WEDG Report: Rogers meets with Cuomo & Bills

[Homey D. Clown]

The Bills as an asset, just like any other asset can be sold to whomever the possessor chooses. The team was left to Mary Wilson and the Wilson estate. She could keep the team if she so desired, but has instead hired a firm to oversee the sale of this asset. She can empower the trust to make the final decision, or have the final say herself. I am guessing here that Morgan Stanley has been advised by her and Erie County to select the offer that has the best interests of Western New York in mind. I would be willing to bet my life on that, but I'm just guessing. You don't write hundreds of millions of dollars worth of checks over the last 50+ years as investment in something and not get to have some influence on it's new owner. With that in mind this is not a sale to the highest bidder type of arrangement, so I could Care less what Rogers said in the media. It's no different than me selling my house, I can select from several offers if I had multiple offer sheets presented to me, end the offers I selected would have no legal recourse against me for not selecting them. None, zip. Zero. Nada. Nyet. Nein... You get the point. There is publicly stated criteria in the search for a new owner, and it has been made perfectly clear that they are seeking an owner with intention to keep the team in WNY. From these alleged comments from Rogers, they are publicly making themselves ineligible to bid.

 

My .02 Dollars worth, and I could care less who disagrees with me on this, because it's really all speculation on the language of the sale, which none of us have.

Edited June 6, 2014 by Homey D. Clown

[BarleyNY]

 

 

Points taken, only difference is Cleveland's owner was alive and he moved the team. If Mary Wilson sells the team to someone who will move them, she completely taints her husband's legacy. IMO, I don't think she wants to do that. Art Moddell willingly tainted his own legacy.

So Mary Wilson wouldn't taint her deceased husband's name for something in the neighborhood of an extra quarter of a billion dollars? Heck, she could sell under a tacit public agreement that the new owner would keep the team here (nothing legally binding, of course). Then the new owner moves citing a lack of commitment by Buffalo (read: didn't get the deal he wanted here, but found it somewhere else). She can then say she was as blindsided as the rest of the city. While that might still tarnish her reputation somewhat, I doubt it impacts her husband's.

[Wayne Cubed]

Very similar to the arguments in Cleveland circa 1995. If there is more money to be made, then there is a way out for the owner. And who says they'll move the Bills the instant they buy them? They could time it as they saw fit. If there is a move to Toronto there is a temporary stadium in places to use while a dedicated one is built. They actually have an advantage over other cities with that. I'm sure they could get a temporary exemption for attendance for a year or two. None of the arguments against a move is something that can't be worked around. I saw it up close last time and would rather not go through it again here, but the situations look too similar for my comfort.

 

Of course they could move the team when the lease allows but that's not what I was arguing. The OP says that on the radio they are saying that Rogers(the corporation), is planning on moving the team next year. For the points I listed, I just don't see it being possible.

[Mike in Horseheads]

I just googled this meeting and the only link it comes up on is this site, its not being reported by any media outlet.

Like I said Schumer and Cuomo wouldn't give Rodgers the time of day unless it was to revoke their passports.

[BarleyNY]

Every situation is unique because of their lease deals. There are no situations that are completely alike. If a move is to take place it will be in 2020.

The lease is the best thing about the current situation IMO, but any contract can be broken for the right price. The Browns only had two years left on their lease (with no buyout) and got nothing but the team name and colors for Model breaking it. The Bills have 5 seasons before a buyout is contractually permissible, but the sale could take this season (or longer) to complete. Time can tick away quickly.

[Captain Hindsight]

been done, not in best interest of the overall trust.

 

 

 

Incorrect as usual when on this subject, but it will play out how it should

But wouldn't that have to be someone from the trust suing? I'm not Rogers has any claim he can make

[oman128]

Personally, I think Ralph thought that a $400 million dollar relocation penalty would scare away everyone. He didnt count on someone with 31 Billion in the bank saying ok to the 400 Million dollar penalty.

 

However, if someone is wiling to pay the 400 Million penalty, and be the top bidder, and have an NFL ready stadium to play in, that team will be sold and moved. Furthermore how much of the 400 Million windfall do you think that the Erie County will spend to save them?

 

Mary Wilson must have someone at Morgan Stanley cranking out the tax implications if she sells for 1 Billion or 2 Billion, how much capital gains there will be and how much she stands to benefit.

Edited June 6, 2014 by oman128

[Greg F]

That said if he offers 2 billion to the trust and they take a 1 billion offer to someone just because they want to keep it in Buffalo he can sue as well.

 

On what basis could he sue? The only ones that would have standing to sue would be the beneficiaries of the the trust.

 

What in the world are you talking about? Mary Wilson can sell the team for a penny if she wants. It's her team.

 

From all accounts the team is in a trust and therefore Mary doesn't own the team. Although the team could be sold for a dollar, in reality the trust is still responsible for the estate tax which is 40% of the 'fair market value' as defined by the IRS. If a scenario of two offers that Kellyto83TD proposes were to come to pass the IRS would likely consider the $2 billion as the 'fair market value' and asses the tax ($800 million) based on that figure.

 

3. He would then need approval from the NFL to move the team.

 

Don't underestimate Shumer's lack of ethics to utilize a IRS enema on select owners to avoid a vote of approval to move the team.

[Snorom]

Of course they could move the team when the lease allows but that's not what I was arguing. The OP says that on the radio they are saying that Rogers(the corporation), is planning on moving the team next year. For the points I listed, I just don't see it being possible.

 

 

if there is a $400 million buyout and he pays the $400 billion buyout then they can move the team. Any lawsuit will be tossed from the courts as frivolous.

 

Ralph said the team is to be sold to th ehighest bidder a couple of years before he passed. I just do not see Mrs. Wilson not honoring that.. If the bidding for the team goes over $1 billion the chances of the Bilsl remaining in Buffalo are slim

[WotAGuy]

If Mary Wilson sells the team to someone who will move them, she completely taints her husband's legacy. IMO, I don't think she wants to do that. Art Moddell willingly tainted his own legacy.

 

C'mon now, there's no reason to bring Mary Wilson's taint into this!

[Kirby Jackson]

 

The lease is the best thing about the current situation IMO, but any contract can be broken for the right price. The Browns only had two years left on their lease (with no buyout) and got nothing but the team name and colors for Model breaking it. The Bills have 5 seasons before a buyout is contractually permissible, but the sale could take this season (or longer) to complete. Time can tick away quickly.

There is no denying that they can move in 2020 but it is impossible to do so before that. I don't know the specifics of the Browns lease but the Bills lease and non relocation agreement are 100% ironclad. That is not unintentional. The faster that the sale takes place the better off WNY will be. I still am not that concerned. I started at about 75-25 that they were staying and I am at about 95-5 now.

[The Plunge]

All of this could have been avoided if Ralph would have sold a portion of the team to the next owner. Say what you want about Modell, but that's what he did in Baltimore. Ralph could have chosen his next owner, sold them 49% a couple of years ago and then would have the sale completed upon his death. Instead, he left us with this mess. Sure, he put provisions in place so that it would be DIFFICULT to move the team, but not IMPOSSIBLE. And with $Billions at stake, it is likely that we will see more than a few predators attempt to buy this club with the intention of moving them.

 

I know I'm going to get roasted for this. That's fine. But IF it turns out that someone buys the club and moves them, it will be because Ralph left the door open for that to happen.

 

Knowing that I'm going to get roasted, let me save you the trouble:

 

You idiot. Ralph did everything he could to keep them here. It's not his fault that a group from Toronto overpaid for the team. How was he supposed to know that someone would willingly pay the $400 million to move the club?

 

Right. Because Ralph had NO IDEA that that people like the Roger's family would pay whatever it took to get an NFL team in Toronto. He had NO IDEA that there is literally a lineup of billionaires who have dreamt of owning an NFL team. He had NO IDEA that an overpayment for the Bills plus a $400 million penalty might actually be CHEAPER than getting an expansion franchise, if that option ever presents itself.

 

You idiot. Ralph did everything he could to keep the team in Buffalo. It's not his fault that nobody from Buffalo could compete with the offers from other regions!

 

Right. Because Ralph was completely unaware that a franchise in Buffalo would be worth less than a franchise in Toronto or LA. He knew that this discrepancy would do NOTHING to the bidding process on the club.

 

 

You idiot. Ralph had no choice but to sell the team to the highest bidder after his death.

 

Right. Because this process is the way that every other owner of a sports franchise has taken. Oh wait. NO IT'S NOT!!! There have been dozens and dozens of cases where an elderly owner had to worry about capital gains and estate taxes and STILL found a way to sell their franchise in a different way. THIS HAS NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE. THIS PROCESS IS DESIGNED TO DRIVE UP THE VALUE OF THE FRANCHISE, SUBSTANTIALLY. It will do one of two things, drive up the price to the point where nobody in Buffalo can afford to match it, or drive up the price to the point where the new Buffalo owner will be forced to overpay and put the club under financial strain right from day one.

 

You idiot. The other owners still need to approve the move. They would NEVER approve a move to a city like Toronto!

 

Right. Because all of the extra revenue that would come to the league by being in a market with 6 times the population, 10 times the corporate support and the potential for HUGE television contracts will have no appeal to the other owners. Do you think Bob Kraft will give two sh*ts about the blood on his hands by approving a move when he sees how much more money he and the other owners would make? Good grief.

 

Sorry to be a jerk, but I'm pissed off. We shouldn't be having these conversations. Billionaires got to be billionaires because they are opportunistic and have figured out ways to get deals done that were tricky and full of challenges. In order to keep these predators out of this process, Ralph needed to make it AIR TIGHT. The only way to do that was to choose an owner before he died and sell off a portion before opening the door for this mess.

 

Again, I know I'm going to get roasted for this. But I needed to say it. I love the Bills and even though I don't live in Buffalo, it would break my heart to see them move. It would be a tragedy and the thought of it makes me physically sick. I am not saying that the Bills WILL move. Not at all. But I'm saying that Ralph has left that door ajar and that in itself is inexcusable, in my opinion.

 

Go Bills

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

 

if there is a $400 million buyout and he pays the $400 billion buyout then they can move the team. Any lawsuit will be tossed from the courts as frivolous.

 

Ralph said the team is to be sold to th ehighest bidder a couple of years before he passed. I just do not see Mrs. Wilson not honoring that.. If the bidding for the team goes over $1 billion the chances of the Bilsl remaining in Buffalo are slim

There isn't a $400M buyout. That is a penalty if the lawsuit is won in Erie County.

 

The details of the trust haven't been revealed beyond the 4 person panel.

[May Day 10]

I agree theplunge

[Kirby Jackson]

Just to be clear there isn't a $400M buyout. There is a $28M buyout in 2020 and that is it (I think $28.4M actually).

 

The $400M would be the result of someone suing Erie County in Erie County court and winning a case that Erie County violated the lease.

 

The $400M should never have been mentioned because it is TOTALLY irrelevant. The buyout is in 2020 and only for a few month window.

[thebandit27]

Just to be clear there isn't a $400M buyout. There is a $28M buyout in 2020 and that is it (I think $28.4M actually).

 

The $400M would be the result of someone suing Erie County in Erie County court and winning a case that Erie County violated the lease.

 

The $400M should never have been mentioned because it is TOTALLY irrelevant. The buyout is in 2020 and only for a few month window.

 

I have no idea how this keeps getting missed as its been covered so many times.

 

Nevertheless thanks for clarifying.

[Greg F]

I don't know the specifics of the Browns lease but the Bills lease and non relocation agreement are 100% ironclad.

 

It is not 'ironclad. If it was there would have been no reason for $400 million penalty. I think the contract was written to make it legally time consuming to break.

 

All of this could have been avoided if Ralph would have sold a portion of the team to the next owner. Say what you want about Modell, but that's what he did in Baltimore. Ralph could have chosen his next owner, sold them 49% a couple of years ago and then would have the sale completed upon his death.

 

Which would have subject him to a 15% capital gains tax on the sale.

[CodeMonkey]

Just to be clear there isn't a $400M buyout. There is a $28M buyout in 2020 and that is it (I think $28.4M actually).

 

The $400M would be the result of someone suing Erie County in Erie County court and winning a case that Erie County violated the lease.

 

The $400M should never have been mentioned because it is TOTALLY irrelevant. The buyout is in 2020 and only for a few month window.

It's a nit picky point, but according to a lawyer friend it would be Erie County bringing the new owners to court for violating the lease by attempting to move. if the court did not rule to force the Bills to stay put (which according to said lawyer he has never seen a court force a tenant to stay, but he also says he has not heard of anything like this involving a sports team before either so who knows) then the Bills would be forced to either pay the $400 million, or question the validity of the $400 million in which case the court could force Erie County to prove that much in damages.

 

But your main point is correct though in that it is definitely not a buyout.

Edited June 6, 2014 by CodeMonkey

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

It is not 'ironclad. If it was there would have been no reason for $400 million penalty. I think the contract was written to make it legally time consuming to break.

 

 

 

Which would have subject him to a 15% capital gains tax on the sale.

I guess if you believe that someone is going to sue Erie County in Erie County and win - it wouldn't be ironclad. I just don't see that as a possibility.

 

 

It's a nit picky point, but according to a lawyer friend it would be Erie County bringing the new owners to court for violating the lease by attempting to move. if the court did not rule to force the Bills to stay put (which according to said lawyer he has never seen a court force a tenant to stay, but he also says he has not heard of anything like this involving a sports team before either so who knows) then the Bills would be forced to either pay the $400 million, or question the validity of the $400 million in which case the court could force Erie County to prove that much in damages.

 

But your main point is correct though in that it is definitely not a buyout.

Fair enough, the main point being that this battle will be fought in Erie County court. Their interests are obviously going to be self serving and in no way should we expect them to be impartial. Edited June 6, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[DOGNESS]

He cant just pay the 400 mill and leave. He has to go to court first and get a ruling that the lease has been breached. Then, if he wins(unlikely), he pays 400 million.