YoloinOhio Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 Would a line up of Mike Williams, Sammy, Woods, Goodwin and Manual or Williams, Stevie, Woods, Goodwin and Bortles ( or another one of the early drafted QB's ) feel better right now. Somehow, reading about Manuel in OTA's is not making me feel good about the decision we made. When he says he Is trying to remain even keeled and not too emotional he sounds like Rob Johnson or Losman not a leader. Not being able to make a throw in practice sounds all too familiar. Bortles went 3rd so we would have had to give up next year's #1 pick anyway and that is assuming the Jags would do it, all indications were they would not trade the pick to anyone. That would be for a QB not ready to play this year as admitted by his own GM so we still have EJ, but no Watkins. Or, you could have the other 1st rounder, Johnny Vegas, last seen drunk-riding an inflatable swan with a bottle of booze. Fancy.
Beerball Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 How would 90% of NFL teams do if their starter stinks or gets hurt? Thad is an average NFL backup QB who isn't a starter. It's par for the course in the entire league. Of the 32 teams how many are going into a season with a starter who missed 6 games in his rookie season due to injury? The backup plan leaves something to be desired. Fingers are crossed. Funny how no one is worried if EJ turns out great. why would that be a worry for a Bills fan? The same thing that happens to any rookie who fails miserably the second year. He deals with fan outrage, possibly gets benched, and has to fight for a job the following year. The Bills aren't unique in this situation. I don't think he failed miserably. He showed flashes, but, missing 6 games is the (negative) key for my concern. Pretty much. Sometimes have to fish or cut bait. Fans wanted a QB drafted #1 in 2013 and that's what they got. Now we are developing him. You don't do that by tossing him out after one injury riddled season. So, we'll put you down in the "Thaddeus Lewis was the best backup option available" camp.
26TrapDraw Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 My two cents here. I think the injuries were just bad luck. What I do believe though is this kids attitude toward getting better. He's got the skill set to be a good QB. He seems willing to put the time in learn the position. I think he is going to do well like in anything if you work your tail off to get better you usually do. I think the hard work is going to pay off for EJ. I believe he takes that next step this season. LV
zow2 Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 If EJ stinks or gets injured then we're mostly screwed...Thad can play "don't get you killed" football for a few games, but he cannot win a game on his arm. EJ can; whether he can do so consistently is a big question mark for certain, but the ability to do so is there. I can't say the same for Thad or Tuel IMO. You say this but Thad's arm produced a few really nice downfield bombs. That was before he got to spend an entire offseason learning the playbook and schemes. I expect both EJ and Thad to be better in 2014 and if EJ stinks it up, I'd look forward to watching Thad Lewis.
YoloinOhio Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 You say this but Thad's arm produced a few really nice downfield bombs. That was before he got to spend an entire offseason learning the playbook and schemes. I expect both EJ and Thad to be better in 2014 and if EJ stinks it up, I'd look forward to watching Thad Lewis. It would be interesting to know that the barometer would be on yanking EJ due to performance though. Considering they are all in. It is a sticky situation to bench him if he isn't hurt.
thebandit27 Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 You say this but Thad's arm produced a few really nice downfield bombs. That was before he got to spend an entire offseason learning the playbook and schemes. I expect both EJ and Thad to be better in 2014 and if EJ stinks it up, I'd look forward to watching Thad Lewis. Again, I'm not speaking specifically to arm strength; more to the issue of being able to make a clutch throw to win a game. We've seen EJ do it, albeit inconsistently; we haven't seen Thad do it. That's all I'm saying.
Braedenstearns Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 Thad is a decent backup.... first play I thought of. http://www.nfl.com/videos/buffalo-bills/0ap2000000305908/T-J-Graham-41-yard-reception Perfect deep pass to TJ With a wet ball.
Section242 Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 Marrone and Whaley get fired if new ownership is in place.
BarleyNY Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 If EJ sucks and/or gets injured I guess I'd start by getting depressed early for the 2015 Bills season. Let's face it, that's the big risk here. If we are halfway through the season and EJ looks bad, then we know it will take a "rabbit out of the hat" move by the FO to effectively address the QB spot for 2015. Even if the Bills still had their 1st round pick it is a tall order to find a quality QB. And if EJ is very bad it is likely that the 1st round pick will be high in the draft. That's (obviously) the natural spot to get a good QB prospect. So the FO has taken away the team's best hedge for EJ failing. That should even make EJ's biggest supporters nervous. If EJ shows he can be a quality QB in this league, then there's no problem. We can all hope for that, but I'm one to plan for all contingencies. That hasn't been done here. Not addressing the QB spot with even a developmental player was a big mistake IMO. Why not bring in a mid to late round prospect who has upside? He wouldn't have been an immediate threat to EJ's job as starter, but doing so would have at least given the team an "out" in 2015 or beyond if EJ failed. I really think the FO failed the team in this regard. If it doesn't work out then they'll pay the price.
dollars 2 donuts Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 (edited) The ominous issue isn't what do you do if EJ gets hurt so much (part of the environment every team has to deal with)it is what do you do if EJ is ineffective. Do you continue to invest in him at the expense of the offense built to play now or do you pursue other options? Do I believe that EJ is ready to be a starter? At this point I simply don't know. No one does. The one issue that bothers me the most is that I am not sure that he has the level of accuracy for the pro game. Having all the physical tools means little if one doesn't have the degree of accuracy for the pro passing game with very tight spaces. As you stated you go with what you got. There is nothing else you can do. Maybe a veteran like a Cassel type qb would have been a good option to get temporarily by if the young qb doesn't progress at the pace he should. Whaley and the organization believe in him and are invested in him. Although I am queasy about him I think he will work out???? I honestly think the young man will work out. However, if he finishes the season with 14 starts, 18 tds, 12 picks and is still completing less than 60% of his passes I'm not sure what you do with him. What am i hoping for, given 14 starts? At least 24 tds less than 14 ints more than 3,200 yards completing no less than 60% of his passes ...and please oh please at least 7-7, but preferably 8-6. EDIT: and hey, look, I love our RBs and I know you have to be able to run the ball in Buffalo, but sooner or later this team has to get into this century and start averaging 225-240 yards a game passing. Edited June 11, 2014 by dollars 2 donuts
Rocky Landing Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 I honestly think the young man will work out. However, if he finishes the season with 14 starts, 18 tds, 12 picks and is still completing less than 60% of his passes I'm not sure what you do with him. What am i hoping for, given 14 starts? At least 24 tds less than 14 ints more than 3,200 yards completing no less than 60% of his passes ...and please oh please at least 7-7, but preferably 8-6. EDIT: and hey, look, I love our RBs and I know you have to be able to run the ball in Buffalo, but sooner or later this team has to get into this century and start averaging 225-240 yards a game passing. Possibly the most depressing quote in this thread.
Kirby Jackson Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 If EJ sucks and/or gets injured I guess I'd start by getting depressed early for the 2015 Bills season. Let's face it, that's the big risk here. If we are halfway through the season and EJ looks bad, then we know it will take a "rabbit out of the hat" move by the FO to effectively address the QB spot for 2015. Even if the Bills still had their 1st round pick it is a tall order to find a quality QB. And if EJ is very bad it is likely that the 1st round pick will be high in the draft. That's (obviously) the natural spot to get a good QB prospect. So the FO has taken away the team's best hedge for EJ failing. That should even make EJ's biggest supporters nervous. If EJ shows he can be a quality QB in this league, then there's no problem. We can all hope for that, but I'm one to plan for all contingencies. That hasn't been done here. Not addressing the QB spot with even a developmental player was a big mistake IMO. Why not bring in a mid to late round prospect who has upside? He wouldn't have been an immediate threat to EJ's job as starter, but doing so would have at least given the team an "out" in 2015 or beyond if EJ failed. I really think the FO failed the team in this regard. If it doesn't work out then they'll pay the price. I am by no means EJ's biggest fan (or hater). I have some reservations based on what I have seen but think that he has a chance. With that being said I still have no issue with the move for Watkins. They had him as the best player in a great draft. He can be a game changer and has a high floor. You only have so many opportunities to add elite (not good) players and he can be that. This team is built to win now. If EJ isn't that guy I think that they will miss their window waiting on another rookie to develop. If he is not the guy they will have to acquire a veteran that is ready to play and win now. I understand that the Bills don't have a 1st to trade but often 1-2 shake loose. I could see Bradford, Dalton (if they don't in alone his extension), Smith, Cutler, Romo, Palmer, Cassell, Roethlisberger, Cousins, Mallett, Hoyer, or Henne. Obviously, some are better options than others. Bradford or Romo would be realistic options IMO. If the Cowboys win 5 games are they going to pay that price tag for a 35 year old QB? The Bills could deal a 2nd for him and keep him for 3-4 years.
Rocky Landing Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 The metaphor that has been used over, and over again, "all in," is really quite apt for this situation. What happens when you go all in, and don't win the hand? There is no plan-B at that point. Thad Lewis, while a decent back-up, is not a plan-B. If we can't win with EJ, we aren't going to win with Lewis or Tuel. Or, am I wrong? Could Lewis break into the next level? Stranger things have happened.
Since 1972 Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 Yup. And obviously Whaley and Marrone aren't terribly worried about Manuel or they would have not traded next years first round draft pick for Watkins. They know more than we do so don't worry, be happy at this point Nice disclaimer
K-9 Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 It would be interesting to know that the barometer would be on yanking EJ due to performance though. Considering they are all in. It is a sticky situation to bench him if he isn't hurt. The barometer is how the rest of the team is responding, or not, to EJ's play. If he is clearly stinking it up, the rest of the team, especially the vets, won't abide by that. It's a pretty easy temperature to gauge, actually. There's just no place to hide when your suckitude is so blatant on the field and in film review. I don't think coaches want their credibility questioned either. GO BILLS!!!
HamSandwhich Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 I saw Brown say that Thad had more zip in practice, yeah. Although I think EJ has the stronger arm overall, I was more talking about whether or not he could make the throws in the clutch to win a game; not necessarily about his literal arm strength. We've seen EJ do it (both against Carolina and Atlanta), just not consistently. If we need to rely on the other two to do so, my hopes are not high. That's all I was saying. I agree, was just in a ball busting mood.
Hazed and Amuzed Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 I think this team will be a playoff contender even if EJ just turns out just better than average. There's a lot of talent on both sides of the ball, I'm more concerned with Marrones abilities at this point. I do like him better than Gailey but I'm not convinced yet that he's the guy. I think another poor year and Whaleys got to consider making a change there. Whaley I trust at this point, he's done nothing so far to prove to me otherwise.
Best Player Available Posted June 11, 2014 Posted June 11, 2014 (edited) Yup. And obviously Whaley and Marrone aren't terribly worried about Manuel or they would have not traded next years first round draft pick for Watkins. They know more than we do so don't worry, be happy at this point They may know more than anyone on this board. and, I for one would hope so.That said neither of them have done squat in terms of any success in the NFL, Marrone looked lost on the side line at times last year in regards to clock and game management. and the jury is definitely out on Whaley. Hackett well for now I have no comment. But cronyism runs deep on this staff. Crossman is proof. So, The validity of your point is very much up for debate. Those guys and their assistants are all playing for their jobs in 14. The new DC? Well again I hope he kicks butt. That said he is probably a one or two year rental like Pettine. So, where does that put the D if they go lights out this year. A fifth scheme change in 6 years? Edited June 11, 2014 by Best Player Available
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