Chandler#81 Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 This article taps on everything my eyes saw last year, so if I must be labeled, I'm an EJ-H. Most telling critism in that article full of quality critism' sis that he simply doesn't posses the "(screw) you!" . All the great QBs have it. Few to none of the mediocre QBs do. I truley fear 3-4 more years of STILL trying to land a bona-fide NFL QB.
BillsVet Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 I would like to remind everybody that the QB prior to EJ was Ryan Fitzpatrick. Did you guys know he went to Harvard? Yep, they've had bad QB's for years now. Doesn't make EJ better or worse conflating the argument that previous QB's were bad as well.
YoloinOhio Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 Chris Trapasso @ChrisTrapasso 2m Think what you want about how EJ Manuel will play in 2014, but his rookie year was actually a bit better than average http://bit.ly/1qC9n88
BarleyNY Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 (edited) Just for the record, I'm not comparing Kelly to Manuel in any way shape or form. Merely pointed out that Kelly benefited greatly from working with Mouse Davis and learning to read defenses before he came to the NFL. ALL quarterbacks need time to develop. EVERY LAST ONE OF THEM. From Unitas to Manuel to Johnny Football. I think that's all anyone is trying to say. No need to make this into comparisons on any other level. GO BILLS!!! That's a very misleading statement because it ignores the fact that EVERY LAST QB coming out of college has a different set of skills to develop and different degrees to which each of those skills must be developed. Wouldn't we all be breathing easier if, in college, EJ had done a great job running a complicated offense that required a lot of reads and anticipation throws? I know I would. If a comparison is to be made it should be with players that were much more similar from a skill/deficiency standpoint. Pulling out the Bills best QB ever who bore almost no resemblance whatsoever to EJ just damages your credibility. Edited July 28, 2014 by BarleyNY
thewildrabbit Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 I agree, it serves no one to compare the two as quarterbacks. I'm comparing their situations, and the fact is that the practice that Kelly got was valuable, and the number of reps he took before becoming elite was sizable, and this franchise QB had a lot more of them under his belt than does our second year man. No one thinks EJ is or was on the same development curve, and that's why I think some posters could take a step back off the ledge until he gets more reps. I want to see improvement this year and I think it's imperative. I also think we've been wowed by preseason and practice all-stars only to see them fail in the pressure situations. I just find this "he isn't looking good on day 3" stuff a tad ridiculous. If he looks terrible in week 3, I'll be more concerned. I concur!and even after week three it will still be only 13 regular game starts for EJ. With Cordy Glenn sidelined in training camp so far, and the rest of that line still in flux. Then the new receiving corps with Woods, Goodwin in their second year. Watkins being a rookie, and Williams in his first year with the team. Then, we really don't know what type of offense we will see from second year Bills OC Nate Hackett. Will it be another year of the hurry up and punt offense like last season, with 70% of the run plays right up the middle and almost no creativity in getting the ground game to make first downs I'm tending to be much more lenient in my assessment of EJ over the first half of this season because this offense still needs to become a solid cohesive unit. Lets hope EJ stays healthy this season so he has a chance to develop.
K-9 Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 That's a very misleading statement because it ignores the fact that EVERY LAST QB coming out of college has a different set of skills to develop and different degrees to which each of those skills must be developed. Wouldn't we all be breathing easier if, in college, EJ had done a great job running a complicated offense that required a lot of reads and anticipation throws? I know I would. If a comparison is to be made it should be with players that were much more similar from a skill/deficiency standpoint. Pulling out the Bills best QB ever who bore almost no resemblance whatsoever to EJ just damages your credibility. Not misleading in the least. All QBs, regardless of their readiness out of college, need development at the next level. That's the point. Manuel was/is a lot more raw a prospect than many 1st round draft picks, so if you want to compare levels of development required, feel free. And AGAIN, I'm not comparing him to Kelly. Never have. But let's not act like there aren't similarities for all QBs coming out of college and trying to convert to the next level. GO BILLS!!!
You herd it hear last Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 Yep, they've had bad QB's for years now. Doesn't make EJ better or worse conflating the argument that previous QB's were bad as well. When I read your posts, the voice in my head is that of Walter Matthau in "Grumpy Old Men"
YoloinOhio Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 That's a very misleading statement because it ignores the fact that EVERY LAST QB coming out of college has a different set of skills to develop and different degrees to which each of those skills must be developed. Wouldn't we all be breathing easier if, in college, EJ had done a great job running a complicated offense that required a lot of reads and anticipation throws? I know I would. If a comparison is to be made it should be with players that were much more similar from a skill/deficiency standpoint. Pulling out the Bills best QB ever who bore almost no resemblance whatsoever to EJ just damages your credibility. Not many college offenses are complicated. Brady Quinn was that guy, though.
John from Riverside Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 There is plenty of scenarios....at least enough of them....of QB's going on and becoming even better pros then they did college players EJ could well be one of those players. I need to see a full year of him this year in order to make a opinion for myself. One thing I do know.....he has every physical tool you could possibly as for....a plethora of quality WR's to include one potential superstar......a running game that is 4 deep taking the pressure off him......and a defense that will keep giving him the ball. Its not all on his shoulders
8-8 Forever? Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 If this is all true, then this is EJ's make or break year: If he makes: the team wins 8-10 games and Maybe, just maybe a softer, "hometown discount" owner like Pegula keeps the staff for another year and EJ can continue to be nurtured by the guys who drafted him and maybe "get it" and becomes a star If he breaks: his career is over. why? Team goes 6-10, coaching staff that drafted him replaced top to bottom with guys who (a) did not draft him and (b) will be hard on him, which EJ will internalize given his fragile ego, leading to more mistakes, multiple teams and ultimate exit from the league before he "gets it" wow.
Mr. WEO Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 Well, at least something about EJ has "proven deadly and accurate"!
8-8 Forever? Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 Not many college offenses are complicated. Brady Quinn was that guy, though. wow, yeah, EJ kind of is the black Brady Quinn. all the tools some of the time, but on a bad team and never had enough time to develop. hope it turns out better with EJ.
thewildrabbit Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 There is plenty of scenarios....at least enough of them....of QB's going on and becoming even better pros then they did college players EJ could well be one of those players. I need to see a full year of him this year in order to make a opinion for myself. One thing I do know.....he has every physical tool you could possibly as for....a plethora of quality WR's to include one potential superstar......a running game that is 4 deep taking the pressure off him......and a defense that will keep giving him the ball. Its not all on his shoulders While I agree about the defense, I still don't think we have seen enough what the offense will do this season. After watching the local sports news last night, and Marrone stating that he is very frustrated with the way the line is performing is very telling to me. Looks like Schwartz isn't holding his D back in practice for this training camp. "8 sacks in 17 plays" Yikes!! http://www.wgr550.com/pages/9034669.php?pid=417218 This Sunday's HoF game should be very interesting, can't wait!!
YoloinOhio Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 Well, at least something about EJ has "proven deadly and accurate"! Can't believe it took that long. I didn't want to be the one.
NoSaint Posted July 28, 2014 Posted July 28, 2014 (edited) Chris Trapasso @ChrisTrapasso 2m Think what you want about how EJ Manuel will play in 2014, but his rookie year was actually a bit better than average http://bit.ly/1qC9n88 Pro: better than average Con: the majority of that list isn't any good I think I've been chalking him up as a 30-40% chance to be the guy type of odds and being above the middle of that list probably matches up to that theory. He's got all the tools - it's just that even with all the tools there's some sort of dumb luck/magic/leprechauns and unicorns that you have to get where the output matches/exceeds those individual bits. I'd say he's in that career stage that 1 in 3 make it out of.... Which is still decent odds for a young qb but an uphill battle nonetheless Edited July 28, 2014 by NoSaint
3rdand12 Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Well, at least something about EJ has "proven deadly and accurate"! You are just awful sometimes : )
bills_believer Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 With this year being so critical and with the go for broke acquistion of Sammy Watkins, I don't understand why they didn't try to sign a veteran QB backup.
maddenboy Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 This article taps on everything my eyes saw last year, so if I must be labeled, I'm an EJ-H. Most telling critism in that article full of quality critism' sis that he simply doesn't posses the "(screw) you!" . All the great QBs have it. Few to none of the mediocre QBs do. The only mediocre one that even comes to mind is Jeff George.
Formerly Allan in MD Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 This is precisely what we saw when EJ returned from his injury early in the season. It's too bad the Bills didn't see this report. It's not what you want to hear and certainly not what one expects of a high first round pick. Do things improve? Hopefully, but one thing is pretty certain: EJ will not be the running threat he once was.
White Linen Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) Then explain why, under the same coach, FSU went from EJ's production in 2012 to Winston's in 2013 at QB. For the record, Manuel (a senior) was 263 of 387 (68%) for 3397 yards and 23 TD's versus 10 INT's. He rushed for 321 yards on 103 carries for 4 TD's. Winston was, as a RS freshman, 257 for 384 (66.9%) for 4057 yards and 40 TD's versus 10 INT's. He rushed for 219 yards on 88 carries for 4 TD's. Stats don't tell the whole story, but it's interesting to note the difference between a RS freshman versus a senior. No, what does Winston have to do with anything? Should we have drafted him? Should he be our starter this year? Explain why Ponder was 183 for 294 for 2038 yards and 20 TD's vs 8 INT's and was drafted 12th 4 slots ahead of where EJ went? Edited July 29, 2014 by Triple Threat
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