NoSaint Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 not a hypothetical. somebody's her dad. And it's none of us.
A Dog Named Kelso Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 Anybody who has seen an abusive relationship up close knows that this is nonsense. Is it possible that Rice can reform himself? It's possible. They have a sh-t ton of stuff to work out, though, and there is a power dynamic that she will probably never fully be able to extricate herself from, no matter how contrite he is. "It takes two to tango" is circling back to the victim-blaming dumbassery that suggests she invited a lights out punch in an elevator. Was she physically involved in the altercation? No doubt. Is Ray Rice big and strong enough to control the situation without decking her? Yes, he is. Not disagreeing but his size has nothing to do with it. With the video shown one can forget a man can be physically harassed and a victim of domestic violence too. One of the reasons being they know they shouldn't hit women then the situation can get out of hand. The best way for him to have controlled the situation was to push a button and get off the elevator and walk away.
MattM Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 What did they do wrong and why was it wrong? First of all, suspending him for 2 games--ridiculous punishment for a very serious issue. Second, failing to find and view these tapes (if that's even true.) Everyone knows many elevators these days have cameras--this one did, yet they apparently never inquired about it with the hotel, nor asked Rice's attorneys for it (and those folks did have a copy apparently). The last two days' events seem to me to be a major back peddle by the League caught with its pants down, spinning wildly to deflect blame from Goodell and the League.
Rob's House Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 (edited) i can't fathom mitigating circumstances that would push me to advise staying with him. care to give some examples? Girl: "You should know, I !@#$ed your brother and your best friend, and I knowingly gave all 3 of you AIDS." if you're her dad, what percentage is acceptable? If it's my daughter I'm hardly a rational and objective observer. First of all, suspending him for 2 games--ridiculous punishment for a very serious issue. Second, failing to find and view these tapes (if that's even true.) Everyone knows many elevators these days have cameras--this one did, yet they apparently never inquired about it with the hotel, nor asked Rice's attorneys for it (and those folks did have a copy apparently). The last two days' events seem to me to be a major back peddle by the League caught with its pants down, spinning wildly to deflect blame from Goodell and the League. What I'm getting at is why do you believe they were responsible for punishing him, and to whom did they owe that duty? Edited September 10, 2014 by Rob's House
chris heff Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 Watch the Inside the NFL. Ed Reed wants to know the whole story before he condemns his "brother" Ray Rice. Gumbel and Esiason don't really disagree. Well Ed, your "brother" punched a woman and knocked her out. What do you think Ed? Was Ray threatened? Was he defending himself? Then to add insult to injury the producers of this show have Brandon Marshall as a guest, who of course was stabbed by his wife on a domestic violence incident, unbelievable.
truth on hold Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 What part of: "He punched lights out and dragged her caveman style and doesn't deserve to work in the public eye for this company (The NFL) and have the privilege to earn millions" don't you understand? It's unbecoming abhorrent behavior that will not be rewarded. I am all for going Penn State on his azz and letting him back in a couple of years from now. Freddy is 33, if Rice wants it bad enough, he'll work for it AND the love of his wife. Maybe this keeps them together FOR LIFE and not just the typical "NFL marriage." She says she loves him now and didn't want this swarm of negative media attention and damage to his career. Who are you to claim and tell her otherwise? Adding negative media attention and financial stress to a relationship that needs work is shameful IMO
ExiledInIllinois Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 (edited) Adding negative media attention and financial stress to a relationship that needs work is shameful IMO No, not shameful. Tough love. Through good times and bad times, sickness and health... Till death do us part. Letting them both off the hook is nothing but a road to disaster for these love birds. Work through this and they can work through anything! Edited September 10, 2014 by ExiledInIllinois
John Adams Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 (edited) NFL is despicable. What did Goodell think "knocked out his girlfriend" would look like? Only when the vid came out and it was clear the league was about to be in a s***tstorm did they act. Why are they married and together? Who can know. You can have abuse and forgiveness just like you can have cheating and forgiveness. Doesn't make either one right but both are possible. I know nothing about their situation besides that he spit on her and then moments later knocked her out. Clearly he was in the wrong but who knows what their relationship is like outside of that single glimpse. Maybe it was a single event and they are in deep and effective therapy. If someone saw my wife and I in our worst fights, you'd advise both of us to divorce immediately. But we are together 25 years and love each other dearly. Relationships can be hard. Edited September 10, 2014 by John Adams
Nitro Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 Rice and his wife need to fade away and try to get their life together. If this was an isolated incident and she forgives him, fine. Get anger management counseling and never lift a hand in anger again. Society will not left him set foot on a football field again. The NFL is about football and has screwed up in the past but does give second chances. Leonard Little and Donte Stallworth killed people while driving drunk but got to play. Now they have a domestic violence policy in place, the men will have to start behaving properly. This is a going to be interesting.
truth on hold Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 (edited) I am in total agreement up until the last part. I really don't know how to interpret the last paragraph. Not prying, but does it turn physical? If it DOESN'T, then okay, fine I am cool with what you said. and if it does then he thinks the answer to working it thru it was public shaming, loss of career, financial stress, double jeopardy, imposed after a period of calm ... punish the victim 2x, if it's against her wishes, screw it, an outsider knows better Edited September 10, 2014 by Joe_the_6_pack
Hplarrm Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 And no, are you gonna boycott the NFL now? Let me be clear, the Ravens organization should be the ones doing something. The commissioner shouldn't go above the rules on a moral whim. No one expects that you or most fans will boycott the game. However, one of the fastest growing demographics in the game are women. Even though there also will be any effective organized boycott by women, Goodell admitted error in moneymaking strategy when he suspended Rice for a mere two games for his admitted fiancé abuse when a pot violation produces a 4 game suspension. You ,ay be right about what impacts the game more, but its not simply the individual games its the sport as whole that is the issue about moneymaking. Goodell did mot do his job well which is protecting the brand of the sport. He will lose his job because of this (immediately if throwing him under the bus will allow for ignoring rather than restirring this wound or immediately if throwing him under the bus is needed to get past this issue. It is simply naïve to focus only on what is good for the game and not to realize that what really drives decision-making is not what is good or fair in an individual game but instead what makes the team owners and other stakeholders the most money. Your though that this should be handled by the team and coach is cute and quaint. The real deal is that the NFL has a commissioner who has been empowered by the owners to make decisions on issues such as this with profits as the guiding principle, not some sense of morality that you or I might agree with.
NDBUFFCUSEFAN Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 Feel sorry for what... That she can't have millions. She married the guy, she has her happiness. Even better that she married him and loves him. Its not about the money, now they have to work at it. I hope they both have to struggle for money now, if it is all about love, they will overcome. Yes, he punched her. But it still takes two to tango. You're last sentence shows what kind of person you are, I got a week ban for pointing this out in the Tony Stewart thread but at least this time you've made it painfully obvious.
MattM Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 Girl: "You should know, I !@#$ed your brother and your best friend, and I knowingly gave all 3 of you AIDS." If it's my daughter I'm hardly a rational and objective observer. What I'm getting at is why do you believe they were responsible for punishing him, and to whom did they owe that duty? The NFL Personal Conduct Policy, for starters. That's the price of admission for being an NFL player. Not only are you subject to the law like the rest of us, but you're also subject to the NFL's policies. Those policies in this case were initially applied in a ridiculous manner, which was not really Rice's fault. The League so badly mismanaged that, that it's now spinning wildly to right the ship and for some of the execs involved, like Goodell, to save themselves....
Captain Caveman Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 I know... Having to "struggle" a little. He won't exactly be "poor." He made almost 20 million dollars in the last two years. Hopefully they have been relatively smart with it.
PolishDave Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 I am amazed at how much people care about this stuff to be honest. One guy in the NFL is exposed as being a douche who abuses his girlfriend/wife. The NFL finds out about it and suspends him indefinitely. Seems like they handled it pretty well to me. Why would anyone in the NFL be worried for their jobs besides Ray Rice? Why does anyone else even care? This isn't even about football beyond the fact that the Ravens lost their running back. Who doesn't have a skeleton or two in his closet?
Captain Caveman Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 What I'm getting at is why do you believe they were responsible for punishing him, and to whom did they owe that duty? I think most people understand at this point that it's not about punishing him, it's about protecting the league's image. That's the reality of it. His punishment is a byproduct of what the league needed to do to protect its image.
birdog1960 Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 Girl: "You should know, I !@#$ed your brother and your best friend, and I knowingly gave all 3 of you sadly funny but unconvincing. In that scenario he'd be even more likely to kill her at some point
1billsfan Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 (edited) and if it does then he thinks the answer to working it thru it was public shaming, loss of career, financial stress, double jeopardy, imposed after a period of calm ... punish the victim 2x, if it's against her wishes, screw it, an outsider knows better I'm not sure if you’re understanding why this has become the huge story and that it goes beyond the wishes of the victim for it to go away. Domestic violence is usually a hidden crime that goes on behind closed doors. What happened here is that it appears the legal system, the NFL and Ravens were all complicit in going easy on a man who punched his woman in the face, knocking her unconscious and all three knowing full well there was actual video proof of what he did. That there was video evidence is something that is very rare. So you have two things at play here, by going light on Ray these institutions were giving other men who beat on woman a wink and a nod that this stuff really isn’t a big deal and the other thing is that you make victims of domestic violence feel less safe knowing that even with video evidence, your going through with and prevailing with any charges you may have against a man who’s beat you up is highly questionable. This has become a touchstone issue that goes beyond Ray's wife’s wishes. I'm sure there are very many women affected by this issue who were hurt and feel less safe by what these institutions did and did not do. Edited September 10, 2014 by 1billsfan
26CornerBlitz Posted September 10, 2014 Posted September 10, 2014 This morning I happened to catch Mike Greenberg on his ESPN2 morning show where he called out Robert Kraft for hypocrisy with regard to the Ray Rice DV issue. Mr Kraft appeared on national television yesterday and said he can't imagine Ray Rice ever playing in the NFL again. Greenberg noted that Kraft had recently welcomed and warmly embraced Floyd Mayweather in his owner's box at a Patriots' game. Mayweather has a notorious history of domestic violence. Classic example of phony outrage. Mr. Kraft's hypocrisy is even worse if you take into consideration his team's handling/codling of Aaron Hernandez.when it should have been paying attention to obvious warning signs. Instead, the Patriots rewarded Hernandez with a contract extension. Mr. Kraft, please refrain from the moral high ground condemnation when it's clear you have no right to any such expression.
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