Buffaloed in Pa Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Kelly burned quite a few people in Buffalo.When he tried his hand at business.Short memories Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Kelly doesn't have the money to buy the Bills. He's apparently teamed with Gundlach who also doesn't have the money. Now they have talked with JBJ who also doesn't have the money. The groups are looking for ways to put together a team that: Has enough money. Can satisfy the Trust on non-relocation. Can get NFL approval. Could we see a "Super Group" emerge to challenge Pegula? Wouldn't shock me in the least. It was always the case that Kelly doesn't have the money for this. But he was intially partnered with Gundlach. The Dean didn't understand my question, hence his "petulant" response. Gundlach is a billionaire who's 50 billion fund has been killing the bond market for years. Not sure why he wouldn't have the money to buy the team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 (edited) It was always the case that Kelly doesn't have the money for this. But he was intially partnered with Gundlach. The Dean didn't understand my question, hence his "petulant" response. Gundlach is a billionaire who's 50 billion fund has been killing the bond market for years. Not sure why he wouldn't have the money to buy the team Not enough liquidity, aka cold hard cash, in his portfolio to satisfy NFL ownership requirements. Edited August 17, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevie Ray Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Kelly doesn't have the money to buy the Bills. He's apparently teamed with Gundlach who also doesn't have the money. Now they have talked with JBJ who also doesn't have the money. The groups are looking for ways to put together a team that: Has enough money. Can satisfy the Trust on non-relocation. Can get NFL approval. Could we see a "Super Group" emerge to challenge Pegula? Wouldn't shock me in the least. Probably not the kind of organizational structure the Trust or the NFL would want to see in place. The JBJ/Toronto group is apparently already disorganized as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Best Player Available Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 It was always the case that Kelly doesn't have the money for this. But he was intially partnered with Gundlach. The Dean didn't understand my question, hence his "petulant" response. Gundlach is a billionaire who's 50 billion fund has been killing the bond market for years. Not sure why he wouldn't have the money to buy the team Because he doesn't. A blowhard with a net worth of around one billion. and in some circles his bond funded is not even rated. Google is your friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 If we are stuck with the kellys with final say In all football decisions, just move to toronto. Endorse pegula. Close the deal. And be set up with acknowledgement and jobs for life. Pegula gave andrew peters a job for God's sake Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stony Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 When is the last time that Tim Graham had a named source on record? Why would he if he ever wants info again? You don't blow your sources identity. FWIW, I think TG is spot on in most cases with his info. A lot of thin skinned people don't like his interactions on Twitter and what not, but he's no dummy looking for clicks as some point out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Does that fit your narrative too, John? Against Pegula = For Bon Jovi? Much of the business community = Everybody in Buffalo? I guess when it's dumbed down like that, Terry's the only option. It's clear to me that Tim's crusading for Pegula, especially when he attempts to smear Kelly with this article. I've got a third party candidate running a clean campaign on the Independence Party ticket. I don't want to say his name, for fear that Tim Graham will try to link him to Bon Jovi. I'm not sure here, but you will admit you are Anti-Pegula, right? The entirety of your being seems to be Anti-Pegula. I might suspect you were a shill poster for another group, or someone who has a personal grudge with Terry. Just own it: You are Anti-Pegula! Say it proud. And while you might not support JBJ if it suits your Anti-Pegula agenda you'll fan a flame or two in support. Wrong again. There have been several threads started here going back to April about Kelly's desire to align with a group, or that he has, in fact, already done so. That's why I asked. It was a simple question, the Dean. Since Kelly was already partnered with someone, that's why I asked it. My bad, I didn't think you were so behind in what's gone on in the process. It's been well-known Kelly and Gundlach were looking to join a group and didn't have the $$ to buy the team by themselves. I made a mistake in assuming you were making your usual type of appearance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zonabb Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Kelly burned quite a few people in Buffalo.When he tried his hand at business.Short memories Wait.... Kelly did personally or his company did? Kelly did what every business owner with a failing business does... files for bankruptcy, as is the company's right. Corporations were created, for better or worse, to provide liability protection to its owners, both financially and legally. It's not short memories, it's the ignorant idea that people seem to harbor that because he was a millionaire, he is supposed to ignore the rights he has a a business owner and pay the losses from his own pocket. Would that have been noble, sure. But everyone from Trump to local guys hailed as superheroes in this town for "risking" money and profit on downtown projects (no risk when you've got millions in govt handouts) file for bankruptcy. It's the incentive that people use to try out a business. Remember, a dolt once said that "corporations are people too".... which means they get to have their cake and eat it to, just as Kelly did. It's laughable to blame someone for playing by the rules. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Yatta,yatta,yatta. Right,OK,Got it. Ha. Keep telling yourself that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zonabb Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Why would he if he ever wants info again? You don't blow your sources identity. FWIW, I think TG is spot on in most cases with his info. A lot of thin skinned people don't like his interactions on Twitter and what not, but he's no dummy looking for clicks as some point out. I think the point is, using anonymous sources only serves TG to get "reports" out because each new "source" conflicts the last and when taken as a whole, none of what he has "reported" makes any logical sense. So he may have a ton of sources, as he should, but he's only upping his page clicks on twitter and filling his weekly story quota with no regard to how his entire stream of work on the topic is a giant disjointed, dead-end narrative with little reality. Media has devolved into reporting quantity rather than quality and the incessant use of unnamed sources fills the needs of the media for stories and the info named sources want to get on the street. The loser in all this are those that actually think what these people are saying matters in the end. Saw something yesterday that TG patted himself on the back over a Joe Mesi story he reported years ago... is that the last thing his guy has to hold up as evidence that info he "broke" was in fact true. Maybe in the end, when this all comes to a conclusion, someone should go back and "report" how much of his work, or any of them for that matter, was correct or could be corroborated. Very little will be the answer. Yatta,yatta,yatta. Right,OK,Got it. Ha. Keep telling yourself that. That's the reply when you have no logical, reasoned, intelligent response to what is fact. If you think he should have paid back his creditors out of his own packet, which I think is your position, say it. And then realize that what you think he should do and what his legal rights are make your position the one that doesn't matter. You want to hold it against him, that's your right, but no crime was committed and no lines were overstepped so I guess just your feelings are hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extrahammer Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Tim Graham is accurate in his reporting. Of course, I'm just a lowly message board poster, but I would guess Dan has been leading the efforts in this game since Jim has been recovering. They've been reaching out to LOTS of folks, folks they don't even know firsthand, including a lot of people who consider themselves "movers and shakers" (i.e. can't really help $$$-wise but want to be in the center of it), which could be leading to more misinformation. I would guess they've been reaching out to folks to drum up cash to try to attach their group to the potential leading bidder. I would also guess they've reached out to all major bidders, Trump, Pegula, etc. Pegula could easily tell them "Nope, I want all teh controlz!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple haze Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 When is the last time that Tim Graham had a named source on record? Not many reporters have a named source on record. If they do, they probably don't have the entire story. People are not going to give info and out themselves as the leak in the newspaper while the story is playing out. Been that way since before Woodward and Bernstein. They had a "source" too. I've been critical of Tim Graham over the years, but it does him no favors, as a journalist, to make up a story. I don't doubt his story because it makes sense. He didn't say Bon Jovi and Kelly WERE doing anything except talking. And even with that Bon Jovi initiated it. Folks need to calm down a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 That's the reply when you have no logical, reasoned, intelligent response to what is fact. If you think he should have paid back his creditors out of his own packet, which I think is your position, say it. And then realize that what you think he should do and what his legal rights are make your position the one that doesn't matter. You want to hold it against him, that's your right, but no crime was committed and no lines were overstepped so I guess just your feelings are hurt. I really have no idea what happened with Kelly's business other than the reports a lot of people got stuck with unpaid bills. IMO, it depends on how the deals went down, whether he ran the company with integrity and did what he could to have the business make restitution. Just because something is legal, doesn't make it the right thing to do. And just because someone has the legal protection of a corporation, doesn't make it OK to engage in questionable business decisions. BTW, I am NOT accusing Kelly of doing this, as I said I have no idea. But in general "it's just business", "I didn't do anything illegal" can get old when it seems those making the business decisions for those failing companies remain unhurt--often repeating the process on many occasions. Again, this is noting necessarily against Kelly. But I wouldn't simply apply the "it's a business" logic to dismiss any personal culpability. And, Buffaloed in Pa, it's "yadda, yadda..." Oy vey! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
purple haze Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 (edited) None of us broke this news. That was Tim Graham. I have yet to hear how what Graham reported was GOOD NEWS in any way, shape, or form. Also, you sound a lot like Seattle Supersonics fans sounded. The guy who sold them to businessmen from OKC, along with the mayor of OKC came out and said that any talk of them moving was CRAZY! Schultz even said he sold them to that particular group because he believed they would not move the team. There was a lease with restrictions on moving. So pardon me for not feeling all warm and cozy. IF Rogers and MLSE are the major financial investors in this team it WILL be moved to Toronto as soon as they can accomplish that. Maybe it takes until the lease expires. They need to build a stadium anyway, and there's always the Toronto Series to give them a game a year until the big move. The report was just news. The Pegula's still are the best ownership choice based on finances, method of operation and NFL desires about ownership in regards to the first two items. That's clear. I wish folks would stop CHOOSING to worry about the TO group. I don't like the TO group either and I believe they are done. Too much chaos. What's strange is that not many seem to be mentioning the Beignini report about Kelly having discussions with Golisano. That is a more likely scenario. Less of a "group" in that scenario. One majority owner and one minority owner and Golisano gets Kelly's cachet with the community/trust. THAT pairing could compete with the Pegula's, although I still don't think they would win. Kelly and three other owner principals in the TO group would be more of a mess than they already have. Edited August 17, 2014 by purple haze Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buffaloed in Pa Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 Thanks Deano. For clearing that up. What would we do without you ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted August 17, 2014 Share Posted August 17, 2014 The report was just news. The Pegula's still are the best ownership choice based on finances, method of operation and NFL desires about ownership in regards to the first two items. That's clear. I wish folks would stop CHOOSING to worry about the TO group. I don't like the TO group either and I believe they are done. Too much chaos. What's strange is that not many seem to be mentioning the Beignini report about Kelly having discussions with Golisano. That is a more likely scenario. Less of a "group" in that scenario. One majority owner and one minority owner and Golisano gets Kelly's cachet with the community/trust. THAT pairing could compete with the Pegula's, although I still don't think they would win. Kelly and three other owner principals in the TO group would be more of a mess than they already have. Exactly. Another Buffalo-centric group to compete. I'm sure that helps The Trust, too as it should result in an honest price, Still that's far from confirmed and unlikely to win if it happens. Thanks Deano. For clearing that up. What would we do without you ? Hey, I do what I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 (edited) Tim Graham @ByTimGraham 3m Source close to Jim Kelly and Jeffrey Gundlach tell me JK met w/Bon Jovi face-to-face in Buffalo last wk to discuss teaming up, but no deal. Tim Graham @ByTimGraham 3m Source: "Kelly and Gundlach do not feel confident that their aspirations for keeping the Bills in Buffalo long-term are aligned ..." (1/2) Tim Graham @ByTimGraham 3m "... with the interests of the Toronto group." Story coming soon. (2/2) Antsy Bon Jovi indeed reaches out to Jim Kelly on Bills bid, shedding more uncertainty on fate of beleaguered Toronto group: http://blogs.canoe.c...-toronto-group/ Edited August 18, 2014 by 26CornerBlitz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/bills-nfl/jim-kelly-decides-against-partnering-with-bon-jovi-in-attempt-to-buy-the-bills-20140817?ywo-bills-drive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canadian Bills Fan Posted August 18, 2014 Share Posted August 18, 2014 I love Jim Kelly, but a lot of former stars make terrible coaches and front office guys. Not sure I would want him (and his bro) to be GM for life. Maybe he can follow in the steps of John Elway CBF Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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