Doc Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 If you think that they may do that you don't think that it crossed the minds of the trust? That is the point. Their word will not be good enough. Thanks CBF!! Thanks for the insight. But just to be clear, are you saying that the Toronto group would keep the Bills in Buffalo past the 7th year out, or that they won't get the team because the trust sees through them? I do realize that there's no real way for you to know the Toronto group's true intentions (...or do you?).
Kirby Jackson Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) Bandit, I think that the way that the trust is set up really hinders bidders that they don't want. It is not some blind auction where everyone submits a bid and the highest number wins. Whose to say that they don't go back to Pegula and say "we need you to be at $___?" I sell small businesses now for a living and I have done stuff like this to get the best fit in place. If there is a better buyer I will try to get them up to a price and terms that best satisfy the seller. You really can't reveal other's bids as a broker (the trust may actually be able to which would be a game changer). Either way, it really isn't a fair process for everyone. I would not even be a little surprised if this kind of thing goes on. The NDA is strictly in place to keep their financial information private. On a side note I will gladly accept your offer. It is tough to get Canadian beers down here. Thanks for the insight. But just to be clear, are you saying that the Toronto group would keep the Bills in Buffalo past the 7th year out, or that they won't get the team because the trust sees through them? I do realize that there's no real way for you to know the Toronto group's true intentions (...or do you?). A little bit of both. If they want a shot at the team they are going to have to commit to WNY otherwise they will pick someone else. They will not accept them at their word either. Edited July 29, 2014 by Kirby Jackson
K D Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 I have asked you this question at least 5 times, and I sincerely would like an answer if you're going to continue to say this: why do you think that a simple "we promise" is going to be good enough to satisfy the Trust's requirements? We have not heard otherwise and there's no way they would sign something saying they HAVE to stay in Buffalo because they need a new stadium and they would have no leverage to get the state to put money in if the state knew they had to stay. Even Ralph would threaten to leave during negotiations. It's the only hand owners have when negotiating leases. If the Toronto group had to stay in Buffalo then they wouldn't even be bidding
thebandit27 Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Bandit, I think that the way that the trust is set up really hinders bidders that they don't want. It is not some blind auction where everyone submits a bid and the highest number wins. Whose to say that they don't go back to Pegula and say "we need you to be at $___?" I sell small businesses now for a living and I have done stuff like this to get the best fit in place. If there is a better buyer I will try to get them up to a price and terms that best satisfy the seller. You really can't reveal other's bids as a broker (the trust may actually be able to which would be a game changer). Either way, it really isn't a fair process for everyone. I would not even be a little surprised if this kind of thing goes on. The NDA is strictly in place to keep their financial information private. On a side note I will gladly accept your offer. It is tough to get Canadian beers down here. A little bit of both. If they want a shot at the team they are going to have to commit to WNY otherwise they will pick someone else. They will not accept them at their word either. Nor would I...in fact I half expect it. We have not heard otherwise and there's no way they would sign something saying they HAVE to stay in Buffalo because they need a new stadium and they would have no leverage to get the state to put money in if the state knew they had to stay. Even Ralph would threaten to leave during negotiations. It's the only hand owners have when negotiating leases. If the Toronto group had to stay in Buffalo then they wouldn't even be bidding I'm not sure they're terribly worried about the state pitching in money, nor am I convinced that the state would contribute nothing to the pot. Yes, it would be a negotiation, but the amount that the state would be expected to provide isn't exactly mind-blowing. The team will provide a good amount, as would the local municipality; kick in low-interest cash from the NFL's G4 program and you're most of the way there.
stony Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Anything in this board that I have ever said would happened has come true. Most recently "sources" are saying that Cordy Glenn will be back for at least 1 preseason game and the start of the regular season. I said that 5 minutes after the rumors started that he would be out for a long time. If you choose to wait and see -go for it. I have gotten about 30 PMs from people saying thank you for sharing what I know. With that being said I will continue to do so. 1/4 of the people that voted that the Toronto group would keep the team in WNY are probably 2 of the most plugged in posters on the board. That is why I asked to make it a public poll. Regardless of how many people think that they will keep the team, that will be the case. JBJ and company would rather have a team in TO but that isn't an option here. They want an NFL team 1st and a team in Toronto 2nd. Lastly, there will not be a $2B offer like the Clips. There are no local TV rights associated with the NFL which is why the Dodgers and Clippers sold for $2B. There are a lot of groups bidding on the Bills and the number will be higher than experts have speculated. I have been stuck on $1.2B since the process started. Nothing has changed my mind to think that it will be lower. Thank you for driving this home. Many people think given the Clippers sale, all of a sudden NFL prices will go through the roof. Not true, as you point out. NBA teams benefit from local and national deals, as well as a new projected streaming deal overseas with China I believe. It'll be hard for some to comprehend as football is more popular in America, but soon, many NBA teams will be more valuable than NFL teams given the popularity of basketball world-wide.
C.Biscuit97 Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Wait. Trump just did a lot of talking and now he admits that he really has now chance the whole time? What a joke this guy is. The male Paris Hilton. Only thing worse than him is people who actually take him serious.
YoloinOhio Posted July 29, 2014 Author Posted July 29, 2014 @BuffRumblings: Non-binding bids are due today at 5. The potential ownership pool will be defined. @ByTimGraham takes this look: http://t.co/p6EaBUNeDC
mannc Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 A little bit of both. If they want a shot at the team they are going to have to commit to WNY otherwise they will pick someone else. They will not accept them at their word either. How do you know this? Have the terms of the trust been made public?
thebandit27 Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 How do you know this? Have the terms of the trust been made public? No, but rest assured, he knows (seriously).
richNjoisy Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Kirby - first off, thanks for the input you provide. Your latest comment (which I bet you already posted but I can't recall) pretty clearly states that any bidder must IN WRITING agree to never move the Bills (you just wrote, "their word won't be good enough"). But I am trying to get a handle on what this would mean for ANY bidder (even if it were Jim Kelly which I know is ridiculous but I am using him as the "guy who would never move the Bills" example). How can a multi- billionaire sign away all his/her rights to at least have the option of running their business where they want to? They could never use the threat to get money for stadium repairs, etc etc. Ralph never truly intended to move the team but he sure used the threat occasionally, didn't he? We have had a few (pseudo?) lawyers on this site talking about how contracts aren't worth the paper they are written on. So, are you still certain that any buyer will not have the option...at all.....to move the team....ever? Well, hopefully, the signed document will have enough teeth to keep the team in Buffalo. But, I'm no lawyer...... Thanks again KJ for your posts.
mannc Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 No, but rest assured, he knows (seriously). Even if there were such a provision in the trust, which I doubt, I can't think of any way it could be enforced. The winning bidder certainly won't have to post an "I won't move the Bills" bond, and a restrictive covenant in the sale agreement would most likely be unenforceable in court. So you are left with only a non-binding statement of intent by the new buyer. That statement of intent will be worth even less in six years than it is worth now.
The Wiz Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 No, but rest assured, he knows (seriously). Kirby Jackson: Let me put it this way. Have you ever heard of Plato, Aristotle, Socrates? Morons.
CodeMonkey Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Even if there were such a provision in the trust, which I doubt, I can't think of any way it could be enforced. The winning bidder certainly won't have to post an "I won't move the Bills" bond, and a restrictive covenant in the sale agreement would most likely be unenforceable in court. So you are left with only a non-binding statement of intent by the new buyer. That statement of intent will be worth even less in six years than it is worth now. Of course. But it makes Bills fans feel better right now, which I believe is the main intent.
YoloinOhio Posted July 29, 2014 Author Posted July 29, 2014 @WGRZ: Big Day For #Bills Bidders http://t.co/qvdukivH0I #BillsMafia
beerme1 Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Anything in this board that I have ever said would happened has come true. Ha you've revealed your true identity Greggo! LOL Just kidding man.
Doc Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 Bandit, I think that the way that the trust is set up really hinders bidders that they don't want. It is not some blind auction where everyone submits a bid and the highest number wins. Whose to say that they don't go back to Pegula and say "we need you to be at $___?" I sell small businesses now for a living and I have done stuff like this to get the best fit in place. If there is a better buyer I will try to get them up to a price and terms that best satisfy the seller. You really can't reveal other's bids as a broker (the trust may actually be able to which would be a game changer). Either way, it really isn't a fair process for everyone. I would not even be a little surprised if this kind of thing goes on. The NDA is strictly in place to keep their financial information private. On a side note I will gladly accept your offer. It is tough to get Canadian beers down here. Wait, I thought Ralph told some reporter that the Bills would be auctioned-off to the highest bidder. You mean that's not true? A little bit of both. If they want a shot at the team they are going to have to commit to WNY otherwise they will pick someone else. They will not accept them at their word either. Unless they require the Toronto group to sign an agreement that says they will never move the team, their word means jack squat. I don't see them getting the team, period.
The Wiz Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 (edited) Wait, I thought Ralph told some reporter that the Bills would be auctioned-off to the highest bidder. You mean that's not true? Ralphs' sale price is cheap. Edited July 29, 2014 by The Wiz
YoloinOhio Posted July 29, 2014 Author Posted July 29, 2014 @john_kucko: From @SenSchumer "when it comes to the next owner of the Bills there can be only one litmus test: someone willing to keep the Bills in WNY." @TBNSports: Schumer: ‘A number of serious bidders’ would keep Bills in WNY. Story by @JerryZremski: http://t.co/OkRKAK1CV9
CodeMonkey Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 @john_kucko: From @SenSchumer "when it comes to the next owner of the Bills there can be only one litmus test: someone willing to keep the Bills in WNY." So the only thing that matters (or at least should matter) to the trustees is if the new owner would keep the Bills in WNY. Bidding price be damned I guess huh. Well, Chuckles is nothing if not his own best PR man
A Dog Named Kelso Posted July 29, 2014 Posted July 29, 2014 We appreciate your input and you have a good track record here. But sometimes you have to read between the lines. It's pretty obvious that the Toronto group is only saying they would stay in Buffalo because they have to in order to get the team. Step 1: Say you will stay in Buffalo (cross your fingers) Step 2: Buy the team Step 3: Say all the right things and stall Step 4: Make unreasonable demands for a new stadium Step 5: Say "sorry we tried to make it work in Buffalo" and then move to Toronto in 2020 or 2022 They can not just say "... it did not work in Buffalo". There are rules in place to prevent teams from just uprooting. I think if the local communities are working with the team in good faith to keep the team in its current location they can not just move. This is not just the team talking with the counties or state it is also the NFL so, the JBJ group couldn't just say "They aren't helping" and pull stakes without NFL picking up the phone and checking out their story.
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