Big Gun Posted September 23, 2014 Posted September 23, 2014 Chandler likely ran an improvised route as the play was busted when Woods was taken away. EJ also appeared to have the ability to run on the play and slide for a few yards. Doubt it but keep trying with the EJ excuses, maybe one of these days they will work.
Dorkington Posted September 23, 2014 Posted September 23, 2014 No excuse, EJ needs to see things like this better. On that play he was looking at the defender, and his dump off, and that's it. He needs to be aware of what else is going on around the field.
YoloinOhio Posted September 23, 2014 Author Posted September 23, 2014 At the end of the day we ran 22 times and EJ passed 44 times. That is the opposite of the Bills formula to win this year. Yes, every team will try to take away the run. That is easier to do when the Bills are playing from behind. All 3 phases need to get better in execution.
Prickly Pete Posted September 23, 2014 Posted September 23, 2014 (edited) The more experience EJM gets against a variety of defense's, the better he should get. It's all part of learning the job. Edited September 24, 2014 by HoF Watkins
ko12010 Posted September 23, 2014 Posted September 23, 2014 I don't want to speak for Wiz, but I've noticed it happening a lot on the all-22s as well. It might mean nothing, probably does, but the fear is that it's a sign EJ has lost the confidence of his playmakers. They see he's not making the right reads and are reacting. Thanks for the clarification. I just watched it. I've seen players do that before and I don't necessarily think it was a shot at EJ, more like Chandler knew he was wide open and his QB missed him and he's just trying to keep himself psyched up and ready to get open on the next play.
Deranged Rhino Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 ironic reaction from Chandler, who instills confidence in no one. :lol: Chandler likely ran an improvised route as the play was busted when Woods was taken away. EJ also appeared to have the ability to run on the play and slide for a few yards. It's impossible to make that determination without knowing the play called. That's the one thing the all-22 doesn't show -- unless you track enough game tape to know the play calls. Which, I don't. Though maybe I should... I'm certain the results would be hilariously inaccurate. Thanks for the clarification. I just watched it. I've seen players do that before and I don't necessarily think it was a shot at EJ, more like Chandler knew he was wide open and his QB missed him and he's just trying to keep himself psyched up and ready to get open on the next play. Absolutely. I'm not saying that's what I believe either. I'm not going to pretend to know what the players are thinking based on that, the only alarming thing for me is the amount of times I've seen it happen in just 3 games. That said, it's just 3 games and EJ's still learning (clearly) so we'll see if it continues.
The Wiz Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 (edited) What some idiots on TBD would call "awful" I would call a learning experience. There are nuansances to playing the postion. I'm sure Chandler liked EJ hitting him on the scramble, dump & go. So it's not as bad as the hypochondriacs like you would like to believe. Any receiver will get in his QBs face and tell him this. I'd like to see EJ learn from this and hit Chandler if it is defended similarly in the future. If you have seen any of my posts(that weren't sarcastic) you would know I'm not a hypochondriac as you claim. It's just disheartening. Thanks for calling me an idiot though. Edited September 24, 2014 by The Wiz
DirtDart Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 The more experience EJM get against a variety of defense's the better he should get. It's all part of learning the job. This
QCity Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 Here are 5 Vines from the last game that highlight his accuracy issues. In each clip the OL holds up nicely and gives him time to throw. He stands tall in the pocket, makes the correct reads, finds the open man, and then....then....he just misfires. His inconsistent play didn't just start last week either. I can excuse a young QB for not picking up a blitz, for not seeing an open receiver, or for not reading a coverage correctly. But when you do all the aforementioned correctly and simply can't throw a football accurately, well I'm just not sure that's an easily correctable part of a QB's skill set. https://vine.co/u/1126081375733444608
Gugny Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 (edited) Am I missing something, or is no one holding the piss-poor play of the O-line the least bit culpable for the pressure Manuel got? Edited September 24, 2014 by Gugny
YoloinOhio Posted September 24, 2014 Author Posted September 24, 2014 @BuffRumblings: Here's a GIF of Cordy Glenn getting smoked. He gets a little caught up with Spiller, but he had a BAD game. http://t.co/jzjFMTXYJh
The Wiz Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 Am I missing something, or is no one holding the piss-poor play of the O-line the least bit culpable for the pressure Manuel got? That only matters if EJ looks good and the running game sucks.
ko12010 Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 What a great analysis. It's interesting that EJ's biggest issues right now are not mechanical, as so many posters like to parrot. EJ's actually pretty damn good at evading initial pressure in his face, but like Joe B concluded, he panics once he successfully evades it--which sucks. He did the truly hard part and then doesn't make the defense pay they way QB's like Peyton, Rodgers, and Big Ben do. I don't know why so many Bills fans are up in arms over EJ. I see a lot of good stuff and his issues here (field awareness, decision making, accuracy) are things that will very likely improve with simple experience. I'm actually encouraged by this. If EJ"s accuracy issues were a result of just mechanics from a clean pocket I'd be worried. But this is the game still being too fast at times for him. The only way it'll slow down is to keep playing and keep getting these situations. Teams will likely start using this game plan that TB and SD used to rattle him, and you know what? He'll start learning how to beat it.
Prickly Pete Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 I also think that the OC (who I have supported) should have some plays to counter the stunts that the SD defense was running.
3rdand12 Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 I don't want to speak for Wiz, but I've noticed it happening a lot on the all-22s as well. It might mean nothing, probably does, but the fear is that it's a sign EJ has lost the confidence of his playmakers. They see he's not making the right reads and are reacting. I thought you would be more reasonable about reaching this conclusion. So possibly you are being sarcastic. But after the Goodwin episode even I had alligator arms . @BuffRumblings: Here's a GIF of Cordy Glenn getting smoked. He gets a little caught up with Spiller, but he had a BAD game. http://t.co/jzjFMTXYJh One play right ? ps I thought we were still pissed of at the Guards ! wtf . now my man Cordy ? Really ? Implosion has officially occurred shame.
Prickly Pete Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 What a great analysis. It's interesting that EJ's biggest issues right now are not mechanical, as so many posters like to parrot. EJ's actually pretty damn good at evading initial pressure in his face, but like Joe B concluded, he panics once he successfully evades it--which sucks. He did the truly hard part and then doesn't make the defense pay they way QB's like Peyton, Rodgers, and Big Ben do. I don't know why so many Bills fans are up in arms over EJ. I see a lot of good stuff and his issues here (field awareness, decision making, accuracy) are things that will very likely improve with simple experience. I'm actually encouraged by this. If EJ"s accuracy issues were a result of just mechanics from a clean pocket I'd be worried. But this is the game still being too fast at times for him. The only way it'll slow down is to keep playing and keep getting these situations. Teams will likely start using this game plan that TB and SD used to rattle him, and you know what? He'll start learning how to beat it. Me too. Rivers, Manning Brady, Brees...these guys have run the plays so often that they can quickly evaluate who is going to be open. They get a feel for different coverages against a given play. I hope a bunch of teams run this type of attack against the Bills. Then we can see if EJM starts making progress. If not, then we can move on.
The Wiz Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 I don't want to speak for Wiz, but I've noticed it happening a lot on the all-22s as well. It might mean nothing, probably does, but the fear is that it's a sign EJ has lost the confidence of his playmakers. They see he's not making the right reads and are reacting. Speak for Wiz all you want but I'm The Wiz. And no, not what I meant. Me too. Rivers, Manning Brady, Brees...these guys have run the plays so often that they can quickly evaluate who is going to be open. They get a feel for different coverages against a given play. I hope a bunch of teams run this type of attack against the Bills. Then we can see if EJM starts making progress. If not, then we can move on. Give him 5+ years, at least in Rivers' case.
ko12010 Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 Me too. Rivers, Manning Brady, Brees...these guys have run the plays so often that they can quickly evaluate who is going to be open. They get a feel for different coverages against a given play. I hope a bunch of teams run this type of attack against the Bills. Then we can see if EJM starts making progress. If not, then we can move on. Exactly. I just don't know what people expect. Really none of the anger should be directed at EJ because he's actually on a solid pace of progression. It didn't click for guys like Drew Brees till 30+ starts and now he's one of the best ever. If you want to be pissed, be pissed at Whaley (who I personally think is doing very well and I hope he's our GM for years and years) for not trading for or somehow picking up a veteran option to start at QB while EJ learns. But this team is in a tough spot--we have a playoff caliber roster but have a young QB who needs experience. He's not going to get better without playing, but a guy like Orton has seen pretty much everything a defense can bring at you and so is likely a better candidate for the team to win now. But EJ could develop into a Big Ben type QB...which will set this team up for a decade plus. He'll only get there by playing and taking his lumps.
3rdand12 Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 I also think that the OC (who I have supported) should have some plays to counter the stunts that the SD defense was running. note to self... counter stunts . "Thats two from TBD now right Doug ? " " yep Nate thats two great suggestions from the hardcore fans . Lot to learn there . How about we work on that a little bit with Coach Morris on Tuesday ". " Oh wait Wednesday i meant, obviously. we are not practicing Tuesday " " Jim ! Hey JIm are we practicing on Tuesday do you know ? " Jim responds " ..... " Doug W " wtf did he say ? " Doug M " i have not understood one thing he has said since he got here. seems like he is fitting pretty good though " Doug W " hey Nate ! any thought about getting these two guys Spiller and Watkins in some open space ?" Nate " we are just now looking into that Sir. Another TBD members suggestion i should mention Mr Marrone " GOBILLS!
Deranged Rhino Posted September 24, 2014 Posted September 24, 2014 (edited) Am I missing something, or is no one holding the piss-poor play of the O-line the least bit culpable for the pressure Manuel got? There were a few posters in another thread, immediately after the game ended, claiming the line was actually okay. They were in the minority, but they were out there. Most people who watched the game, and anyone who's seen the all-22, knows the line played terribly, especially the middle. Most who point that out are accused of covering for EJ's poor play because that's all anyone really wants to talk about. Truth is, EJ sucked out loud and so did the line. They did each other no favors and were the primary reasons the Bills couldn't answer. Speak for Wiz all you want but I'm The Wiz. And no, not what I meant. Then my apologies. Edited September 24, 2014 by GreggyT
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