Mr. WEO Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 In other words, you don't know, but you're still completely willing to pretend you do. Take a step closer to the page. I said this scenario is conceivable. Many others in and out of TSW have ventured the same. In fact, I would bet my own money that the DA is wondering the same thing (he is paid to, actually), hence the ongoing investigation as opposed to a case closed tragedy.
Dorkington Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 But I have said all along that it's conceivable that Stewart saw this kid show boating and figured he would send him an "F-you punk" close shave with his car. It's entirely consistent with his personality on the track. No one should believe he wanted to "murder" this dumb kid. Seems reasonable to me... but if that's the case, he should be in jail, for a long time.
ExiledInIllinois Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 dear lord.... from the angle we got, and with the camera following the car before -- its hard to say anything definitive on the topic. to say it was unavoidable based on what we have seems as crazy as to say it was obviously stewart being a jerk on purpose (and things getting out of hand). you seem to be the only one that doesnt see EVERYBODY agrees that the kid shouldnt have been running down the track. its not discussed because we all acknowledge its true. Thats not to say, however, that no matter what happened once he hopped out of the car is fair game.... that part is hazier from what is known. I know. End of story then. The kid is dead, cry for him, eulogize him (the best they can), bury him and move on. Sorry to sound like Richard, but he was the number one cause of the accident. Why is this even being discussed? My guess is we all can't let go and have to find other excuses or people to blame for the unsavory cause of this. I understand, it is hard for the family when somebody makes a totally preventable mistake. How do they rally around that? He held the number one card in his death. That's a tough pill for the living to accept. As a parent, I hope I never have to deal with that situation... I am not sure how I would handle it. Fight to blame others or just accept it as it is? If people could only have opinions about things they've actually experienced first hand, you'd have a message board full of crickets. Really? You really believe this? I disagree totally. How many times in your life that you made stupid judgement calls like Ward did and almost bite it? For me that's what this argument boils down to. We all got way too much time on our hands... ;-P ;-P
BuffaloBillsForever Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 (edited) There is a whole lotta derp in this thread. All the blame resides on Ward anyone looking to blame anyone else for this incident is either IMO Dumb One of those conspiracy theorists Going on a witch hunt There really shouldn't be any argument about this. The guy got out of race car and confronted a driver during the race ON THE TRACK. This is the result of ones stupdity and nothing/nobody else. Sorry to be so blunt but the fact that there is even a debate about this is ridiculous. Edited August 11, 2014 by BuffaloBillsForever
DC Tom Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 There is a whole lotta derp in this thread. All the blame resides on Ward anyone looking to blame anyone else for this incident is either IMO Dumb One of those conspiracy theorists Going on a witch hunt There really shouldn't be any argument about this. The guy got out of race car and confronted a driver during the race ON THE TRACK. This is the result of ones stupdity and nothing/nobody else. Sorry to be so blunt but the fact that there is even a debate about this is ridiculous. If any driver other than Stewart had been involved, there wouldn't be any argument. The only reason there is any argument is because Stewart has a reputation of being rather hot-headed and aggressive...which is what provides room for reasonable speculation. The real problem in this thread is that quite a bit of the speculation is unreasonable, because people are unwilling to admit that they simply don't know what they don't know. We know Ward got out of his car, we know he approached Stewart's moving car, we know he got sucked under the right rear wheel and killed. We DON'T know what Stewart was thinking, how the car was handling (or should handle - it's not a goddamn Ford Focus), what he saw, how much time he had to react...speculation on such is just that - speculation. Not entirely baseless, but not well-founded either. The idiots indulging it as fact (and yes, Mr. WEO, I'm talking about you) should stop indulging it as fact and treat it as the unfounded speculation it is.
Mr. WEO Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 There is a whole lotta derp in this thread. All the blame resides on Ward anyone looking to blame anyone else for this incident is either IMO Dumb One of those conspiracy theorists Going on a witch hunt There really shouldn't be any argument about this. The guy got out of race car and confronted a driver during the race ON THE TRACK. This is the result of ones stupdity and nothing/nobody else. Sorry to be so blunt but the fact that there is even a debate about this is ridiculous. You should get over to the Ontario County Sheriff's office and let them know they are wasting their time.
FireChan Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 You should get over to the Ontario County Sheriff's office and let them know they are wasting their time. You should drop them a line and tell them you know what Stewart was thinking.
Mr. WEO Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 If any driver other than Stewart had been involved, there wouldn't be any argument. The only reason there is any argument is because Stewart has a reputation of being rather hot-headed and aggressive...which is what provides room for reasonable speculation. The real problem in this thread is that quite a bit of the speculation is unreasonable, because people are unwilling to admit that they simply don't know what they don't know. We know Ward got out of his car, we know he approached Stewart's moving car, we know he got sucked under the right rear wheel and killed. We DON'T know what Stewart was thinking, how the car was handling (or should handle - it's not a goddamn Ford Focus), what he saw, how much time he had to react...speculation on such is just that - speculation. Not entirely baseless, but not well-founded either. The idiots indulging it as fact (and yes, Mr. WEO, I'm talking about you) should stop indulging it as fact and treat it as the unfounded speculation it is. I have not concluded it as fact. Although your claim that he got "sucked under the right rear wheel and killed" is an interesting euphemism for what actually happened. You should drop them a line and tell them you know what Stewart was thinking. It's obvious they are already considering this.
BuffaloBillsForever Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 (edited) You should get over to the Ontario County Sheriff's office and let them know they are wasting their time. It's politics, bureaucracy.. Anytime a death such as this happens especially with video and such media spotlight of course they are looking into it. The sheriffs office knows no charges will be laid, just buying time so there is no backlash about the "investigation" from crazy people and the media that they did "nothing" about this. Edited August 11, 2014 by BuffaloBillsForever
ExiledInIllinois Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 You should get over to the Ontario County Sheriff's office and let them know they are wasting their time. And taxpayer's money! They are. But I don't want this thread moved to PPP, so that's the end of it. Please, only comment on the things you know... Like not walking onto an expressway to yell @ a car that made you crash.
Mr. WEO Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 It's politics, bureaucracy.. Anytime a death such as this happens especially with video and such media spotlight of course they are looking into it. The sheriffs office knows no charges will be laid, just buying time so there is no backlash about the "investigation" from crazy people and the media that they did "nothing" about this. So you're saying that any other explanation than a simple unavoidable accident on Stewart's part can't even be debated?
BuffaloBillsForever Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 So you're saying that any other explanation than a simple unavoidable accident on Stewart's part can't even be debated? Being a rational and unbiased person looking at the video. YES!
BuffaloBillsForever Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 (edited) If any driver other than Stewart had been involved, there wouldn't be any argument. The only reason there is any argument is because Stewart has a reputation of being rather hot-headed and aggressive...which is what provides room for reasonable speculation. The real problem in this thread is that quite a bit of the speculation is unreasonable, because people are unwilling to admit that they simply don't know what they don't know. We know Ward got out of his car, we know he approached Stewart's moving car, we know he got sucked under the right rear wheel and killed. We DON'T know what Stewart was thinking, how the car was handling (or should handle - it's not a goddamn Ford Focus), what he saw, how much time he had to react...speculation on such is just that - speculation. Not entirely baseless, but not well-founded either. The idiots indulging it as fact (and yes, Mr. WEO, I'm talking about you) should stop indulging it as fact and treat it as the unfounded speculation it is. Let's just assume something crazy happens and charges are laid by the DA. This argument of "Stewart has a reputation of being rather hot-headed and aggressive...which is what provides room for reasonable speculation" would not be allowed in court and any prior evidence to the such would be deemed as prejudicial. So even if this goes to trial...and the DA would look like fools doing this, he would never be convicted. Edited August 11, 2014 by BuffaloBillsForever
DC Tom Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 Let's just assume something crazy happens and charges are laid by the DA. This argument of "Stewart has a reputation of being rather hot-headed and aggressive...which is what provides room for reasonable speculation" would not be allowed in court and any prior evidence to the such would be deemed as prejudicial. So even if this goes to trial...and the DA would look like fools doing this, he would never be convicted. Because reasonable speculation isn't allowed in a courtroom. But it is on the internet. I have not concluded it as fact. You certainly post with the voice of absolute truth. Although your claim that he got "sucked under the right rear wheel and killed" is an interesting euphemism for what actually happened. What actually happened, again?
ExiledInIllinois Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 So you're saying that any other explanation than a simple unavoidable accident on Stewart's part can't even be debated? No. Just not by you. Now, unless you've watched Happy Days where Pinky gets out of her car right before a "Malachi Crunch" was being executed. If that's the case, then feel free to comment. :-P :-P :-P Hey... Somebody had to make a pop culture reference... IMO, this thread has already Jumped the Shark. :-)
Best Player Available Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 No audio, No video from either drivers car exists. There was none ever. That is the reason the Sheriff made the request if any spectators Had footage. So far a big zero. Source TMZ This will all be history within a day or two. As it should be. if some on this board had their say. Stewart would be swinging from the gallows by now. sadly, for no reason whatsoever.
NoSaint Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 No audio, No video from either drivers car exists. There was none ever. i thought it was stated that stewarts car was carrying a camera? not so much? i just havent seen the report you referenced yet.... This will all be history within a day or two. As it should be. if some on this board had their say. Stewart would be swinging from the gallows by now. sadly, for no reason whatsoever. i think thats pretty strongly overstating any "anti stewart" position that has been taken. i think even weo is primarily advocating that it sounds fishy and warrants investigation, not that hes intentionally killed a man.
Mr. WEO Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 Because reasonable speculation isn't allowed in a courtroom. But it is on the internet. You certainly post with the voice of absolute truth. What actually happened, again? No it doesn't. But those who claim there can be no doubt as to what happened (Stewart cannot be guilty of anything in this incident) do. Direct your misplaced ire at them. As for the tire "sucking him in", I haven't seen it reported like that thus far. I didn't know that spinning tires may literally suck in a nearby pedestrian. I am learning more and more!
Just Jack Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 So, I had lunch with a friend of mine, that's been into DIRT racing longer than I've known him, so over 20 years of experience and knowledge, this is what he was able to tell me.... 1) In order to race at Canadaigua, all drivers must sign a waiver and liability form that includes a portion stating that in case of an accident, they will stay in their car until track personal arrive, unless the car is on fire 2) Tony was ahead of Ward when the accident happened (Ward going into the wall), and based on the video there was no contact made between cars. If there was, you would see Wards car reacting differently from contact with Tony's tire. Also, Tony had no idea what the caution was for until he came back around the track and saw the car in the wall. 3) There is additional video of the accident, shot by track personal, that has been turned over to the police. Fox Sports 1 did have some of it earlier, but has since taken it down 4) The driver in front of Tony did not see Ward either until the last second, based on reports from one of his pit crew.... I have driven these cars, the right side board on the top wing will block out an entire car let alone a person standing there, I now work on the 45 car in the video and the driver said he just saw him at the last second and just missed him, Tony had even less time to react to the situation. People in the stands or watching this video have no idea how fast these thing happen and how limited our view is inside the car.it was a very bad turn of events that happened but we all know the dangers involved in the sport we love. https://www.facebook.com/mark.tychoniewicz?fref=browse_search 5) In order to get the backend of this style cars to kick left, you do need to hit the gas, which it appears Tony was trying to do. But Ward was too close.
Mr. WEO Posted August 11, 2014 Posted August 11, 2014 i thought it was stated that stewarts car was carrying a camera? not so much? i just havent seen the report you referenced yet.... i think thats pretty strongly overstating any "anti stewart" position that has been taken. i think even weo is primarily advocating that it sounds fishy and warrants investigation, not that hes intentionally killed a man. It was reported that there is a go-pro cam on stewart's car. I've said over and over that I don't think he intended to kill anyone, only that a less benevolent scenario than a pure unavoidable accident occured is possible.
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