ESPN Insider--some doubt as to how Watkins game translates at NFL leve

[sjjr]

Done with espn...

 

EJ will weigh on his success but this trade was about Sammy. He'll be the best route runner, have the best hands, and be the most explosive receiver the Bills have. He'll demand attention from defenses each week that will make everyone elses job easier.

 

The Bills have quietly built a young, talented roster that can compete with anybody. The Pats have been a great dynasty but all things must come to an end.

[The Wiz]

Done with espn...

 

EJ will weigh on his success but this trade was about Sammy. He'll be the best route runner, have the best hands, and be the most explosive receiver the Bills have. He'll demand attention from defenses each week that will make everyone elses job easier.

 

The Bills have quietly built a young, talented roster that can compete with anybody. The Pats have been a great dynasty but all things must come to an end.

The question is when Darth Vader(Brady) throws Darth Sidious(Belichick) off the platform. I'm guessing his new apprentice will help the issue.

 

I agree about the Bills though. They are getting younger and in all the right places.

Edited May 15, 2014 by The Wiz

[BillsVet]

So, who do you propose the Bills should have drafted this year ? How about last year ?

 

And, Crabtree, Boldin are not #1 receivers ?

 

What are you realy complaining about and what do you think the Bills should have done differently the past two years ?

 

First, you haven't rebutted my point but have chosen to lay in the tall grass after I present my argument.

 

Decisions made before Whaley and Marrone were hired to their current jobs significantly influenced the moves of 2013 and 2014. The team building strategy in 2010-2012 made the last two off-seasons what they were. Every team that begins to rebuild attempts to get a QB as quickly as possible given the short window to overhaul a roster. The fastest way to rebuilding is to get a very good to outstanding QB. When Buddy NIx eschewed the position in 2011 and 2012 when some good ones were on the board, it set up 2013 and 2014. No one knew the 2013 QB class would be weak, but you have to strike while the iron was hot and Nix chose other positions. In fact, IIRC, Nix talked about building the team and then getting the QB. Problem is, no one does that anymore because teams don't have enough time to rebuild for 3-4 years as Nix said it would take to finish the job.

 

And no, I don't consider Boldin or Crabtree #1 receivers. Very good, but not on par with Calvin Johnson, Julio Jones, AJ Green, and perhaps Andre Johnson.

Edited May 15, 2014 by BillsVet

[Deranged Rhino]

... the Pats have been a great dynasty but all things must come to an end.

 

I'm with you, but I cannot let this post go without stating the obvious: the *pats haven't won a ring in a long time. Their dominance over the (until recently) poor AFC East is certainly unquestioned, but I can't call them a dynasty anymore. They were in the 2000s when cheating was still in style, but they haven't been a dynasty since maybe 2009.

 

The *pats are done, they know it. The only question is if the Bills are good enough to take the throne back in the division -- which I think they will this year.

[billsfan1959]

It will prove to be another typical Bills blunder in a few years. A few intelligent posters are here trying to explain to some of you why and you don't seem to get it.

 

This team that is "going all in" for the playoffs let their all pro safety walk for nothing and traded their best receiver for nothing. There will be growing pains for Watkins this year and I don't think anyone would have expected him to make Stevie irrelevant in year one, if ever.

 

There is nobody, you included, that has any idea how this will turn out. Everyone has an opinion and that is all they are at this point: Opinions. You are welcome to your opinion and to lay out the reasons you arrived at your conclusion. However, to think you and the other "few intelligent posters" "need" to explain anything to the rest of us, and that we somehow lack the insight and intellect to grasp it - just because we might disagree - is nothing more than arrogance

[Big Gun]

Whether or not Watkins pans out is TBD. This whole thing reminds me of when they drafted Spiller already having Fred and Marshawn on the team. That pick was questioned as is this one I think. Woods and Goodwin were drafted last year, Stevie was here, TJ is here and so is Mike Williams. That said I'm not sure EJ is the QB to be able to get Watkins the ball consistently enough for him to get 1000 yards and 10+ TDs. I don't ever see EJ as more than a 3000 yard 20 TD guy, and that is in his best year. I dunno, as Berman says "that's why they play the games".

[CountryCletus]

 

They do, of course. But man I have to tell you, the last 14 seasons has me wondering at times

 

I admit, I love me some Kool Aid, but right now I feel it... The turning of a corner... Something is happening in that locker room and the product on the field is going to be completely different than what we've seen in a long LONG time!

[3rdand12]

I thought the article was poorly done and most certainly unnecessary.

 

Its not a Bills bias so much as it is a form of picking on the weakest kid at school .

[smapdi]

I posted this in the Watkins thread but it fits this thread perfectly:

 

Clemson's coach was on WGR during the draft and addressed this criticism. To paraphrase, he basically stated that the high number of screen passes caught by Sammy his senior year was a product of the way defenses were playing him.

 

DC's were absolutely terrified of Watkin's down the field by his senior year so they gave him a ton of cushion; 7-10 yards the CB's were playing off of him because of his speed. Clemson was more then happy to just start throwing screens to a wide open Watkins due to this huge cushion. Why wouldn't you throw to a wide open Sammy Watkins over and over if that's what the defense was giving you?? He is such a tremendous player after the catch, that he can turn those 2 yard screens into 15+ yard chunks with no problem.

 

Just go look at what he did as a freshmen. He can run any route you want him to. The fact that he was just destroying CB's down the field was the reason he was given such a huge cushion his senior season.

 

That is why I love this pick. He is a legitimate elite WR. He can do it all and score from anywhere. He has the height and athleticism to out jump CB's down the field. He has the size to run through them on screens. He has the agility of a RB with the ball in his hands.. just look at some of the cuts he makes in the highlight reels. Defenses are going to learn pretty quickly that you either give him a hefty cushion or he is going to run right by your CB. This will lead to having to shade the safety to his side of the field opening up all types of space for his teammates. He truly will make the entire offense more dangerous just by being on the field.

[bisonbrigade]

Sammy Watkins has some doubt that ESPN writers have any brains and thinks they will write anything to get noticed.

[Deranged Rhino]

Whether or not Watkins pans out is TBD. This whole thing reminds me of when they drafted Spiller already having Fred and Marshawn on the team. That pick was questioned as is this one I think. Woods and Goodwin were drafted last year, Stevie was here, TJ is here and so is Mike Williams. That said I'm not sure EJ is the QB to be able to get Watkins the ball consistently enough for him to get 1000 yards and 10+ TDs. I don't ever see EJ as more than a 3000 yard 20 TD guy, and that is in his best year. I dunno, as Berman says "that's why they play the games".

 

The Spiller pick was so upsetting because the team had multiple holes and the only position of strength was at running back. It was a luxury pick -- worse, it was made at a time when RBs were being devalued -- they over-reached for a position instead of trying to find better ways to fill the multiple holes on the roster.

 

This year the roster is completely different. There hasn't been a number 1 WR, which Watkins most certainly is, on this roster since the days of Moulds. More than that, other than OL which was addressed in later rounds, this team didn't have a ton of holes. When they took CJThrills they had not one but two number 1 RBs on the roster already.

 

It's night and day to compare the criticism of those two picks. This is said by someone who believed at the time and was very vocal about it then that the Spiller pick was the wrong pick. I still think it was but that ship sailed and I've embraced CJ because I'm a fan of the Bills above my ego. You could be wrong about EJ, I tend to think you are, but you're right that we'll find out the answers this fall.

 

At least it's going to be exciting!

[birdog1960]

Wait, wait, wait... Are you trying to suggest that the front office has more intel on this team than most posters do??? Hold on a second, I need to sit down and soak this all in...

based on the last 2 decades of personnel and coaching moves, i think the assumption that they have good intel in this single, isolated instance needs to be seriously questioned.

[Doc]

I expressed similar concern about Watkins prior to the draft, and was told I was wrong. Because all I saw was the 60% stat. Which was lazy on my part and therefore on the writer's part. So it's a bad article.

 

As for what they gave up, time will tell whether it was a mistake. The Bills will have in the neighborhood of $50M in cap space next off-season to shore up holes, meaning the draft won't be the primary place they add talent. And as for QB, if the QB class is as good as people think (now where have I heard that before?), the Bills likely won't have a chance to get one of the top-3 guys without giving up more.

[3rdand12]

Whether or not Watkins pans out is TBD. This whole thing reminds me of when they drafted Spiller already having Fred and Marshawn on the team. That pick was questioned as is this one I think. Woods and Goodwin were drafted last year, Stevie was here, TJ is here and so is Mike Williams. That said I'm not sure EJ is the QB to be able to get Watkins the ball consistently enough for him to get 1000 yards and 10+ TDs. I don't ever see EJ as more than a 3000 yard 20 TD guy, and that is in his best year. I dunno, as Berman says "that's why they play the games".

Very realistic POV.

I think for some of us who are digging into this kid , we have found he might be the most complete player at WR we may see for years.

I was firm in my thinking that Bills should sit and wait at nine. I also thought if they must trade up , dont go far for Matthews or Evans.

I was not pleased with the pick at first. To much risk as compared too value . Too wild . Like Spiller .

Let me suggest that after looking into this kid and paying attention him now , he might very well be all that .

If Bills thought he would improve everyone around him , and they must have , they did the right thing.

This is not a Spiller pick nor a TO signing. Thats my respectful opinion gents and ladies

[Alaska Darin]

Just go look at what he did as a freshmen. He can run any route you want him to. The fact that he was just destroying CB's down the field was the reason he was given such a huge cushion his senior season..

I get such a kick out of BILLS' fans complaining about how you can't run those patterns in the NFL when the Patriots have been murdering us with them for over a decade. Perry Fewell used to line the CBs up 10 yards off the line and Brady would complete dozens of passes for first down after first down.

 

Watkins is going to be another Percy Harvin. Hopefully he can stay healthy because dude is a witch.

 

And giving up a first rounder is only an issue if you refuse to use the money to get an upper tier FA that season. Hopefully DW is paying attention.

[K-9]

I get such a kick out of BILLS' fans complaining about how you can't run those patterns in the NFL when the Patriots have been murdering us with them for over a decade. Perry Fewell used to line the CBs up 10 yards off the line and Brady would complete dozens of passes for first down after first down.

 

Watkins is going to be another Percy Harvin. Hopefully he can stay healthy because dude is a witch.

 

And giving up a first rounder is only an issue if you refuse to use the money to get an upper tier FA that season. Hopefully DW is paying attention.

 

Nice take here.

 

GO BILLS!!!

[birdog1960]

I expressed similar concern about Watkins prior to the draft, and was told I was wrong. Because all I saw was the 60% stat. Which was lazy on my part and therefore on the writer's part. So it's a bad article.

 

As for what they gave up, time will tell whether it was a mistake. The Bills will have in the neighborhood of $50M in cap space next off-season to shore up holes, meaning the draft won't be the primary place they add talent. And as for QB, if the QB class is as good as people think (now where have I heard that before?), the Bills likely won't have a chance to get one of the top-3 guys without giving up more.

ok, i'll buy the FA angle, assuming the entire cash to cap, build through the draft only ( cuz that's how pittsburgh does it), and the free agent -buffalo price premium issues are all laid to rest. unfortunately, i don't believe they are. what has changed since byrd wasn't offered market value to stay?

[podge4prez]

 

 

Of course they think they have their QB when they spent the #16 overall selection on him last year.

Sure, they may think they are on the verge of the playoffs given that they surrendered next year's first round pick.

And yes, if they are correct, the 1st round pick they gave up to get a stud on the roster will be in the 20s -- not top 10.

 

Still doesn't make it a good trade.

 

You don't make trades that big based on what you "think." You make them based on facts. When Atlanta traded up for Julio Jones, they had a Pro Bowl franchise QB in place (FACT), they had made the playoffs in 2 out of the past 3 years (FACT) and those facts provided them with the confidence to make the trade. The Bills are in an entirely different situation.

 

3 straight 6-10 seasons

QB with tremendous potential but still unproven (even if they justifiably think he's the guy)

Lack of depth on the roster - good roster, but many of the backups are questionable NFL players. An injury here and there can turn a good season sour.

 

It was a bad gamble to make. But if I knew I might not around here next year anyway, I might do the same thing.

 

I think it makes sense if u look at like Atlanta did this for the next step, super bowl.. in a way it's the same for us but it's playoffs instead of super bowl.. although it's important to note although a GREAT WR it didn't get them there. So I'm happy we got Watkins.. it just might still even not be enough unless EJ is that dude

Edited May 15, 2014 by podge4prez

[Saint Doug]

So you are telling me you wouldn't have made that trade for AJ Green or Julio Jones?

 

First, let's make the big assumption he turns into a player like Green or Jones. Where does that get us? What have the JJ trade done for ATL? Same for Green (although Cincy gets points for not mortgaging their future to get him ). Would you even trade pick #8 and next year's 1st for Jones or Green, especially when you have an unknown commodity at QB? The more I think about it, it almost resembles a desperation move to try impress the next owner.

[Kellyto83TD]

What still gets me is NO ONE doubted his ability to transition to the NFL UNTIL Buffalo drafted him.