The Big Cat Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 However even in your carefully worded and diplomatic comparison, you used the Bills' draft history as a rationale for the "busters" to hate on EJ, which is fair I guess. But, you used an immeasurable qualifier of emotion (hopeful/optimistic) as the reason for the "savior" crowd. I'm not sure that's a fair comparison there. I'd give you a solid B for your noble effort though, Mr. Ambassador. I would say the "we can't draft well" is an entirely unfair argument. Fans need to get over the Maybin pick. That **** was five years ago, and in a draft that also got us Levitre, Wood and Byrd. Say what you will about retaining that talent, this is a "we can't draft" refutation and those three succeed in precisely that. 2010 was a lousy draft year, fine. 2011--Dareus, A. Williams 2012--Gilmore, Glenn, Bradham, Searcy 2013--Manuel, Woods, Alonso (and bubble starters Goodwin and D. Williams) 2014--Watkins, quite possibly 3 offensive line starters and quality, young depth at LB and CB So, by a reasonable count they've drafted 10 starters in the last four drafts on top of at least five other players that will give the team quality minutes. That aint bad, by any stretch of the imagination. 15 players in four years is hitting on nearly four draft picks a year. That's actually damn good.
RuntheDamnBall Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 Continued... Here's a shot as Manuel has decided to go to Smith, who is again, open. As you can see there is no OL engaged with JPP, he has a free shot at Manuel. Why there isn't a lineman blocking JPP, I have no idea. And this one is for the crowd that says EJ stares down his receivers and doesn't look people off. Common theme, quick 3-step drop, first read is Watkins, who you can see is covered. Also the LB is drifting towards Watkins, following Manuels eyes. Seeing that Watkins is covered, and the space that the LB was occupying is now open, Manual looks to his 2nd receiver Smith, who is running his route towards where that LB was. Smith is open, catches the ball for a nice 9 yard pickup and a first down. IMO, I think people are making a bigger deal out of the batted balls and "staring down" the receivers. Yes, the last pass attempt to Watkins on 3rd and 11, Manuel did stare him down and it was almost picked off. To me, that seemed more like a forced throw to get Watkins the ball. Please feel free to discuss further... You're awesome. Yes, the photo analysis clearly demonstrates that EJ is going to blossom into a perfect combination of Kelly, Marino, and Elway. We all need to relax. You have a real knack for distortion. Have you ever considered becoming a guitar pedal?
dubs Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) So, it would be a good thing for the second QB on the depth chart to be cut? How is that possible? I was joking. In other words, he's so much worse than EJ I'd rather have him cut than listen to people compare the two. If Tuel stays on the bench the whole year, then I could care less about him. And it's nothing personal. I'd love to see him improve and reach his potential, whatever that is. If he turned into a Frank Reich that would be a fantastic outcome. For now, I just think it's silly to compare EJ and Tuel. EJ needs time and patience. He has potential to develop into a very good QB. I readily admit he's not even close to that yet, but it's possible he gets there. We won't really have a good feel for his potential until the season is over. Edited August 5, 2014 by dubs
eball Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 Right I'm a terrible fan because I point out what I see. I love the bills bud. But EJ is going to continue to struggle, it's not easy to fix the issues he has. I really hope I'm wrong. Why is it that every time I read that statement from a "realistic" fan, I simply don't believe it? I'm catching up on this thread after being away for 24 hours...as always the overreactions are on both sides of the aisle. I'm a hater because I have concerns and you are an apologist or kool aid drinker. It's always easier to call someone a silly name than accept that they are offering what is to them a truthful opinion. If fans took a moment and stopped believing everything they think is the truth rather than what it actually is -- an opinion -- there would be a lot less name-calling around here. But I guess I'm hoping for a more evolved fanbase.
CodeMonkey Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 If fans took a moment and stopped believing everything they think is the truth rather than what it actually is -- an opinion -- there would be a lot less name-calling around here. But I guess I'm hoping for a more evolved fanbase. 13,000+ posts and you still have hope. Nice!
Dorkington Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 You have a real knack for distortion. Have you ever considered becoming a guitar pedal? Maybe a political run is in the future for him.
17 Josh Allen Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 I like EJ and he has the size and body type And proto type you want. But then the game starts and he just does not look the part. He too nice. Trying to be 2 perfect. Thinking two much. Just stop thinking And start slinging the ball. He is not a risk taker at All. He needs to throw he ball when the receiver Is not open so when the receiver makes his cut or break or separation the ball is there on time. What see EJ doing is waiting until the receiver Is open then throwing it. This wools be maybe ok In college football or the CFL but not in the NFL He's got the arm and the tools. Is his QB brain That's the Problem. Tuel has the Brain and looks the part. And you will soon see that he has the Above average arm to be the starter This is what I see. If EJ does not get his act Together. Tuel will end up being the starter Later this year. I know EJ is a Number one pick but that does not Mean you have a lock on the starting Job
bills-fan in arizona Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 I was thinking the same thing - these guys... And yeah, he was terrible in HS: http://www.si.com/college-football/2010/01/01/rivals-recruiting I didn't say he was a terrible in HS, you should probably have read what I said.
John from Riverside Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 Yes, the photo analysis clearly demonstrates that EJ is going to blossom into a perfect combination of Kelly, Marino, and Elway. We all need to relax. Why is it that you take your comments to the extreme.....that is why there cannot be discussion with you.
eball Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 13,000+ posts and you still have hope. Nice! I used to be something of a name-caller myself...have really tried to mellow. The pessimist-realists still irk me, but...serenity now, serenity now.
Heitz Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 He's just not a good NFL quarterback. He cannot see the field and cannot process fast enough to make the right decision. He stares guys down... it's unfortunate, but this was him in HS and in college and now in the pros. Sorry. I didn't say he was a terrible in HS, you should probably have read what I said. My bad, you said he's not a good NFL QB and you can trace it back to his HS days, which is implying that he's never been considered good. Regardless, I know you're smarter than FSU and the Bills FO when it comes to player assessment...
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 My bad, you said he's not a good NFL QB and you can trace it back to his HS days, which is implying that he's never been considered good. Regardless, I know you're smarter than FSU and the Bills FO when it comes to player assessment... Basically, EJ has become a top recruited high school player & 1st round because he has a good personality.
reddogblitz Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 (edited) Why is it that every time I read that statement from a "realistic" fan, I simply don't believe it? Why don't you believe it? Can't a person be a fan AND be critical of some players or coaches too? I'm a big Bills fan and travel from out of town to go to a few games each year. 2 last year and 3 this year. I watch every game on NFL Ticket. Still, I'm totally not sold on Coach Marrone yet and hated the hire. I hope I'm wrong and he wins us 10 SB Championships. That would be way more important than being right about him (which I hope I'm not, but gheez I'm extremely skeptical). I'm not worried about EJ. Edited August 5, 2014 by reddogblitz
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 Why don't you believe it? Can't a person be a fan AND be critical of some players or coaches too. I'm a big Bills fan and travel from out of town to go to a few games each year. 2 last year and 3 this year. I watch every game on NFL Ticker. Still, I'm totally not sold on Coach Marrone yet and hated the hire. I hope I'm wrong and he wins us 10 SB Championships. That would be way more important than being right about him (which I hope I'm not, but gheez I'm extremely skeptical). I'm not worried about EJ. I agree with you & I don't think anyone is questioning your fan hood. But this over the top reaction to every play hasn't gotten crazy? People freaked out after the hall of game game more than the Super Bowl. Marrone and EJ have had one year. How anyone can make a judgement on them at this point is crazy. It wasn't all sunshine and rainbows for Marv and Kelly at the beginning either. If the internet existed then, there would be a good amount of fans who wanted them run out of town.
ThurmasThoman Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 I'm not going to read through 13 pages of this board to see if this has been brought up, but Ill say it right here: Tuel deserves a shot with the starting unit. He passes the "eye test" for me... he looks good, commands the huddle, throws a crisp pass, and takes some risks. I'd love to see him throwing to sammy and williams, handing to spiller, and getting reps behind our o line. at some point this training camp, marrone has to make that move, he would not be doing his diligence if he did not. bills fans can continue to bury their head in the sand all the like, but this team is a train wreck at qb, and tuel may be our only hope. ej 4-6 as a starter last year, and has looked inaccurate all summer. i know i need to be patient, but i fail to see why qb is the only position on the roster that isn't open to competition.
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 I'm not going to read through 13 pages of this board to see if this has been brought up, but Ill say it right here: Tuel deserves a shot with the starting unit. He passes the "eye test" for me... he looks good, commands the huddle, throws a crisp pass, and takes some risks. I'd love to see him throwing to sammy and williams, handing to spiller, and getting reps behind our o line. at some point this training camp, marrone has to make that move, he would not be doing his diligence if he did not. bills fans can continue to bury their head in the sand all the like, but this team is a train wreck at qb, and tuel may be our only hope. ej 4-6 as a starter last year, and has looked inaccurate all summer. i know i need to be patient, but i fail to see why qb is the only position on the roster that isn't open to competition. Haha
CountDorkula Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 I'm not going to read through 13 pages of this board to see if this has been brought up, but Ill say it right here: Tuel deserves a shot with the starting unit. He passes the "eye test" for me... he looks good, commands the huddle, throws a crisp pass, and takes some risks. I'd love to see him throwing to sammy and williams, handing to spiller, and getting reps behind our o line. at some point this training camp, marrone has to make that move, he would not be doing his diligence if he did not. bills fans can continue to bury their head in the sand all the like, but this team is a train wreck at qb, and tuel may be our only hope. ej 4-6 as a starter last year, and has looked inaccurate all summer. i know i need to be patient, but i fail to see why qb is the only position on the roster that isn't open to competition. Did he pass the eye test against Cleveland and KC last year? Was that inability to move the offense against the Browns "just a top D, just happens." Or was that 99Yd pick 6 just a "hey it happens to the best of them?"
CodeMonkey Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 I'm not going to read through 13 pages of this board to see if this has been brought up, but Ill say it right here: Tuel deserves a shot with the starting unit. He passes the "eye test" for me... he looks good, commands the huddle, throws a crisp pass, and takes some risks. I'd love to see him throwing to sammy and williams, handing to spiller, and getting reps behind our o line. at some point this training camp, marrone has to make that move, he would not be doing his diligence if he did not. bills fans can continue to bury their head in the sand all the like, but this team is a train wreck at qb, and tuel may be our only hope. ej 4-6 as a starter last year, and has looked inaccurate all summer. i know i need to be patient, but i fail to see why qb is the only position on the roster that isn't open to competition. Unless Manuel gets hurt I don't see any way this happens. Marrone and Whaley are all-in on Manuel. You will see nothing but Manuel as the starter as long as he is healthy regardless of how well he plays. And I am fine with that. Give Manuel every opportunity to make it or not this season. He has been given all the tools he could possibly ask for. Time to shine.
C.Biscuit97 Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 Did he pass the eye test against Cleveland and KC last year? Was that inability to move the offense against the Browns "just a top D, just happens." Or was that 99Yd pick 6 just a "hey it happens to the best of them?" Apparently, you weren't watching the Hall of Fame game. Tuel was basically auditioning for his induction in 20 years! Despite the fact EJ has a better qb rating than Tuel in both the preseason and regular season, Tuel is clearly the better qb. Duh.
ThurmasThoman Posted August 5, 2014 Posted August 5, 2014 I'll say one thing. He's twice the QB than some people around here are Bills fans. Sorry. point blank: anyone that watches this team 14 years into this trainwreck is a fan, by anyones definition. sitting through 2 or 3 seasons of this would be bad enough, but a decade and a half? sorry, but it's not up to you to hand out fan licenses--people (fans) are allowed to not like personnel decisions this far into us being this bad. fans are allowed to not like the quarterback who led us to nothing last year and has looked shaky this season. fans are allowed to question the hiring of a coach who never did much in the big east and hasnt done much in the pros. fans are allowed to question why we don't resign big name free agents. fans are allowed to predict that the bills will go 4-12 this year and a new owner will clean house. fans are allowed to ask for tuel to start. fans are allowed to buy billboards to fire marrone. when you watch those old bills games, or hear stories from people who were at those games (51-3, the comeback, etc.) you know how wild the rich was. those same fans are equally as passionate about why this team is bad now, as they were happy they were so good back then. those same fans that drive to canton to cheer the great jim kelly throwing a pass to the great andre reed while the rest of the bills greats look on are allowed to say that the not-so-great ej should be benched along with the rest of his not-so-great team mates. no one, not a single person, would pretend to be a fan of this garbage. the ones that are the most fed up are the ones who know how good it can be. the true fans want the bills to be great again, not 9-7/wildcard good, but 13-3, hosting the conference championship great. we know how bad ej is. we know he's not jim kelly.
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