Dragonborn10 Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 So if Orton does better with the same OC, then who will you blame EJ's failure on? And if Orton is worse?
mdk Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Coaches don't make draft picks. I'm sure he was in favor of EJ but he didn't make the choice. And there were not any better choices. I still would take EJ over Geno and Mike Glennon. Okay, coaches don't make draft picks... let's agree Bills have had a consistently tragic front office. EJ over Geno and Mike Glennon? Maybe. However only EJ was a 1st round reach. With Marketing guru Russ Brandon 'leading the charge', Bills too often go for dramatic picks (against the better judgement of smart football men). Need a "big WR"? Force pick James Hardy. Need a franchise QB? 'Shock the world' and pick EJ (a projected 3rd rounder in the 1st round). Assume EJ (an unproven QB) is 'the man' to get him the ball, move up to get gifted WR Sammy Watkins in exchange for next year's #1 (i.e the future). I, for one, think RB should be fired (or kept FAR away from football operations). Brandon's the only common denominator in the past 14 year playoff-less years.
FireChan Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 (edited) And if Orton is worse? Not to start the Orton excuse train, but Orton won't be playing the same teams EJ has. Especially not the inept Texans. Orton could very well look shaky. However, if Orton has a 250 1 TD 1 Pick or 2 TD 2 Pick day against the Lions and more importantly, gets our WR's finally involved, we can safely assume Hackett is not the issue. The waters do get muddy as we face a team who shut down Cam Newton. Personally, I don't believe Orton could look worse than EJ did on Sunday. His performance was one of the worst I've ever seen. And I think Marrone agrees, which is why he pulled the plug. Edited September 30, 2014 by FireChan
Buffalo Barbarian Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Your love for EJ is unbelievable. Fire an HC for benching him after a horrific game? Good god Biscuit, get it together. CJ stinks. SJ13 had 3 good years with Fitz because he was the only NFL WR on the team those years. You may have more respect going 4-12 with EJ, but I have more respect for Marrone being a man, saying EJ isn't playing well enough, and having the stones to make a change, when he knows it's going to be a media firestorm. ALSO Norv Turner stinks. Like really bad. Ruined a Chargers team that had the most talent on both sides of the ball for 3 years. Shanny has sucked ever since he had a QB not named Elway. Morhinweg actively lost the Jets a game by calling a stupid timeout that he actually couldn't even do. Hackett's greatest fault is what? Getting open receivers that the QB can't hit? :worthy: No more of a joke that you trying to argue every mundane point with people because you're bored. And you're my nomination for worst poster of the year. Congrats! You're a rookie qb. Who would you rather learn under - Nate Hackett or Norv Turner? Really close huh? Hackett didn't ruin EJ, EJ never was that good to begin with.
FireChan Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 :worthy: Hackett didn't ruin EJ, EJ never was that good to begin with. Also funny with the Shanahan point. Does Biscuit know that Shanny singlehandedly crippled RG3 and ruined any chance of him having a career, all in his rookie year? Yeah, get me that guy!
Buffalo Barbarian Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Marrone still has a shot at sainthood.. nothin like a sacrifice to start the story Also funny with the Shanahan point. Does Biscuit know that Shanny singlehandedly crippled RG3 and ruined any chance of him having a career, all in his rookie year? Yeah, get me that guy! To entertain Biscuit, is there any one you would want?
FireChan Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 To entertain Biscuit, is there any one you would want? Arians, because the guy can coach. Not that it'd be hard to coach a rookie like Luck, but Arians took that Indy team over when Pagano was sick. Then Arians went to Arizona and revived their franchise. Really, that's pretty much it though.
Deranged Rhino Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Not to start the Orton excuse train, but Orton won't be playing the same teams EJ has. Especially not the inept Texans. Orton could very well look shaky. However, if Orton has a 250 1 TD 1 Pick or 2 TD 2 Pick day against the Lions and more importantly, gets our WR's finally involved, we can safely assume Hackett is not the issue. The waters do get muddy as we face a team who shut down Cam Newton. Personally, I don't believe Orton could look worse than EJ did on Sunday. His performance was one of the worst I've ever seen. And I think Marrone agrees, which is why he pulled the plug. A Cam Newton who was less than 100% and, outside of the rook, without any receivers of note. I agree with your post, I just think Detroit's D is more vulnerable than that game makes it seem. Their front is nasty, and will make Pears their date for the afternoon, but the Bills can have more talent on the outside than Detroit has capable defensive backs. But you're right. Orton could look shaky because Detroit is better than Texas's defense -- especially against the run.
FireChan Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 (edited) A Cam Newton who was less than 100% and, outside of the rook, without any receivers of note. I agree with your post, I just think Detroit's D is more vulnerable than that game makes it seem. Their front is nasty, and will make Pears their date for the afternoon, but the Bills can have more talent on the outside than Detroit has capable defensive backs. But you're right. Orton could look shaky because Detroit is better than Texas's defense -- especially against the run. Yes, you're right, that Carolina offense isn't a juggernaut. The Steelers blew out the Panthers, and they just got thrown down by Glennon. The NFL is crazy. This game is impossible to pick. Edited September 30, 2014 by FireChan
Buffalo Barbarian Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Arians, because the guy can coach. Not that it'd be hard to coach a rookie like Luck, but Arians took that Indy team over when Pagano was sick. Then Arians went to Arizona and revived their franchise. Really, that's pretty much it though. Loved Arians and is doing great things. He also worked with Payton and Roethlisberger, who I still think misses him. But we aren't getting him so I'd be all for bringing Harbaugh if SF lets him go, also like SF coordinators or an innovative person similar to Chip Kelly.
BuffaninATL Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 I want him fired for bailing on the guy he selected after less than 16 starts. Why should we ever trust him to draft and develop a qb again? why the metric of 16 games ? is that a magic # ? .... look at Bridgewater Sunday, it's not magic. Either you have it or you don't. Would you be OK with watching more games like Sunday's, an eminently winning game that we should have won going away with AVERAGE QB play ?
BuffaninATL Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Not this time. I believe that there is enough talent on this team to justify this move. Further, Orton should prove to be more than a capable qb that allows the other talent to win games for us. EJ is losing games for us and not allowing the talent to carry the day. Our next 300 yard passer will be Orton. And for giggles and all of this to be true, we have to beat the Lions and I will predict the D or talent other than the qb will be the reason we win. Capable qb that allows others to do their jobs. I endorse this move and I support EJ. I don't know what he learns being the back up, but we cant afford more of his game right now. Getting guys hurt with his throw, killing us with int's etc. Exactly.....and give Marrone credit for recognizing that he has talent (young & veteran) who don't deserve to have their efforts squandered due to one player's inadequacies. He would have lost the room had he continued to let the ship sink with EJ.
papazoid Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Marrone's future will be decided after the season.....by the new GM.
Chandler#81 Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 There certainly was more to his benching: A player revotl! Most obvious the receivers were blatantly (unprofessionally) showing their frustration with his erratic passes. Everyone in the organization is well aware that Orton is a pedestrian qb, a backup at best. And everyone knows that at this point he gives the team a better chance to win than the confused young qb he is replacing. Evidently, not everybody..
Wayne Cubed Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Biscuit, I think you are letting your emotions get the better of you here. I will admit I was a bit shocked because I thought he would give EJ another week, but the AFC East is ripe for the taking. Think of it this way, if Marrone stays with EJ and he continues to play poorly, which I'm not saying would definitely happen, Marrone would most likely lose his job anyways. And the next HC certainly isn't going to go with EJ, who isn't his guy. By putting Orton in and hopefully righting the ship he is actually giving EJ more time to develop, if thats possible. EJ was always going to be a project and if he can stay positive, maybe this could be the best thing for him. I'm a fan of the Bills first, not the players. I like EJ and was always hoping he could turn it around or improve or would be the "the guy". And I was always in the he needs time to show what he can do and give him time camp. The problem is this team is absolutely loaded with talent. The defense is playing pretty much lights out. Like I said earlier, the AFC East is there for the taking. The Bills just need competent QB play and the first 2 weeks EJ gave them that but then he he regressed against San Diego. I didn't think he could play any worse than he did in that game, but then he did just that, played even worse against Houston. Think of it this way, if Sammy Watkins dropped 8 passes against San Diego, then went out and dropped 16 against Houston, you don't think Marrone should maybe question whether Sammy is ready?
Big Gun Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Marrone is not getting fired. He has turned this roster into a competitive respectable team regardless of how EJ has played. That in itself is a major accomplishment compared to years past. Marrone has righted the ship and it is setting sail for the top of the heap, so yeah let's fire the best coach the Bills have had in 15 years, makes sense to me. He is also calls it like it is and doesn't seem to play favorites, the best players play period, I can 100% respect that.
8-8 Forever? Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 There's no way he wasn't 100% on board with EJ. And if he wasn't, he should have pushed more for other qb options. He was. they wanted Orton a year ago after Kolb went down. Orton got out of Dallas but Bills had to wait til August to avoid giving him starter money.. you guys always forget the business end of this stuff. They got the guy they wanted at a price they were willing to pay. Now they get to execute the QB approach they wanted to do last year. Let EJ sit behind a Vet for a year or two, work on his mechanics and learn the speed of the game. I bet they intended to do this all along. If they had gotten Orton in June, he'd have started the season. So they had to go with EJ for 4 games while Orton caught up. EJ went 2-2 so all good. Now Plan A goes into effect, a month later than they wanted. I like Waley/Marrone, they are more than will ing to shake things up. Too bad they all get fired at year end when Pegs cleans house. Yes, you're right, that Carolina offense isn't a juggernaut. The Steelers blew out the Panthers, and they just got thrown down by Glennon. The NFL is crazy. This game is impossible to pick. its all about turnovers and short fields on offense. get those, you win, don't get those and the other guy does you lose. from scrimmage, the teams in the NFL are pretty much equal, other than the few with HOF QBs or all world defenses. so its all about turnovers and injuries. turnovers lose games, injuries (if serious and numerous) lose seasons. picking games is a worthless exercise because you cannot forecast turnovers. Marrone's future will be decided after the season.....by the new GM. Correct. all of this discussion is nonsense, because barring a 10+ win season (not going to happen), Pegs cleans house and we start all over again. Great , huh. Another 3 years of suckiness while yet another coaching staff puts their stuff in.
thewildrabbit Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 Marrone is not getting fired. He has turned this roster into a competitive respectable team regardless of how EJ has played. That in itself is a major accomplishment compared to years past. Marrone has righted the ship and it is setting sail for the top of the heap, so yeah let's fire the best coach the Bills have had in 15 years, makes sense to me. He is also calls it like it is and doesn't seem to play favorites, the best players play period, I can 100% respect that. Whoa, are we both watching the same team? While I agree with the OP about firing this staff of clowns. I think it goes much further then just benching the 2nd year QB who hasn't even played a full 16 games yet. How about the fact that the HC is a supposed O line guru that has no clue as to what a talented OG looks like. Last season Colin Brown got the start at LG, and was cut after 6 games. This year its Chris Williams and his bad back, and Pears moves from RT to RG, and both OG positions have been a comedy of errors. The QB situation last year as the team kept 3 rookies on the roster, and no seasoned vet. No QB coach, and no senior NFL assistant to help out the first year OC. Now that OC is in his second year, and he is sucking worse then EJ. He should have kept the simplified offensive game plan and kept running the ball. Only now without better play at the OG position he can't do that this year. This coaching staff is a joke, and WR Mike Williams stated that the teams WR's prepared all week to see "off" & zone coverage and Houston's secondary was previously letting receivers catch balls underneath, and then try and strip the ball to get a turnover. The Bills didn't change up the offense until late in the second half when the Bills OC finally realized they were in "press man" coverage. Williams words, we got the calls for off coverage and zone, and when they are playing man it tends not to work. Unreal! Seriously, the Bills coaches didn't even make that adjustment at half time? http://www.buffalobills.com/video/videos/Mike_Williams_We_Adjusted_a_Little_Too_Late/2229d307-9410-4b01-bdbb-c911b4607d09 I can't wait until October when Pegs takes over, and looks at the mess he paid 1.4 Billion dollars for.Things will change. The Bills need a viable NFL experienced offensive coordinator, and one who actually knows how to build a winning offense.
Mr. WEO Posted September 30, 2014 Posted September 30, 2014 They want him to fire a coach and he didn't so he quit. We went from 9-7 to 6-10 and he mangled the qb situation. He should have been fired. He was fired, no, wait, he quit. And they went 5-11 after 9-7. He hardly "mangled" the QB situation. He did play JP for half the season or so. JP absolutely sucked. He proved to be a hopeless 1st round reach. Mularkey realized this early on, as did many of us here.
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