Jauronimo Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 so you believe that the system is so good it can actually tell where a missile will fall and there fore can ignore shooting at it? that sounds believable to you Are you really suggesting that plotting the path of a projectile is harder than intercepting that projectile with another missile? Doesn't the latter pretty much require you to be able to do the former? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Pay attention, folks, it's this kind of thinking that allowed the Nazis to kill all those Jews. I don't know if the Jews were launching rockets at the Nazis. I could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I don't know if the Jews were launching rockets at the Nazis. I could be wrong. The Nazis intentionally let Jewish missiles hit their vacant fields to justify genocide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I don't know if the Jews were launching rockets at the Nazis. I could be wrong. I don't remember them offering a ceasefire durring the Final Solution, offering the Jews free travel and commerce either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Greg? Still speechless? I'm a little horrified and perversely amused by some of the things I've read on here... wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I'm not f'n with you at all, I do know you are wrong, and I have links to back me up, but I don't think I even need them. You say its ballistics, but how would you sacred Iron Dome determine when a rocket had expended its booster fuel? It would be on a different course before and after its booster gave out. What you are saying makes no sense. Again, they are taking its weakness and trying convince YOU that its a strength. Think about it What? That made no sense. Booster fuel? Different course? You don't actually know how any of this works, do you? I want to see those links that back you up. They must be hilarious. You are going to compare it to a cop catching speeders?? That's stupid as hell! Probably makes perfect sense to Meazo though. He loves you The MLB's been lying about the speed of Nolan Ryan's fastball, too. Yes, I am...given that the ONLY way what you're arguing would make any sense is if radar can't tell direction and velocity. I'm a little horrified and perversely amused by some of the things I've read on here... wow. I've learned today that some people think it's impossible to catch a baseball. All we're missing is Chinese laser-clowns balancing on beach balls at the South Pole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I read more on it and Tom I think you are right. I apologize. Carry on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 (edited) I'm not f'n with you at all, I do know you are wrong, and I have links to back me up, but I don't think I even need them. You say its ballistics, but how would you sacred Iron Dome determine when a rocket had expended its booster fuel? It would be on a different course before and after its booster gave out. What you are saying makes no sense. Again, they are taking its weakness and trying convince YOU that its a strength. Think about it Is Tom ever wrong? You are going to compare it to a cop catching speeders?? That's stupid as hell! Probably makes perfect sense to Meazo though. He loves you What is your point? That Hamas absolutely blows at warfare? That the Israelis are getting lucky? I know high-school physics. I know the rockets that Hamas launches are unguided. What's your angle? The Israelis are puffing up their own chests? They want to seem like a impregnable country? Who cares? The capabilities of the Iron Dome means nothing to anyone. Edited July 16, 2014 by FireChan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiberius Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Are you really suggesting that plotting the path of a projectile is harder than intercepting that projectile with another missile? Doesn't the latter pretty much require you to be able to do the former? The speed of the process is what conceded me, after all this is basically the system that shot down a British jet 11 years ago. But it looks like they worked out a lot of those problems. What is your point? That Hamas absolutely blows at warfare? That the Israelis are getting lucky? I know high-school physics. I know the rockets that Hamas launches are unguided. What's your angle? The Israelis are puffing up their own chests? They want to seem like a impregnable country? Who cares? The capabilities of the Iron Dome means nothing to anyone. My original point, which still stands, was that Iran is watching all this and is probably thinking up counter measures to trick the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 The speed of the process is what conceded me, after all this is basically the system that shot down a British jet 11 years ago. But it looks like they worked out a lot of those problems. Determining trajectory quickly is an already solved problem. That's how counter-battery fire works, and a properly trained and equipped army can generally get a counter-battery fire mission off before the incoming rounds land. The decision cycle of whether to engage or not is insanely quick, though (as those things go). It's a "mobile" system, but the only way I can think they could get that to work as a practical matter would be to site it statically and pre-program a lot of the engagement parameters. Particularly given it's a multi-vehicle system. My original point, which still stands, was that Iran is watching all this and is probably thinking up counter measures to trick the system. Of course they are. Given they're supplying rocket technology to Hamas, they arguably already have - at least one failed intercept was the result of Hamas successfully saturating the system with multiple simultaneous rocket launches (seven, I think. Iron Dome got five or six.) It's a system designed to defend against sporadic harassment attacks by field-artillery grade rockets. The Russians fire the same rockets in 40-round volleys in 20 seconds from a single vehicle. Iron Dome can't defeat that. It also likely couldn't defeat a missile launched from Iran itself - larger missile, flying higher and faster and probably outside the engagement envelope for Iron Dome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Determining trajectory quickly is an already solved problem. That's how counter-battery fire works, and a properly trained and equipped army can generally get a counter-battery fire mission off before the incoming rounds land. The decision cycle of whether to engage or not is insanely quick, though (as those things go). It's a "mobile" system, but the only way I can think they could get that to work as a practical matter would be to site it statically and pre-program a lot of the engagement parameters. Particularly given it's a multi-vehicle system. Of course they are. Given they're supplying rocket technology to Hamas, they arguably already have - at least one failed intercept was the result of Hamas successfully saturating the system with multiple simultaneous rocket launches (seven, I think. Iron Dome got five or six.) It's a system designed to defend against sporadic harassment attacks by field-artillery grade rockets. The Russians fire the same rockets in 40-round volleys in 20 seconds from a single vehicle. Iron Dome can't defeat that. It also likely couldn't defeat a missile launched from Iran itself - larger missile, flying higher and faster and probably outside the engagement envelope for Iron Dome. Exactly. It's not blanket missile defense, it's a strategic defense built to deal with a very specific problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truth on hold Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) Get this, apparently terrorists the size of 11 year olds like to take the day off and go to the beach to play soccer during a "war". "Just tell em anything, those idiots will believe it"-says anybody representing the military. "Oh yeah, tell em we're gonna investigate it" lol a horrible, inexcusable situation. Basically what you have are maniacs with the mentality of the Israeli politician Ayelet Shaked who says kill them ALL, being given advanced weapons. Weapons so advanced they can shoot down nearly every one of the thousands of rockets it chooses, but we're supposed to believe cant differentiate between four 10 year olds playing soccer on a beach in broad daylight. This is not solely on the maniacal Israeli firing at them, it's on the international community that supports and allows this to go on. Thoughts and prayers out to the families of those boys Edited July 17, 2014 by Joe_the_6_pack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TakeYouToTasker Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 a horrible, inexcusable situation. Basically what you have are maniacs with the mentality of the Israeli politician Ayelet Shaked who says kill them, being given advanced weapons. Weapons so advanced they can shoot down nearly every one of the thousands of rockets it chooses, but we're supposed to believe cant differentiate between four 10 year olds playing soccer on a beach in broad daylight. This is not solely on the maniacal Israeli firing at them, it's on the international community that supports and allows this to go on. Thoughts and prayers out to the families of those boys Again, perhaps the Palestinians should have accepted the cease-fire offered two days prior, instead of promising to escalate their attacks. Israel is not at fault for being at war when they offer peace, and their enemy rejects it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 a horrible, inexcusable situation. Basically what you have are maniacs with the mentality of the Israeli politician Ayelet Shaked who says kill them ALL, being given advanced weapons. Weapons so advanced they can shoot down nearly every one of the thousands of rockets it chooses, but we're supposed to believe cant differentiate between four 10 year olds playing soccer on a beach in broad daylight. This is not solely on the maniacal Israeli firing at them, it's on the international community that supports and allows this to go on. Thoughts and prayers out to the families of those boys Maybe the international community should stop letting the Palestinians attack Israel. Maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Maybe the international community should stop letting the Palestinians attack Israel. Maybe. No, Israeli kids are fair game. No one gives a **** about them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 (edited) No, Israeli kids are fair game. No one gives a **** about them. Tell us about those dead Israeli kids. That's right, they don't exist. Edited July 17, 2014 by NoJustice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deranged Rhino Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 Had to step away so I'm just getting back into this -- thanks to all for the info on the iron dome. That whole discussion was interesting. Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 No, Israeli kids are fair game. No one gives a **** about them. No, it's just attempted murder no one cares about. Because Hamas sucks at killing people, we should give them unlimited chances to figure it out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justice Posted July 17, 2014 Author Share Posted July 17, 2014 You can't excuse their actions. Those kids weren't harming anybody. How dare you justify Israel's actions? In one breath you say Hamas' rockets are unguided and yet in another you claim they're targeting kids. Make up your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FireChan Posted July 17, 2014 Share Posted July 17, 2014 You can't excuse their actions. Those kids weren't harming anybody. How dare you justify Israel's actions? In one breath you say Hamas' rockets are unguided and yet in another you claim they're targeting kids. Make up your mind. You don't have to target kids to kill kids. Just launch bombs at populated areas indiscriminately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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