Unstoppable CJ

[JohnC]

 

 

I fail to understand why you take my "thoughts" and opinions to a personal level. I for one enjoy the dialogue.

 

Spiller doesn't "suck." I hope this is clear. Is he the type of player to build a team around? Of course not. He, as I recall, wasn't even an every down back in college.

And yes, he did play hurt, but so does virtually every player in every game.

 

Btw, have you noticed how many posters do not agree with the pedestal upon which you placed Spiller? It isn't about ME; before this I had but 1 post in this thread which I did NOT start.

 

I hope that Spiller can win us some games in 2014. We shall see.

 

Big Apple Bill, CBiscuit97 brings up a terrific point on how the youthful OC bungled the offense. I thought it was outright asinine to initially install a hurry up offense when his starting qb was a raw rookie who didn't even have the benefit of an extensive preseason due to a knee injury. Common sense would have indicated that a slower paced offense would have been more appropriate for the situation he was confronted with. As the season advanced Hackett was smart enough to tame his instincts and slow the pace down.

 

Hackett's approach to Spiller was very perplexing to me. It seemed that his strategy was to run Spiller inside and play the odds that he would eventually break through a non-existent hole or bounce off for a big play. Instead of using plays where CJ had space (screensand short passing plays) the OC took an approach of fitting a round peg in a square hole.

 

I'm not placing all the blame or even the preponderence of our offensive struggles on the OC who had to work with inexperienced qbs and a sub par OL. But where I criticize him is that he wasn't too accomplished in placing whatever assets he had on offense and putting them in the best position to succeed. His approach was in stark contrast to Pettine, a more experience pro coach, who put his players, including his rotational players, in the positions where they were most suited to succeed.

 

This season Hackett has two sparkling athletes in Spiller and Watkins who can do wonders with the ball when they have a little room. Let's see if the OC knows how to maxize their talents??

Edited June 25, 2014 by JohnC

[DC Greg]

He had one catch of more than 40 yards in 2013. I'm not sure if it was a screen, so, the maximum # is one, the minimum is zero.

 

http://www.pro-footb...get_id=SpilC.00

 

My mistake. 7 catches for 20+ yards and 12 catches for 10-20 yards. My estimate of yardage was overstated, his impact in the screen game was not. It was fantastic. It was rare to watch an NFL team screen that well. Helped having Levitre out in front on a lot of those. Not saying that screens should be our bread and butter for passing the ball (this isn't high school), but I believe our coaches could take at least one or two things that Gailey actually did do well and incorporate them. CJ doesn't do as well in a box. Get him in a 2 yd x 2yd box of space anywhere on the field and he's a threat to score. With a player like that, draw up a few things that give him space. And actually practice them enough so they can be run crisply in a game. Just my opinion.

[mrags]

 

 

This may be the most rediculous statement I've read on this board in 5 years. Just because you have a man crush on Fred-Ex, doesn't mean Spiller sucks.

get your facts straight kiddo. I never said it was because of any love I have for Freddy. I'm all in on Bryce Brown starting by week 8. Mark me down for that since your clocking me so much. In the 5 years ive been here I almost never knew you existed. Welcome to the board. Edited June 25, 2014 by mrags

[PO'14]

We all want the Bills players to be the best at what they do. I agree fully with Mr.Rags here. CJ has the speed, the athletic ability and has potential. On the other hand, CJ is injury prone, has no vision and isnt Football savvy.

 

AGAIN, Put CJ in for screens, outside runs, kick returns and put in FJAX for up the gut smashmouth football!

[mrags]

We all want the Bills players to be the best at what they do. I agree fully with Mr.Rags here. CJ has the speed, the athletic ability and has potential. On the other hand, CJ is injury prone, has no vision and isnt Football savvy.

 

AGAIN, Put CJ in for screens, outside runs, kick returns and put in FJAX for up the gut smashmouth football!

rifht on brother. The only problem with that is this:

 

Pretty soon the other teams will catch on to that. If they see CJ in the game it's an outside run or screen. If Freddy is in it's more up the middle in your face.

 

My point is, he's a liability. He can't block as well. He can't move inside. It's extremely limited. It hurts the offense as a whole.

 

This is why Marrone will not have him resigned. He's not the type of player that he wants running the ball for his offense. Freddy is but he's getting way to old and undeliable. Brown is that guy. They tried to get him a year ago and have him now for a reason. He'll be starting by week 8. CJ won't be back. He'll most likely be overpaid by someone and won't be much more successful than he is now.

[FireChan]

rifht on brother. The only problem with that is this:

 

Pretty soon the other teams will catch on to that. If they see CJ in the game it's an outside run or screen. If Freddy is in it's more up the middle in your face.

 

My point is, he's a liability. He can't block as well. He can't move inside. It's extremely limited. It hurts the offense as a whole.

 

This is why Marrone will not have him resigned. He's not the type of player that he wants running the ball for his offense. Freddy is but he's getting way to old and undeliable. Brown is that guy. They tried to get him a year ago and have him now for a reason. He'll be starting by week 8. CJ won't be back. He'll most likely be overpaid by someone and won't be much more successful than he is now.

 

Exactly. Some stupid team will buy into,"he's such a dynamic play maker, a scoring threat every play" and give him ridiculous cash. Meanwhile, if he sprains his ankle or runs up the middle, he's next to useless. I'd put serious money on him not being a Bill in 2 years.

[mrags]

 

 

Exactly. Some stupid team will buy into,"he's such a dynamic play maker, a scoring threat every play" and give him ridiculous cash. Meanwhile, if he sprains his ankle or runs up the middle, he's next to useless. I'd put serious money on him not being a Bill in 2 years.

if there's an option to pick up an extra year after this year, they might do that IF... And only IF he has a good year reminiscent of 2012. AND... Stays healthy. But since that's NEVER happened, I doubt it.

 

It's all good. I'll still use him as my work horse back in my Madden seasons.

[What a Tuel]

Seriously. This thread is full of a bunch of BS.

 

1 good year out of 4? Really? Don't want to take into account he didn't start the first 1 and a half years?

 

Want to discount the 6 games that he actually played and did awesome in 2011?

 

Want to discount the phenomenal year he had in 2012?

 

Want to discount the nearly 1000 yard season he had last year despite the injury?

 

And then you go on to say you are all in on Bryce Brown? Who has had 0 good years? Fumble prone?

 

I mean I like Brown as much as the next guy, but geez could you be "all in" on such little evidence with Brown? and all out with Spiller despite what he has accomplished? It's almost laughable if I didnt think you were serious.

[Maury Ballstein]

 

 

My point is, he's a liability.

 

Ahahahahah. A liability to linebackers who whiff when they come near him.

 

You Po and Chan get a room already. Spillers gonna kill it this year with an improved OL.

 

Lock it down haters !

[FLFan]

if there's an option to pick up an extra year after this year, they might do that IF... And only IF he has a good year reminiscent of 2012. AND... Stays healthy. But since that's NEVER happened, I doubt it.

 

It's all good. I'll still use him as my work horse back in my Madden seasons.

It's a player option which Spiller will no doubt void.

[mrags]

Seriously. This thread is full of a bunch of BS.

 

1 good year out of 4? Really? Don't want to take into account he didn't start the first 1 and a half years?

 

Want to discount the 6 games that he actually played and did awesome in 2011?

 

Want to discount the phenomenal year he had in 2012?

 

Want to discount the nearly 1000 yard season he had last year despite the injury?

 

And then you go on to say you are all in on Bryce Brown? Who has had 0 good years? Fumble prone?

 

I mean I like Brown as much as the next guy, but geez could you be "all in" on such little evidence with Brown? and all out with Spiller despite what he has accomplished? It's almost laughable if I didnt think you were serious.

well. Let's answer this for the 1,000th time in this thread.

 

1. Yes. 1 good year out of 4. Statistically he hasn't done much beyond that. 1,200 yards is pretty good. Not great. Great would be 1,400+ with double digit TDs. He had 1,200 with less than 10. Wanna take into account he wasn't good enough to start the first one and a half years??? Because a top 10 pick at the RB position should be starting immediately and be a go to guy right away and he's not.

 

2. Your 6 games he "played and did awesome in" in 2011 averaged just over 70 yards a game. That's way less than AWESOME!!! When was the last time you sat in front of your computer looking at fantasy football points and thought... "Damn, my RB tore it up for me today. He got me 7 points"

...laughable

 

3. As I stated in my first point. 1,200 yards is far from phenomenal. It's a solid year for a RB. But usually with that kind of yardage you back that up with some TDs and he barely did. Call me when he hits 10 TDs in a season. Call me when he's top 3 in the league in rushing yards and then he has earned the right to be called phenomenal.

 

4. Do I want to discount the barely average 944 yard season with only 2 TDs??? No. I acknowledge that it was barely average. You are the one that thinks 944 yards and 2 TDs is good. When your clearly delusional. Onto the injury thing again... If he wasn't ALWAYS injured, or fatigued, or winded it might not be an issue. But the fact is, all NFL players okay hurt at times. Played tired at times. I don't hear excuses out of guys like Jamaal Charles, Adrian Peteraon, MJD, Matt Forte, Etc...

 

5. Bryce Brown has never been given the opportunity to start besides when the starter was injured. At that time he had very good games. But this isn't about me really. It's about the fact that Marrone and the FO went out of their way to try and get him last year then traded for him this year. It's pretty obvious they wanted him and saw something in him. It's also clear that what Marrone wants to do on offense doesn't suit CJ very well. And that's fine. My point is that CJ will not be here next year. Get used to it.

 

Have a nice day.

 

 

 

 

 

Ahahahahah. A liability to linebackers who whiff when they come near him.

 

You Po and Chan get a room already. Spillers gonna kill it this year with an improved OL.

 

Lock it down haters !

again. I hope he does. Well see who's right by mid season.

[FireChan]

Ahahahahah. A liability to linebackers who whiff when they come near him.

 

You Po and Chan get a room already. Spillers gonna kill it this year with an improved OL.

 

Lock it down haters !

 

I remember hearing that quote last year. You locked it down.

[Alphadawg7]

I never said it "wasn't any good." It sure as hell wasn't the 1200 yards you said it would be. Remember those threads? "CJ is gonna shut you up and have a huge year." You were wrong. You should own it.

 

How did the play calls with CJ change halfway through the year? Can you elaborate? Or do you just assume they changed the plays? When was CJ free of injuries?

 

Halfway through the year was what? Week 9? Let's look at those games.

 

Game #9 Pittsburgh. 8 att for 23 yards.

 

Game #10 New York. 13 att for 6 yards.

 

Thank god Hackett called the right plays then. Now I know what you're gonna say, "He was struggling with his injury." Except, he wasn't.

 

http://profootballta...mited-workload/

 

That article came out the day after the Pitt game.

 

Coach Doug Marrone said Monday that injury had nothing to do with the split of playing time, however.

“Game plan. How we’re putting those guys in there,” Marrone said, via the Buffalo News. “Doesn’t have anything to do with his ankle.”

Marrone said that Spiller’s role could increase or decrease from week to week depending on what the team plans to do that week. That’s a big difference from last week when Marrone said he was excited to be able to use Spiller more often and may mean that concerns about the ankle still linger because it’s hard to imagine the Bills having so little use for a healthy Spiller.

 

Marrone was excited to have a healthy Spiller. Then he wasn't so much anymore. This writer doesn't know why, but I do. It's because the only thing consistent about CJ is his inconsistency.

 

I'll show you some more of injury free Spiller.

 

Game #11 Atlanta. 15 attempts 149 yards. A good game. Probably his best.

 

Game #12 Tampa. 11 att for 22 yards. Yikes. Stringing two good ones together doesn't seem possible.

 

Game #13 Jax. 13 att for 67 yards. Pretty solid. Maybe he should stick to getting 15 or less carries

 

Game #14 Miami. 21 att for 83 yards. Solid again. Not Barry Sanders, but solid.

 

Game #15 New England. 19 att for 105. There we go. Broke 100 yards for the first time in 4 weeks with "Hackett figuring out the plays" and healthy.

 

Hmmmm...I guess an entire game is based on a RB in your world. Where are the notes on which scrub was QB? One of those games was 5 INT Flynn...how about the factors I stated that you always ignore? What about the WR's, OL, TE, QB's which all missed times at various times throughout the season...most importantly the FOUR starting QB's we had (EJ, Thad, Tuel, Flynn), 2 of which were rookies, one of which missed time as a rookie, one of which was a 3rd string QB acquired the week before the season started, another a guy cut by 3 straight teams and signed mid season because even our backups were hurt...another who was a PS QB yet had to play do to injury...Oh, then there is that pesky thing of QB being the most important position in all of organized sports. Then that is that pesky thing of Freddie being hurt too. Then there is that pesky thing of Spiller battling injury. Then there is that pesky thing of having an offense that can't do anything as a unit with a defense stacking 8 in the box every play because we can't pass. Then there is that pesky thing of a rookie coaching staff. Then there is that pesky issue all RB's have of not getting a rhythm without consistent carries.

 

None of that is in your facts...yet we still had 2 backs over 900 yards, both of which battled injuries. We still saw Spiller avg 4.6 ypc (worst of his career and still better than most RB's in the league) and go for over 900 yards in what was a disaster year for the WHOLE TEAM.

 

But keep blaming Spiller, I guess if you say it enough you might just convince someone. Im not that guy...

[Section242]

If the basis is Brown has potential than I could buy into that. Just looking at numbers he was bad last year. Aside from one game he's a guy who had 66 carries for 199 yards. He's averaged 4.6 yards for two seasons. His two most impressive games we're followed by two with a combined 28 carries for 40 yards.

 

Really his game log makes him look like a "poor mans Spiller."

[FireChan]

Hmmmm...I guess an entire game is based on a RB in your world. Where are the notes on which scrub was QB? One of those games was 5 INT Flynn...how about the factors I stated that you always ignore? What about the WR's, OL, TE, QB's which all missed times at various times throughout the season...most importantly the FOUR starting QB's we had (EJ, Thad, Tuel, Flynn), 2 of which were rookies, one of which missed time as a rookie, one of which was a 3rd string QB acquired the week before the season started, another a guy cut by 3 straight teams and signed mid season because even our backups were hurt...another who was a PS QB yet had to play do to injury...Oh, then there is that pesky thing of QB being the most important position in all of organized sports. Then that is that pesky thing of Freddie being hurt too. Then there is that pesky thing of Spiller battling injury. Then there is that pesky thing of having an offense that can't do anything as a unit with a defense stacking 8 in the box every play because we can't pass. Then there is that pesky thing of a rookie coaching staff. Then there is that pesky issue all RB's have of not getting a rhythm without consistent carries.

 

None of that is in your facts...yet we still had 2 backs over 900 yards, both of which battled injuries. We still saw Spiller avg 4.6 ypc (worst of his career and still better than most RB's in the league) and go for over 900 yards in what was a disaster year for the WHOLE TEAM.

 

But keep blaming Spiller, I guess if you say it enough you might just convince someone. Im not that guy...

 

I'm sorry, you asked me to provide facts. I haven't seen you provide any.

 

Matt Flynn didn't see the field once in Buffalo. Not for a second.

 

Spiller's best game came when Jeff Tuel was under center. And while he was still battling injury. So I don't think you even read my post. Because you're making the same tired arguments that I just disproved. Are you planning on describing how the "play-calls" changed? You said it was the reason for CJ's turn around. What did they change?

 

Fred Jackson got hurt, and Spiller played worse because of that? What? Just what?

 

But wait, Fred Jackson got hurt and Spiller played worse, but Spiller also couldn't get a rhythm when Freddy was playing? So he can't play with Fred or without Fred? Yikes.

 

How many games did Scott Chandler miss? How did that affect Spiller? Provide examples.

 

How many games did Robert Woods miss? How did that affect Spiller? Provide examples.

 

How many games did Glenn, Urbik, Pears, Wood, Legursky miss? How did that affect Spiller? Provide examples.

 

You really should never accuse someone of talking out of their ass, when the only number you can throw around is 4.6 YPC.

Edited June 25, 2014 by FireChan

[mrags]

 

 

I'm sorry, you asked me to provide facts. I haven't seen you provide any.

 

Matt Flynn didn't see the field once in Buffalo. Not for a second.

 

Spiller's best game came when Jeff Tuel was under center. And while he was still battling injury. So I don't think you even read my post. Because you're making the same tired arguments that I just disproved.

shhhhh...

 

Can't provide facts here and still hold and argument. It's a pesky thing those stats that are actually measurable. Unlike how injired a player was. Or how terrible the team was around him. Or how much defenses stacked the box. It's funny that Adrian Peterson, Matt Forte, MJD never have issues with all this and they play on just as miserable teams as we had. It's a pesky thing to think about.

[What a Tuel]

well. Let's answer this for the 1,000th time in this thread.

 

2. Your 6 games he "played and did awesome in" in 2011 averaged just over 70 yards a game. That's way less than AWESOME!!! When was the last time you sat in front of your computer looking at fantasy football points and thought... "Damn, my RB tore it up for me today. He got me 7 points"

...laughable

 

Have a nice day.

 

 

To be honest, I stopped reading right here. You seem to be confusing real football with fantasy football.

[FireChan]

To be honest, I stopped reading right here. You seem to be confusing real football with fantasy football.

 

I have a question. Were you on TBD in 2012?

[What a Tuel]

I have a question. Were you on TBD in 2012?

 

I might have been looking at it occasionally, but no I wasn't posting.

Edited June 25, 2014 by What a Tuel

[mrags]

 

 

To be honest, I stopped reading right here. You seem to be confusing real football with fantasy football.

im not confusing anything. I'm simply stating a point. You must be confusing good RBs with ones that are often injured, get the ball more than 15 times a game, can be counted on, has over 1,000 yards, and actually scores TDs.

 

You wanna talk about real vs fantasy. You have it right there. A RB that can't run the ball up the middle. A RB that has pulled up out of bounds when were trying to kill the clock. A RB that gets winded and his coach even says so. People wanted to throw Chan under the bus for that hit he was right. Hackett proved it last year. He can't do it full time. He's a situational RB at best. A good one when he's on, but that's hit or miss.

Edited June 25, 2014 by mrags