Unstoppable CJ

[Maury Ballstein]

In 2013 7 RB's beat or were near that total in rushing yards alone.

 

22 players were over 1,300 yards combined from scrimmage.

 

Here is an interesting look at RB "value" (my word, not theirs) from Football Outsiders.

 

Did any of then split carries with that stud Fred-ex ? I would go much higher without that factor,

 

I billieve ! And billieve people forgetting 12 way way too fast, jmo.

[mrags]

 

 

Bok Bok. Bok Bok.

 

953 yards last year. Why would he get 1300 ?

ugh. Again. Your not paying attention. Just stop.

 

 

 

Did any of then split carries with that stud Fred-ex ? I would go much higher without that factor,

 

I billieve ! And billieve people forgetting 12 way way too fast, jmo.

more excuses.

[Maury Ballstein]

What's your excuse ? 30 posts full of baloney in regards to spiller but scared of a little avatar bet over 1300 yards ?

 

Gotcha. Thought you believed in all that was said. Guess we will pick this conversation back up around week 7.

 

#longlivethewaterbug

Edited June 26, 2014 by Ryan L Billz

[FireChan]

 

 

There's a ton of talk of that but everyone backs down when there is actually is action.

 

Except I never said that. So uh, yeah.

 

Though I'm not a big believer in the wisdom of the masses, it is interesting to me that of the 208 previous replies in this thread, 40 were from one particular poster who thinks Spiller is a terrible RB.....and 22 from a second poster with similar thoughts. It seems that perhaps only a small very vocal percent of people rate his negatives far higher than his positives.

 

It seems strange, but I am often finding myself wanting certain players to succeed just to spite the dogmaticly negative posters as much as wanting them to succeed simply because they are Bills players.

 

Here's the thing. I'd love for Spiller to go for 3 thousand yards. I don't think he will, and I know that if the Bills didn't re-sign him next season (which I don't think they will, because he won't take reasonable money) this place will erupt. Calling for Marrone's head and Whaley's head.

 

Just read some of these posts. There's no analysis of CJ's games from last year, just a post about his inflated YPC. He's a god no matter what. No one even admits he had a disappointing year. And while I admit my take is "negative" I give CJ credit on good games. I just don't call him

Barry Sanders. Besides, this is a discussion that I am best suited to have on TBD, so me posting a lot about it has nothing to do with being "dogmatically negative."

 

I also feel personally responsible for the Chan firing. I thought Chan misused Spiller and needed to go. I changed my tune. I wear this name for repentance.

 

 

[C.Biscuit97]

Except I never said that. So uh, yeah.

 

 

 

Here's the thing. I'd love for Spiller to go for 3 thousand yards. I don't think he will, and I know that if the Bills didn't re-sign him next season (which I don't think they will, because he won't take reasonable money) this place will erupt. Calling for Marrone's head and Whaley's head.

 

Just read some of these posts. There's no analysis of CJ's games from last year, just a post about his inflated YPC. He's a god no matter what. No one even admits he had a disappointing year. And while I admit my take is "negative" I give CJ credit on good games. I just don't call him

Barry Sanders. Besides, this is a discussion that I am best suited to have on TBD, so me posting a lot about it has nothing to do with being "dogmatically negative."

 

I also feel personally responsible for the Chan firing. I thought Chan misused Spiller and needed to go. I changed my tune. I wear this name for repentance.

 

Ah, this argument. Not one person said that. I love that thinking. It's similar to if you don't want to run Manuel out of town after his rookie year, you are an apologist.

 

Why can't some people see that situation matters just as much as talent. For all the pimping of LeSean McCoy, he had 840 yards and a 4.2 ypc in 2012. http://www.nfl.com/player/leseanmccoy/79607/profile If Spiller "sucks" with nearly 1,000 yards and 4.6 ypc, McCoy must have been one of the worst rbs in NFL history in 2012.

 

So did McCoy suddenly become a much better running back in 2013? Should we drug test him for roids? Or did his situation improve? Better QB, better oline play, better playcalling, stayed more healthy.

 

Talent wise, Spiller is a top 5 rb without a doubt in my mind. But he still needs a good situation around him as much players do. The situation wasn't great last year. (Now some will say that FJax played in the same situation, which makes no sense because Spiller outproduced him. )

[mrags]

What's your excuse ? 30 posts full of baloney in regards to spiller but scared of a little avatar bet over 1300 yards ?

 

Gotcha. Thought you believed in all that was said. Guess we will pick this conversation back up around week 7.

 

#longlivethewaterbug

I'm not scared of anything. I already told you people that I don't think Spiller will have over 1,000 yards rushing. He'll have another disappointing year. Originally the bet was 1,300 total yards rushing. Now all the sudden you want me to bet 1,300 yards from scrimmage. Which Beerball kindly admitted that 1,300 yards offense isn't hard to do. But regardless, Ive said he won't even get that. Your the ones Making excuses that he'll be shorted because of sharing carries with Freddy and Brown. I believe Brown will be the starter by mid season. So with my thoughts, I obviously think CJ will be another disappointment this season since he will lose his starting job which is funny because he's never been able to wrangle that job away from a 30+ year old back that also hasn't finished a season without being injured in the last 4 years.

[C.Biscuit97]

I'm not scared of anything. I already told you people that I don't think Spiller will have over 1,000 yards rushing. He'll have another disappointing year. Originally the bet was 1,300 total yards rushing. Now all the sudden you want me to bet 1,300 yards from scrimmage. Which Beerball kindly admitted that 1,300 yards offense isn't hard to do. But regardless, Ive said he won't even get that. Your the ones Making excuses that he'll be shorted because of sharing carries with Freddy and Brown. I believe Brown will be the starter by mid season. So with my thoughts, I obviously think CJ will be another disappointment this season since he will lose his starting job which is funny because he's never been able to wrangle that job away from a 30+ year old back that also hasn't finished a season without being injured in the last 4 years.

 

Did LeSean McCoy suck in 2012?

[K-9]

I'm not scared of anything. I already told you people that I don't think Spiller will have over 1,000 yards rushing. He'll have another disappointing year. Originally the bet was 1,300 total yards rushing. Now all the sudden you want me to bet 1,300 yards from scrimmage. Which Beerball kindly admitted that 1,300 yards offense isn't hard to do. But regardless, Ive said he won't even get that. Your the ones Making excuses that he'll be shorted because of sharing carries with Freddy and Brown. I believe Brown will be the starter by mid season. So with my thoughts, I obviously think CJ will be another disappointment this season since he will lose his starting job which is funny because he's never been able to wrangle that job away from a 30+ year old back that also hasn't finished a season without being injured in the last 4 years.

 

1300 yards from scrimmage in a platoon system is not an easy thing for the typical RB to do.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[mrags]

 

 

Ah, this argument. Not one person said that. I love that thinking. It's similar to if you don't want to run Manuel out of town after his rookie year, you are an apologist.

 

Why can't some people see that situation matters just as much as talent. For all the pimping of LeSean McCoy, he had 840 yards and a 4.2 ypc in 2012. http://www.nfl.com/player/leseanmccoy/79607/profile If Spiller "sucks" with nearly 1,000 yards and 4.6 ypc, McCoy must have been one of the worst rbs in NFL history in 2012.

 

So did McCoy suddenly become a much better running back in 2013? Should we drug test him for roids? Or did his situation improve? Better QB, better oline play, better playcalling, stayed more healthy.

 

Talent wise, Spiller is a top 5 rb without a doubt in my mind. But he still needs a good situation around him as much players do. The situation wasn't great last year. (Now some will say that FJax played in the same situation, which makes no sense because Spiller outproduced him. )

fwiw I never brought up McCoy. Someone else did. But it shouldn't be tossed out that the majority of the football world believes that if he's not the best all around TB he's in the top 3. It should not be overlooked that career vs career McCoy has over 7,000 yards from scrimmage and 39 TDs while CJ has 4,000 yards and 17 TDs. McCoy has played only one more year than Spiller. So yeah, there's a huge difference.

[FireChan]

Did LeSean McCoy suck in 2012?

Ah, this argument. Not one person said that. I love that thinking. It's similar to if you don't want to run Manuel out of town after his rookie year, you are an apologist.

 

Why can't some people see that situation matters just as much as talent. For all the pimping of LeSean McCoy, he had 840 yards and a 4.2 ypc in 2012. http://www.nfl.com/p...y/79607/profile If Spiller "sucks" with nearly 1,000 yards and 4.6 ypc, McCoy must have been one of the worst rbs in NFL history in 2012.

 

So did McCoy suddenly become a much better running back in 2013? Should we drug test him for roids? Or did his situation improve? Better QB, better oline play, better playcalling, stayed more healthy.

 

Talent wise, Spiller is a top 5 rb without a doubt in my mind. But he still needs a good situation around him as much players do. The situation wasn't great last year. (Now some will say that FJax played in the same situation, which makes no sense because Spiller outproduced him. )

 

McCoy played only 12 games. Not 15.

[mrags]

 

 

Did LeSean McCoy suck in 2012?

see above. Stats speak for themselves. McCoy also has out up a 1,600 yard season rushing alone. Another 2 over 1,000 yards rushing as well CJ has only topped the 1,000 mark once. And has less than half as many TDs.

 

You brought McCoy into this. Not me.

 

 

 

 

McCoy played only 12 games. Not 15.

and this

 

 

 

1300 yards from scrimmage in a platoon system is not an easy thing for the typical RB to do.

 

GO BILLS!!!

again. More excuses. If CJ is/was so good, why can't he beat out an often inured, 30+ year old RB?

[C.Biscuit97]

McCoy played only 12 games. Not 15.

 

Because he's soft and got injured right? Spiller should have sat out and not toughed it out.

 

see above. Stats speak for themselves. McCoy also has out up a 1,600 yard season rushing alone. Another 2 over 1,000 yards rushing as well CJ has only topped the 1,000 mark once. And has less than half as many TDs.

 

You brought McCoy into this. Not me.

 

and this

 

again. More excuses. If CJ is/was so good, why can't he beat out an often inured, 30+ year old RB?

 

He was their only back. Despite the Bills' new savior, Bryce Brown, he got most of the carries.

 

And for the last 2 years, CJ outproduced Jackson! and Jackson is a very good rb in his ownright and should get carries. In 2011, Jackson was a MVP candidate until he got hurt. He's good too.

[mrags]

 

 

Because he's soft and got injured right? Spiller should have sat out and not toughed it out.

 

 

 

He was their only back. Despite the Bills' new savior, Bryce Brown, he got most of the carries.

 

And for the last 2 years, CJ outproduced Jackson! and Jackson is a very good rb in his ownright and should get carries. In 2011, Jackson was a MVP candidate until he got hurt. He's good too.

because he's injured right? Well, let's look at that. In 15 games, CJ had 1,100 total yards from scrimmage and 2 TDs. McCoy had over 1,300 yards and 5TDs in 12 games. So yeah, there's a difference. CJ played. Hurt or not. He played. You think McCoy wasn't hurt in other games?

 

Again, you brought McCoy into this. Not me. There's no argument.

 

CJ only beat Jackson a few years ago because of a Jackson injury. He also fizzled down the stretch as well.

 

And I'm not arguing the fact that Jackson is a good RBs. I'm simply stating the fact that if CJ was as good as so many of you here believe, he wouldn't have any problem taking carries away from other RBs on the roster. He would simply be too good to take a back seat. But he's NEVER done that. But keep up the crusade.

Edited June 26, 2014 by mrags

[C.Biscuit97]

because he's injured right? Well, let's look at that. In 15 games, CJ had 1,100 total yards from scrimmage and 2 TDs. McCoy had over 1,300 yards and 5TDs in 12 games. So yeah, there's a difference. CJ played. Hurt or not. He played. You think McCoy wasn't hurt in other games?

 

Again, you brought McCoy into this. Not me. There's no argument.

 

CJ only beat Jackson a few years ago because of a Jackson injury. He also fizzled down the stretch as well.

 

And I'm not arguing the fact that Jackson is a good RBs. I'm simply stating the fact that if CJ was as good as so many of you here believe, he wouldn't have any problem taking carries away from other RNs on the roster. He would simply be too good to take a back seat. But he's NEVER done that. But keep up the crusade.

 

 

The best thing you've said in the thread. Hilarious.

 

[K-9]

see above. Stats speak for themselves. McCoy also has out up a 1,600 yard season rushing alone. Another 2 over 1,000 yards rushing as well CJ has only topped the 1,000 mark once. And has less than half as many TDs.

 

You brought McCoy into this. Not me.

 

and this

 

again. More excuses. If CJ is/was so good, why can't he beat out an often inured, 30+ year old RB?

 

Because Freddy is a good RB and a perfect compliment for the platoon system Marrone prefers to run in his up tempo offense. CJ is the starter and Freddy comes in depending on the situation. And there's no question Freddy is a better blocker with a better feel for the game. So it's not a question of "beating him out" as you put it. It's a bit more nuanced given the system Marrone runs. I think CJ may have some durability concerns as well. But he's a homerun threat with physical attributes that Freddy or few other RBs for that matter, can come close to copying.

 

I don't offer any excuses for CJ or any other player. It's funny how detractors always look at realistic and reasoned understanding of a situation and make the claim that it's offering excuses for a player.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[mrags]

 

 

 

The best thing you've said in the thread. Hilarious.

 

and you don't think that people with different opinions can ever be correct? Hmmm. Now it all makes sense. I'm done here because apparently your opinion is the only one that matters. Your just pissed off I brought stats into the argument and showed how incorrect you were about McCoy.

[C.Biscuit97]

Because Freddy is a good RB and a perfect compliment for the platoon system Marrone prefers to run in his up tempo offense. CJ is the starter and Freddy comes in depending on the situation. And there's no question Freddy is a better blocker with a better feel for the game. So it's not a question of "beating him out" as you put it. It's a bit more nuanced given the system Marrone runs. I think CJ may have some durability concerns as well. But he's a homerun threat with physical attributes that Freddy or few other RBs for that matter, can come close to copying.

 

I don't offer any excuses for CJ or any other player. It's funny how detractors always look at realistic and reasoned understanding of a situation and make the claim that it's offering excuses for a player.

 

GO BILLS!!!

 

Great post. For some reason to like Jackson, you have to knock Spiller down. I don't get it. They're both Bills. And those who don't think Spiller beat out Fred the last 2 years, they need to check the stats again.

[mrags]

 

 

Because Freddy is a good RB and a perfect compliment for the platoon system Marrone prefers to run in his up tempo offense. CJ is the starter and Freddy comes in depending on the situation. And there's no question Freddy is a better blocker with a better feel for the game. So it's not a question of "beating him out" as you put it. It's a bit more nuanced given the system Marrone runs. I think CJ may have some durability concerns as well. But he's a homerun threat with physical attributes that Freddy or few other RBs for that matter, can come close to copying.

 

I don't offer any excuses for CJ or any other player. It's funny how detractors always look at realistic and reasoned understanding of a situation and make the claim that it's offering excuses for a player.

 

GO BILLS!!!

a first round draft pick taken in the top 10 and a player that so many people like to give excises for as to why he's not producing 1,000+ seasons every year are exactly that. Excuses. Bad ones too.

 

Again, if the player is that good, you find ways to get him on the field and contribute as many times as possible. Not take him out because another player is a better blocker or better at picking up short yardage. What happened to other teams having to gameplan for CJ? So what your saying is they would take him off the field in situations where they should have him on the field most.

 

Yeah. Makes sense.

[C.Biscuit97]

and you don't think that people with different opinions can ever be correct? Hmmm. Now it all makes sense. I'm done here because apparently your opinion is the only one that matters. Your just pissed off I brought stats into the argument and showed how incorrect you were about McCoy.

 

I've disagreed with your opinion but I can't say it's wrong. IT's your opinion. But you stated Spiller sucks. You came back from them but IMO, you don't take in account other factors that hurt production. You call them excuses. Yet when I bring up McCoy's 2012 season, you find ways to defend it. If I was you, I'd call those excuses.

[mrags]

 

 

Great post. For some reason to like Jackson, you have to knock Spiller down. I don't get it. They're both Bills. And those who don't think Spiller beat out Fred the last 2 years, they need to check the stats again.

if you don't think Freddy OUTPLAYED CJ last year , I don't think I can keep up this argument because you apparently weren't watching. There's much more to this argument besides stats. Edited June 26, 2014 by mrags