What is better, no guns, or more guns?

[ArdmoreRyno]

32 minutes ago, SUNY_amherst said:

Vast knowledge my ass. I didn’t ask for your life story and I don’t give a f—k. How many times do I have to say that 

 

You also don't care about the difference between a gang shooting/drug deal gone bad and real mass shooting. You don't care how the FBI defines mass shooters. You only care about what the anti-gun lobby, liberals and media tell you. That's your source of information. 

 

 

[ArdmoreRyno]

1 minute ago, SUNY_amherst said:

 

Not a word of that is true lol

 

Okay Jan... sure. 

[ArdmoreRyno]

3 minutes ago, SUNY_amherst said:

 

 

As the worlds foremost expert on firearms and shooting (resume available on request), I care very much about how FBI teams are studying them.

 

I am actually pleased that the lobbyists arent blocking this research but maybe they aren't in this instance because of their careful verbiage to not upset people like you

 

The FBI knows there's a difference in shootings. You don't. Those are the facts. 

[ChiGoose]

1 hour ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Ready to hear about the common sense gun laws that stop this. What are they? 

Well considering most of the guns that are used in crimes in Chicago come from out of state, it tells us two things:

 

1. The tighter gun laws in Chicago and Illinois make it difficult for criminals to get guns here.

 

2. If our neighboring states enacted tighter gun laws like ours, it would be even more difficult for criminals to get guns and reduce the number of gun crimes here. 
 

A single Indiana gun store sold 850 guns recovered from crime scenes in Chicago

[ArdmoreRyno]

Another school shooting... chalk it up on the list of all these school shooters in 2023. 

 

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/college-baseball-player-wounded-stray-bullet-game-incredibly-bad-luck-bad-place

[AlBUNDY4TDS]

2 hours ago, ChiGoose said:

Well considering most of the guns that are used in crimes in Chicago come from out of state, it tells us two things:

 

1. The tighter gun laws in Chicago and Illinois make it difficult for criminals to get guns here.

 

2. If our neighboring states enacted tighter gun laws like ours, it would be even more difficult for criminals to get guns and reduce the number of gun crimes here. 
 

A single Indiana gun store sold 850 guns recovered from crime scenes in Chicago

How many of these illegal gun users were put in jail? Who cares where they come from if they are never punished once obtained.

[ChiGoose]

17 minutes ago, AlBUNDY4TDS said:

How many of these illegal gun users were put in jail? Who cares where they come from if they are never punished once obtained.

1. It obviously matters where the guns come from. If you can stop them from coming in, you can reduce gun homicides

 

2. CPD’s clearance rate is pretty bad. Usually below 50% most years.

3. Stronger sentences are not much of a deterrent. If some kid is at the point where he has a gun and is about to pull the trigger, he’s not thinking if that means 25 years or more in jail.

 

4. If we do not also look at the root causes of crime, we’re not going to get anywhere. Making it harder for criminals to get guns is just one step. 

[ArdmoreRyno]

7 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

1. It obviously matters where the guns come from. If you can stop them from coming in, you can reduce gun homicides

 

2. CPD’s clearance rate is pretty bad. Usually below 50% most years.

3. Stronger sentences are not much of a deterrent. If some kid is at the point where he has a gun and is about to pull the trigger, he’s not thinking if that means 25 years or more in jail.

 

4. If we do not also look at the root causes of crime, we’re not going to get anywhere. Making it harder for criminals to get guns is just one step. 

I agree with you 10,000% 

 

And I don't think anyone would disagree that we need to keep firearms out of these people's hands. As for the issue, crime. Goes back to single parent homes +  socioeconomics issues + intercity = major major cause.  

[Orlando Buffalo]

11 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

1. It obviously matters where the guns come from. If you can stop them from coming in, you can reduce gun homicides

 

2. CPD’s clearance rate is pretty bad. Usually below 50% most years.

3. Stronger sentences are not much of a deterrent. If some kid is at the point where he has a gun and is about to pull the trigger, he’s not thinking if that means 25 years or more in jail.

 

4. If we do not also look at the root causes of crime, we’re not going to get anywhere. Making it harder for criminals to get guns is just one step. 

Two points you have a point with but I  think you are looking at wrong- the fact that one Indiana store has provided guns that so many criminals have but somehow the straw buyers are not arrested is a huge issue. That will solve the access problem quickly if you arrest the straw men. Secondly the men being in jail a long time is more about them being off the street for that time period, not a deterrent to not do the crime. 

[ChiGoose]

4 minutes ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

I agree with you 10,000% 

 

And I don't think anyone would disagree that we need to keep firearms out of these people's hands. As for the issue, crime. Goes back to single parent homes +  socioeconomics issues + intercity = major major cause.  

Right, if we don’t get rid of the incentives that drive people to crime, no amount of “tough on crime” policies are going to fix the problem.

 

You cannot expect that treating the symptoms will fix the underlying causes. 
 

So while it’s important to get criminals off the street, that’s not going to do anything to stop the next person from committing crimes. 

[Tommy Callahan]

2 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

Right, if we don’t get rid of the incentives that drive people to crime, no amount of “tough on crime” policies are going to fix the problem.

 

You cannot expect that treating the symptoms will fix the underlying causes. 
 

So while it’s important to get criminals off the street, that’s not going to do anything to stop the next person from committing crimes. 

It stops that violent criminal from making another victim.  

 

right now inflation is driving DADS and MOMS to get a second job, so again one less parent at the home.

 

but more money to skate parks and green spaces.

 

IF the problem is single parents, what do you do about the fact the entire welfare system penalizes marriage or a two-parent household?  And in turn is promoting Single family homes through financial means that are way more than any reported income would make up for.

 

Or the kid that sees bangers with way more money, women, clothing than the stiff taking the bus to the 3-hour shift at a gas station.

 

At the very least removing the predators from the streets gives the rest a chance.  and coupled with the fact we throw money at poverty, A young person that wants to, has opportunities to get out.  but who explains that to them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[ArdmoreRyno]

10 minutes ago, ChiGoose said:

Right, if we don’t get rid of the incentives that drive people to crime, no amount of “tough on crime” policies are going to fix the problem.

 

You cannot expect that treating the symptoms will fix the underlying causes. 
 

So while it’s important to get criminals off the street, that’s not going to do anything to stop the next person from committing crimes. 

 

We've got to fix the welfare system. Single parent homes and welfare are the main issue IMO. Once the safety net was put in place for low income homes, the single parent household percentage skyrocketed (from the 1960's to now). Before the welfare system was in place, in the mid-60's, families stayed together. We didn't have the crime rate we have now. 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

2 hours ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

We've got to fix the welfare system. Single parent homes and welfare are the main issue IMO. Once the safety net was put in place for low income homes, the single parent household percentage skyrocketed (from the 1960's to now). Before the welfare system was in place, in the mid-60's, families stayed together. We didn't have the crime rate we have now. 

the irony of the sixties… that era’s ‘progress’ led to unprecedented increases in crime, and perpetual poverty.

 

Just Like the irony that, the average age of violent criminals, in years, after the roe v wade decision crime peaked and then declined precipitously. 
 

Apparently children whose parents prefer not to have them or raise them tend to poverty and criminality

 

🤯 😯 😳 

[Andy1]

10 hours ago, Chris farley said:

This is where the left just keeps posting outliers while ignoring the majority of gun violence/mass shootings that are gang related. 

Chris - this is a myth pushed by the gun lobby. The majority of gun homicides are not gang related. Do you have any recent data on this? The most recent data I can find is:
 

The total number of gang homicides reported by respondents in the NYGS sample averaged nearly 2,000 annually from 2007 to 2012. During roughly the same time period (2007 to 2011), the FBI estimated, on average, more than 15,500 homicides across the United States (www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/crime-in-the-u.s/2011/crime-in-the-u.s.-2011/tables/table-1). These estimates suggest that gang-related homicides typically accounted for around 13 percent of all homicides annually. https://nationalgangcenter.ojp.gov/survey-analysis/measuring-the-extent-of-gang-problems

[ChiGoose]

Waiter killed, tourist wounded in shooting at popular New Orleans restaurant

[BillStime]

 

[B-Man]

3 hours ago, ChiGoose said:

Waiter killed, tourist wounded in shooting at popular New Orleans restaurant

 

11 hours ago, B-Man said:

I guess Goose missed posting this one.

All those gun-restriction laws and all.

Chicago shootings: At least 27 shot, 5 fatally, in weekend gun violence across city, police say
ABC News Local ^ | May 1, 2023 | By Sun-Times Media Wire

 

CHICAGO -- At least 27 people have been shot, five fatally, in gun violence across Chicago this weekend, police said.

 

A 16-year-old boy was fatally shot Sunday morning in Douglas. Responding officers found Darrien Dallen with a gunshot wound to the chest about 9:10 a.m. in the 3700-block of South Michigan Avenue, according to Chicago police and the Cook County medical examiner's office. He was taken to Comer Children's Hospital, where he died.

 

At least three other teens were wounded, including a 15-year-old boy in New City and a 16-year-old boy in Roseland.

 

The younger boy was shot near the groin about 8 p.m. Sunday while in the 1900-block of West 47th Street and was hospitalized in fair condition, police said.

The 16-year-old boy was in the 100-block of West 92nd Street about 11:10 p.m. Saturday when someone in a black sedan fired shots, striking him in the arm, police said. He was taken in good condition to Little Company of Mary Hospital in Oak Lawn.

 

Two men were fatally shot in separate attacks Saturday in Austin on the West Side. Around 12:30 a.m., a man, 39, was found on the ground in the 4900-block of West Hubbard Street with a gunshot wound to the torso. He was taken to Mount Sinai Hospital, where he died, police said. About 12 hours later, a 32-year-old man was outside in the 5200 block of West Adams Street when four people stepped out of a gray sedan and at least one of them opened fire, striking him multiple times. He was taken to the same hospital, where he died, according to police.

 

Last weekend, at least 20 people were shot, one fatally, across the city.

 

https://abc7chicago.com/shootings-in-chicago-this-weekend-today-austin-shooting/13200388/

 

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

11 hours ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

Ready to hear about the common sense gun laws that stop this. What are they? 

11 hours later… where are those common sense gun laws to stop kids from shooting kids with handguns in downtown Chicago?

 

Ban the banana clip? Is that the solution? 

[ChiGoose]

14 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

 

I agree. Too many people have easy access to guns. 
 

I’m glad you agree we should tighten gun laws to prevent bad actors from getting access to firearms. 

12 minutes ago, Over 29 years of fanhood said:

11 hours later… where are those common sense gun laws to stop kids from shooting kids with handguns in downtown Chicago?

 

Ban the banana clip? Is that the solution? 

I responded one hour after you asked the question but I guess that wasn’t convenient for your preferred political narrative so you have to pretend I didn’t say anything to continue to push your nonsense.

Edited May 2, 2023 by ChiGoose

[ArdmoreRyno]

15 hours ago, SUNY_amherst said:

With the big brains God gave us, we ought to be able to work on two problems at once, right? (Parenting / easy access to guns)

 

This is way more of a cause than anything. Lack of parenting leads to leads to lack of education, juvenile delinquency which leads to crime as adults, leads to incrassation, leads to kids being raised w/o one parent or both parents and thus the cycle continues. I work at a high school and there is a direct correlation between single parent households, tardy/absenteeism, failing grades and then drop outs. 

 

I'm divorced (2005) but spent every possible moment with my girls (now 22 and almost 21). I raised them to respect themselves, don't let themselves be treated poorly by anyone... let alone men. I raised them both, even though my oldest was not interested at all, understanding how firearms functioned and how to be safe around them. My little one would get onto me when she saw me doing something unsafe with my weapon... "DAD! You forgot to put it on safe!". My nieces and nephew were raised the same way. I'll never forget when my nephew was 9, he called his dad and then me to say "UNCLE RYAN! John's dad isn't here and there is a gun by the TV!"

 

How we fix the issue of kids being raised poorly, that's the mystery. That's the key to helping improve our society IMO. 

13 hours ago, SUNY_amherst said:

Saw some report where a freakin college pitcher was in the bullpen and hit by a stray bullet from a shooting just outside the ballpark

 

Yea, I posted the link in the past page. 

 

It will be counted as a "school shooting". 

 

It shouldn't be because it wasn't.