-5 season and played sparingly for 2 years. Then went on to have a couple decent seasons stats wise. It has to be recognized that EJ has at least a chance to improve. Edited October 2, 2014 by SmokinES3
boyst Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 Dan Patrick called him the Lion Killer It really is interesting, some of the guys brought in and their experience in and against the NFCN.
Heitz Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 So even though EJ as far superior stats through the same amount of games, he will be out of the league while Orton was able to play for 10 years? How does that make sense? Only Kyle Orton can improve? There are definitely some posters on this board that think so. Not saying EJ will be a 10 year vet, but to say he absolutely won't because he sucks right now is sill silly, IMO...
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 (edited) I think people are turned off by the sound of Collinsworth's voice and just go from there to find other things to not like about him. I think he's good. I don't understand the rub on Colinsworth. I liked him before these comments, and quite frankly, he's usually pretty spot-on in his analyses. Here's hoping that trend continues! Edited October 2, 2014 by Ed_Formerly_of_Roch
The Big Cat Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 (edited) Not only that, but winning football games wasn't an issue for the '05 Bears. I know they dropped 3 out of their first 4 (they were stuck with Orton), but then won 8 straight. They won 11 games did they not? Same formula we need. Pound the ball and play excellent defense. Orton had major deficiencies it's true, but he seemed to have a leadership quality that seems to be currently lacking with EJ. Then again, he was benched after an 11-5 season and played sparingly for 2 years. Then went on to have a couple decent seasons stats wise. It has to be recognized that EJ has at least a chance to improve. Orton played under QB guru Lovie Smith in Chicago and then for the sweat-pants-clad, Tebow-drafting McDaniels in Denver just before McDaniels limped back to Bellichick with his tail between his legs. Take a look at how Cutler soared once Lovie left and took a look at what's happening in Hotlanta right now with Hester to learn just how little we can glean from Orton's early years under Ssmith. As for his time in Denver, that was a pretty bad team. Lest we forget, their inability to stop anything on defense led them to select renowned Prussian General Von Miller one pick before we nabbed Dareus in 2011. I honestly don't think we predict much about how Orton will do with Buffalo's talent given the teams/systems he's been under over his 10 year career. Edited October 2, 2014 by The Big Cat
K-9 Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 His veteran savvy can't be overstated. While I fully accept the fact he's gonna screw the pooch at times, even at critical junctures, I also think he doesn't overlook Sammy on that 3rd and 3 before the Watts pick 6, either. I also think Hackett's modified West Coast passing game and route structures will play to his strengths; he's accurate on intermediate routes and from what I've seen, Hackett's design usually has two targets running open on most downs. GO BILLS!!!
John Adams Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 I think Collinsworth is the best of the guys on the lead commentry teams from the different networks. He is miles better than listening to Troy Aikman. Really? I like Collinsworth but Aikman's ability to break down what's happening on a play is better than any color guy out there. He is the best in the business.
SmokinES3 Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 Orton played under QB guru Lovie Smith in Chicago and then for the sweat-pants-clad, Tebow-drafting McDaniels in Denver just before McDaniels limped back to Bellichick with his tail between his legs. Take a look at how Cutler soared once Lovie left and took a look at what's happening in Hotlanta right now with Hester to learn just how little we can glean from Orton's early years under Ssmith. As for his time in Denver, that was a pretty bad team. Lest we forget, their inability to stop anything on defense led them to select renowned Prussian General Von Miller one pick before we nabbed Dareus in 2011. I honestly don't think we predict much about how Orton will do with Buffalo's talent given the teams/systems he's been under over his 10 year career. Absolutely. He has had a career full of unenviable positions. We can only hope that this level of talent can give him a shot he has yet to have, though as you say, we can't really predict how it will work. Far too many variables. I for one am optimistic, though I realize that is mostly the "next guy" mentality we've become accustomed to as a fan.
Big Gun Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 So even though EJ as far superior stats through the same amount of games, he will be out of the league while Orton was able to play for 10 years? How does that make sense? Only Kyle Orton can improve? Show me a QB that played more than 5 years that has had similar EJ issues.
DougTheBug Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 (edited) how about me? I commented on this board in august before they even signed orton and said bills should pick up orton as he is best free agent available and then 2 weeks later they did. Where is my praise? Edited October 2, 2014 by DougTheBug
Rob's House Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 I don't understand the rub on Colinsworth. I liked him before these comments, and quite frankly, he's usually pretty spot-on in his analyses. Here's hoping that trend continues! Because sometimes he says things that are different from what I think and that means he sucks.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 I like the move. Smart. EJ just was NOT getting it done.
SmokinES3 Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 how about me? I commented on this board in august before they even signed orton and said bills should pick up orton as he is best free agent available and then 2 weeks later they did. Where is my praise? I think anyone who didn't want to marry EJ was aware Orton was the best available option to improve the overall QB talent, if we could get lucky enough to get him.
The Big Cat Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 Show me a QB that played more than 5 years that has had similar EJ issues. Exactly. The "issues" that Orton will have are the "issues" experienced by every quarterback not named Luck, Rodgers or Brees--those being a combination of imperfect arm strength, pocket presence, scrambling and accuracy. The "issues" that were suffocating EJ's production are ones that end careers well before the 10 year mark. I honestly don't know how anyone can argue to the contrary. how about me? I commented on this board in august before they even signed orton and said bills should pick up orton as he is best free agent available and then 2 weeks later they did. Where is my praise? Good job.
DougTheBug Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 no one even mentioned his name but me. He wasn't on anyones radar. it's also easy to say that in hindsight
klos63 Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 I don't understand the rub on Colinsworth. I liked him before these comments, and quite frankly, he's usually pretty spot-on in his analyses. Here's hoping that trend continues! I totally agree with you. He adds quite a bit to the game with his commentary. Most others do not.
The_Real Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 It's a philosophical difference of opinion of where this team is at. I don't think this team is ready to compete for a title. Could Orton be better in the short term, sure but does anyone here really see him leading us to the super bowl? Ej has looked dreadful at times and we are 2-2. Maybe he isn't the answer but pulling the plug on him now we will never know. Orton isn't long term, we have no #1 and now we have to start the whole thing over again searching for the next heir to Jim Kelly. Marrone wants to win now and I get that but is Orton so much better than EJ that you bail now? I just didn't think so. Growing on the job in the nfl isn't easy. No excuses he has to get better but you can't from the sidelines. It feels like we wasted that pick now based on the fact so few of these guys ever make it back after they've been benched. Bills fan so I'll root for Orton to be successful for as long as he's the starter, I just think they gave up too fast on a young Quarterback.
SmokinES3 Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 no one even mentioned his name but me. He wasn't on anyones radar. it's also easy to say that in hindsight Maybe I can only speak for myself. That being said, I recall plenty of available QB's talk, but im not looking it up. So congrats on that good call.
The Big Cat Posted October 2, 2014 Posted October 2, 2014 It's a philosophical difference of opinion of where this team is at. I don't think this team is ready to compete for a title. Could Orton be better in the short term, sure but does anyone here really see him leading us to the super bowl? Ej has looked dreadful at times and we are 2-2. Maybe he isn't the answer but pulling the plug on him now we will never know. Orton isn't long term, we have no #1 and now we have to start the whole thing over again searching for the next heir to Jim Kelly. Marrone wants to win now and I get that but is Orton so much better than EJ that you bail now? I just didn't think so. Growing on the job in the nfl isn't easy. No excuses he has to get better but you can't from the sidelines. It feels like we wasted that pick now based on the fact so few of these guys ever make it back after they've been benched. Bills fan so I'll root for Orton to be successful for as long as he's the starter, I just think they gave up too fast on a young Quarterback. Do you consider 2 years "long term?" Because at 31, I'm thinking that's how long Orton can/may stay at the healm.
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