What is better, no guns, or more guns?

[Big Blitz]

1 minute ago, ChiGoose said:

 

I think this "us vs them" talk is not only problematic in that it does not facilitate actual discussion, but it's also dangerous because it drives us to our own sides and leads to demonizing anyone who doesn't agree with us as "them."

 

It also allows for us to take any member of the "them" group and ascribe their belief to everyone in that group even if the group as a whole does not agree. A good example of this is the mask mandate claim here. I have not seen anyone in a position of authority advocating that we require everyone be masked forever. I am sure there are some people somewhere who have expressed that belief, but it is not a mainstream position of the Left. However, by making this claim,  we can simply smear anyone on the other side as being unreasonable and dismiss anything they have to say.

 

It would be like taking the words of an extremist on the Right and saying everyone on the Right is a neo-nazi white supremacist ("They want to disadvantage minorities. They believe being white is superior..." etc). It's not true. There are some that may express that view but that's not the actual policy of the Right. But I could make that claim, point to someone who fits that profile and feel like I've made my point that my group is superior to their group.

 

Not only does it not get us anywhere, but it actually pushes us apart and makes things worse.

 

Let's be better than this.

 

 

Watch.

 

 

 

Is there any leftist here that thinks mask requiements at any and all institutions or places of business - should be banned? 

 

And at no time should government be calling for them to be mandated under the guise of "the CDC recommends."

 

And if any locality or state calls for a mandate you'll be the first to say "no way."

 

You won't get one.  Not one.  

[SoCal Deek]

5 minutes ago, Tiberius said:

And you asked why Men were so angry? Then you changed it to people. 

 

You are a realm idiot. You come here to play word games and pass on the latest talk radio garbage 

So, you don't want to answer your premise about why men/people are angry?  (No idea what the reference to talk radio is about.)

[Buffarukus]

8 hours ago, Gene Frenkle said:

 

It's amazing how many hoops you people are willing to jump through just to rationalize keeping all of your dangerous toys, especially when the stats are staring you in the face.

 

hoops. you people. stats.

 

not a single word on anything i said.

 

not suprising. 

 

 

Edited June 2, 2022 by Buffarukus

[\GoBillsInDallas/]

Tulsa shooter targeted the doctor who did his back surgery:

 

https://nypost.com/2022/06/02/tulsa-gunman-michael-louis-targeted-doctor-who-operated-on-him-cops/

 

[ArdmoreRyno]

40 minutes ago, \GoBillsInDallas/ said:

Tulsa shooter targeted the doctor who did his back surgery:

 

https://nypost.com/2022/06/02/tulsa-gunman-michael-louis-targeted-doctor-who-operated-on-him-cops/

 

 

I had a different back doctor in Tulsa. 

 

Weird... I'm completely guessing but it sounds like this guy might have been after more and more  pain meds. Once someone goes down the withdrawal stage road from opioids, people do desperate things. 

Edited June 2, 2022 by ArdmoreRyno

[Tiberius]

1 hour ago, SoCal Deek said:

So, you don't want to answer your premise about why men/people are angry?  (No idea what the reference to talk radio is about.)

You asked 

[B-Man]

 

Just threatening the end of democracy in favor of tyranny - you know, the Progressive way: 

 

 

 

 

[T master]

15 hours ago, BillStime said:

Why don’t you move to China?

 

Because your cult is actually passing laws that dictate how Americans can live.

 

CRT

Anti-LGTBQ laws

Voter suppression laws

Abortion laws

 

Heaven forbid we pass sensible gun legislation that might make it more difficult to get an AR-15.

 

Idiots

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Because i believe in the constitution as it was written & don't believe that it is a out dated document like those that believe the way you do & feel they need to write a amendment to make it fit their beliefs or just flat out want to take away the right to bear arms of any kind .

 

They use guns as the scape goat instead of addressing the real reason the sick demented people that choose to do these kind of evil things because the gun cannot by it self commit the act it has to have the person with the twisted mind to actually pull the trigger .

 

There are less guns in American house holds now than there were in the 80's but more killings why because of the guns or is it the people that get the guns that are committing these evil crimes that need to be stopped .

 

Oh and it's okay as far as your abortion law argument to say to a women your body your decision unless it comes to pushing a BS vaccine that does less than natural immunity (which has been proven follow the science) then your body your decision doesn't matter even though they lie about why it is needed who needs it & how every one needs to have it then it's different story .

 

By the way who's the true idiot ?  You along with your buddy & the rest of the ignorant people that follow what your grand poo bah & his constituents believe think that AR in th e heading of AR-15 stands for assault rifle so who is the actual idiot ?? 

[T master]

11 minutes ago, B-Man said:

 

Just threatening the end of democracy in favor of tyranny - you know, the Progressive way: 

 

 

 

 

 

WOW but Trump was the dictator 🤔

 

Yet they will abolish something put in place to stop exactly what they are trying to accomplish & fill the SC as to make their agenda & ideology the only thing that matters !

 

But won't look at some of the causes like the amount of mind altering drugs passed out & mental illness as some of the main cause for such crimes just amazing that this kind of ideology seems rational .

 

And from a NY Rep no less now there's a surprise ...

Edited June 2, 2022 by T master

[716er]

4 minutes ago, T master said:

 

WOW but Trump was the dictator 🤔

 

Yet they will abolish something put in place to stop exactly what they are trying to accomplish & fill the SC as to make their agenda & ideology the only thing that matters !

 

But won't look at some of the causes like the amount of mind altering drugs passed out & mental illness as some of the main cause for such crimes just amazing that this kind of ideology seems rational .

 

And from a NY Rep no less now there's a surprise ...

As I stated earlier on this page, there are multiple countries that have a higher percentage of the population on psychotropic drugs than the US. None of those countries have a mass shooting problem.

[ChiGoose]

15 minutes ago, T master said:

But won't look at some of the causes like the amount of mind altering drugs passed out & mental illness as some of the main cause for such crimes just amazing that this kind of ideology seems rational .

 

 

...because that's not the main cause for gun violence?

[SoCal Deek]

1 hour ago, Tiberius said:

You asked 

The World According to Tibs: We have angry men with access to guns.
 

Since men have always had access to guns, then I can only guess according to you, the difference must be that men are more angry? Care to speculate as to why men are more angry? 

[Tiberius]

Just now, SoCal Deek said:

The World According to Tibs: We have angry men with access to guns.
 

Since men have always had access to guns, then I can only guess according to you, the difference must be that men are more angry? Care to speculate as to why men are more angry? 

Oh, are shootings a new thing? 

 

[Warcodered]

5 hours ago, ArdmoreRyno said:

 

Around 400 per year in the United States. Nearly the same number of people killed by all rifles (450) which include bolt action, AR platforms, AK platforms, etc. 

 

To answer your last question... about 400. 

Hammer....where have I seen this...oh right.

 

 

So that's not even accurate as it lumped hammers in with other blunt objects.

Edited June 2, 2022 by Warcodered

[T master]

3 minutes ago, 716er said:

As I stated earlier on this page, there are multiple countries that have a higher percentage of the population on psychotropic drugs than the US. None of those countries have a mass shooting problem.

 

Would you please provide a list of those countries of which you speak so i can compare and research them my self .

 

Drugs are a part of the problem as i stated earlier in this article lack of parental discipline , broken family's, drugs, desensitization due to hours of violent video games , lack of social interactions, bullying & many other pieces add to the problem it's more than just drugs !

 

But when the TV commercials & adds come out & say if suicidal thoughts or what some professionals have found, but don't address that as part of the problem it's just the guns !! 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtrLBYwIOZs

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIxcMIBhHS4

 

[716er]

3 minutes ago, T master said:

 

Would you please provide a list of those countries of which you speak so i can compare and research them my self .

 

Drugs are a part of the problem as i stated earlier in this article lack of parental discipline , broken family's, drugs, desensitization due to hours of violent video games , lack of social interactions, bullying & many other pieces add to the problem it's more than just drugs !

 

But when the TV commercials & adds come out & say if suicidal thoughts or what some professionals have found, but don't address that as part of the problem it's just the guns !! 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtrLBYwIOZs

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oIxcMIBhHS4

 

Portugal, Belgium, Spain, Canada, and Sweden

[Big Blitz]

1 hour ago, B-Man said:

 

Just threatening the end of democracy in favor of tyranny - you know, the Progressive way: 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Can we all stop pretending these Ds are not full blown Commie fascist Anti American trash that mock all them slippery slope calls.  

 

I can't imagine this all ending well.

[muppy]

well in retrospect and upon reflection....

 

I think that wherever people are in their day lives away from home,  minding your own business be at work, hospital, mall, theater, concert, school.....there are recurring and seemingly unending events involving being shot and killed  using firearms in the USA.

 

This should be deemed unacceptable on BOTH sides of this gun debate. 

 

Stopping future events needs to be a primary focus. I think expecting teachers to sign up for not only teaching but to be anti terrorism experts is a Huge Problem.

 

1. they are paid little enough as it is. This should not be a job requirement or even ASK of admins for their teaching staff...not a great reruiting tool to attract talent into teaching is it.......

 

2. whats to stop said bad actor/perp from doing a driveby on a school at dismissal. Or  Theater after a showing, Or an exit from a hospital

 

My point is I think a sick person will find a way to act out his murderous impulses somehow somewhere.......the focus needs to be prevention and HOW to accomplish that. Who are these people.......How to identify potental perps/ bad actors.

 

I am going to attempt to educate myself in what experts think are strategies to accomplish that in practical terms .

 

And My guess is in the near future there will be actions taken that the majority of gun owners will acquiesce to...for the common good. There has to be middle ground here folks.

 

 

[ArdmoreRyno]

48 minutes ago, Warcodered said:

Hammer....where have I seen this...oh right.

 

 

So that's not even accurate as it lumped hammers in with other blunt objects.

 

I don't know what the NRA said... I'm not a member, nor do I care. I just pulled up the data via the FBI on weapon(s) used in homicides.

[ChiGoose]

21 minutes ago, muppy said:

...

1. they are paid little enough as it is. This should not be a job requirement or even ASK of admins for their teaching staff...not a great reruiting tool to attract talent into teaching is it.......

 

...

 

My point is I think a sick person will find a way to act out his murderous impulses somehow somewhere.......the focus needs to be prevention and HOW to accomplish that. Who are these people.......How to identify potental perps/ bad actors.

 

Some of the same politicians saying teachers are harming kids with CRT and grooming them for pedophiles also argue that we should give the teachers guns. Doesn't make much sense to me. I think not having guns in a classroom is definitely preferable to asking our teachers to do everything they are currently doing AND carry firearms.

 

I think your second point here is important but often gets overlooked. We cannot stop every mad person from acting on their desire for violence. However, we can work to reduce the lethality of them doing so. A country in which there is easy and affordable access to mental health resources AND strong checks against who can own firearms and how they are stored is a country that would see fewer mass casualty events than we have today. Ideally, it would reduce suicides as well.

 

If someone wants to kill a bunch of people but can't get a firearm, they can still do a lot of damage with something like the aforementioned hammer. But you're not going to have mass hammering death events every day like we do with guns right now. I also doubt 19 cops would be too scared to go into a classroom that had a madman with a hammer instead of one with a gun.

 

Also, if someone wants to commit suicide but they cannot get a firearm, they will have to try something less lethal, increasing the odds that they survive the attempt and don't end up killing themselves.