NFL networks coverage of Michael Sam

[SoulMan]

Puuuullllllleeeeeeaaase can we move on ?

[DC Tom]

I haven't been following your quarrel with D48579 so I don't know the context, but I see nothing wrong with someone not wanting to see the pic you put up.

 

Yes. I don't particularly want to look at it.

 

But I have no problem with those who do. To each his own.

[Deranged Rhino]

 

 

I haven't been following your quarrel with D48579 so I don't know the context, but I see nothing wrong with someone not wanting to see the pic you put up.

 

Which is why it's funny

[transient]

 

I see. Your ignorance, and, yeah self-unawareness, is far more responsible for these silly posts than any sort of agenda. Ok. I'll spend more time on you then. Crusade? No. If you recall, this began with me replying to you. IF correcting idiocy, shaming ignorance, and calling out phonies...can be called a crusade? Then yeah, that's what I do here at TSW.

 

You simply have no idea how obtuse/inconsistent/contradictory your posts are. That's because: you didn't think this through, did you? It's either that, or this is the very best thinking we can expect from you. Well, that's fine. But, it doesn't mean we should let it slide. See the trouble for you here is: I did think this through.

 

Let me help you out: What you "meant to say" is much worse than what you said. Rather than "stupid", you meant to say: evil. Evil, as in: given 100 opportunities to bully someone/disparage gay people....most "frat boys", and by extension NFL players, will choose the affirmative 100 times. Think it through: You don't know that.

 

You have NOTHING to back this up....other than your micro sample of, apparently, a-hole friends, who do make these decisions 100 out of 100 times, and are where your assessment comes from, since they both do, and do not, represent "frat boys" for you. Well, whatever is convenient at the time, right?

 

The irony remains, whether you would have it or not, and you calling this "stereotypical" doesn't make it so. Absurd is the better description of your thinking here. IF I were to take your awful logic, and re-apply it with different parameters? That = me saying: "All gay people are going to be inappropriate and flamboyant in a locker room, because that's their stereotype". Both that argument, and yours, are = ridiculous, for the same reason: they presuppose behavior, and base that supposition on nothing.

 

Oh, and you don't think my words are 100% applicable to your posts? You want an example of obtuse? Here you go:

 

This is the Webster's definition of "obtuse".

 

According to you: the "frat boys" you know are fine. It's the "fat boys", in general, that are the problem. (Holy 1960s, idiotic, "Southern moderate", argument, Batman!) And if we asked the "frat boys" you know, they would be pissed at you if you applied your idiotic stereotype to them, but pefectly okay if you applied it to their brothers, or other "frat boys" they know. Or is it: the ones they don't know?

 

And of course my favorite: there is stereotypical behavior for fraternities(which you predicate on hard data like Revenge of the Nerds), but that stereotype doesn't apply: "in general"? What in the Sam Hell are you on to? Stereotypical behavior that doesn't apply "in general"?

 

Is there any doubt left as to why I have called your posts "pseudo-intellectual"?

 

Yeah, that's precisely the argument you are making....and that's precisely how obtuse it is.

You keep saying "let me be clear/my intent" etc. It's more than clear: your problem isn't language.

 

Your problem is you can't be who you think you are, and who you actually are, at the same time.

 

This is called: cognitive dissonance, and you are riddled with it. The good news? At least you are trying, but failing, to be a good person.

Acknowledging that a stereotype exists is not the equivalent of subscribing to it, but thanks for continuing to define obtuse for me. These examples are very helpful. A few more like this, and I think I'll get it.

[White Linen]

You don't dislike gays. My mistake. You just have an aversion and continue to crusade about homosexuality on a f@#$ing football website at every opportunity. Its your contention that this natural aversion is normal. I've stated several times that all manner of prejudice are normal, but we should strive to do better rather than to rationalize our shortcomings. Looks like you've either done even more evolving since you posted this 3 months ago or perhaps you're just a tad inconsistent.

 

How would you characterize your separation of schools and homosexuality viewpoint since you object to the word fear? Mistrust? Suspicion?

 

Do you often attribute fear, mistrust, suspicion, pick your own term, with groups of people who you're totally cool with, bro?

 

I conjecture that you haven't changed one bit since the days when abhorrent would have been your word of choice, but now you know that in order to further your agenda you have to turn down the rhetoric. Do your best to seem reasonable. I don't believe that someone with your posting record and obvious fixation on this subject goes from FreeRepublic to its all good in four years. Perhaps I'm just cynical.

 

Keep calling me a liar. I'll just respond with more of things you didn't post. Your memory isn't as strong as mine judging by your recollection of how the last dance ended.

 

 

The above should be I conjectured.

[Rocky Landing]

The above should be I conjectured.

Your post should have, "I conjectured," in quotation marks. It would still be wrong, however. I conjecture that Jauronimo was speaking in the present tense.

[Ralonzo]

In my parents day if you supported people being gay you were ostracized

 

In your parents' day if you supported gay people you probably didn't feel the need to force your position on everyone else. If you did, then maybe you'd be ostracized - less for supporting gay people than being an ass about it.

 

The attitude of the time (I was there) was more "don't ask, don't tell, don't care" than anything.The current direction is toward "You didn't ask, I'm going to show & tell, and you must care." And if "they" decide you don't care enough, you may well end up like a Netscape CEO.

 

Tolerance does not involve mandatory conscription to your viewpoint, that was the irony in your prior post (I thought it was intentional at the time, but...?) Between the attitude of your parents' time, and your time, which do you think leads to a more civil society?

[Dorkington]

Ah the subtle homophobia of this site. Goes well with the subtle racism.

[RuntheDamnBall]

 

 

In your parents' day if you supported gay people you probably didn't feel the need to force your position on everyone else. If you did, then maybe you'd be ostracized - less for supporting gay people than being an ass about it.

 

The attitude of the time (I was there) was more "don't ask, don't tell, don't care" than anything.The current direction is toward "You didn't ask, I'm going to show & tell, and you must care." And if "they" decide you don't care enough, you may well end up like a Netscape CEO.

 

Tolerance does not involve mandatory conscription to your viewpoint, that was the irony in your prior post (I thought it was intentional at the time, but...?) Between the attitude of your parents' time, and your time, which do you think leads to a more civil society?

I don't know, probably the time where I don't get my ass kicked in a five against one situation because I did things that seemed "gay" like playing music and having gay friends.

 

But I don't know, you "were there" so one has to assume your experience is pretty universal.

[Adam]

In your parents' day if you supported gay people you probably didn't feel the need to force your position on everyone else. If you did, then maybe you'd be ostracized - less for supporting gay people than being an ass about it.

 

The attitude of the time (I was there) was more "don't ask, don't tell, don't care" than anything.The current direction is toward "You didn't ask, I'm going to show & tell, and you must care." And if "they" decide you don't care enough, you may well end up like a Netscape CEO.

 

Tolerance does not involve mandatory conscription to your viewpoint, that was the irony in your prior post (I thought it was intentional at the time, but...?) Between the attitude of your parents' time, and your time, which do you think leads to a more civil society?

People should be free to think whatever they want. Also, free to do whatever they want, if it doesn't hurt anyone. Some people are against public displays of affection by anyone- homosexual or heterosexual. Personally, I couldn't care less- let them do as they will in public.

[Dante]

All these wasted calories over a 7th round scrub. Biggest appearance in his career will probably be on the View or something.

[Tintonfallsbillsfan]

It's interesting how society has changed. The overwhelming support even in this thread is proof that the battle is being won. I'm sure there's hundreds of people that have read this thread that disagree with Michael Sam's lifestyle and are afraid to comment. This is proof that change isn't coming - it's here. The tolerance has been achieved - because even those that disagree won't voice their opinion and have been silenced. It is no longer acceptable in the USA to object the gay lifestyle.

and why would it not be acceprtable, it's not a choice

 

 

 

 

 

Hey Mick, judging by your sigline you appear to be a flaming liberal so I’ll give you only some limited time, as mine is very valuable being a capitalist and all. Oh, and aren’t you a fan of football and I assume sports in general? Strange that you would scoff at the owners of professional sports teams as an after-thought. Heck, maybe we should let Joe down the street own the team. It’s not fair that he only makes $10 an hour.. Everyone should own a team.. LOL obvious silliness aside..

 

 

 

As to Sam, my comments are a real perception of just how things went down. Not the media or Sam version but how I envisioned it actually happened. You can disagree all you like, heck I encourage it. Whether or not a gay person wants to hide in the closest is his or her own choice. No one is forcing it on them, no one is beating them in the streets despite media reports that get attention it simply does not happen; and if they want to do this or that but can’t come out in fear of not being able to do this or that, then it speaks volumes to their real character. The polarization of views on a number of political matters is a glaring elephant in the room right now in this nation. Being led, (which the word “led” is almost oxymoronic in this syntax) by the President, emboldened by a totally complicit media is amusing. Alarming that some here cannot see it, it begs several questions as to the true health of our nation, but I digress… Gays have made significant progress in just the last ten years, but I warn you that this bullying tactic, screaming homophobe, and bigot at the very hint of distaste of gay issues, is a façade. It only serves to prop up a phony sense of tolerance.

 

 

 

People generally tolerate a lot of things, but do they ever really accept them? Not usually. People also don’t like being told what to think or what to say. This is America bro.. Michael Sam sticks his penis into another man’s anal canal for gratification, and the fact that this visual would be grotesque to MOST men seems like a foreign almost unimaginable response when speaking to the left rhetorical machine. It’s laughable to an extreme level of ignorance. Why do straight men tolerate lesbian sex---à gee I have no idea.. None at all, do you? I see no evolutionary advantage to homosexual behavior, NONE zero zilch. I see NO evidence credible or otherwise invented, to suggest that homosexuality is a condition of one’s genetic disposition, yet, like a religion in the twilight zone we are all supposed to just shut up and not point it out. Long term societal ramifications be damned. As to those ramifications of an accepting and completely tolerant society of sexual behavior.. I can think of a few, and I can point to evidence already available to suggest the correlations are real, but perhaps another discussion. This is a sports forum mostly and I very rarely delve into the PPP forums. I do that on other forums. I come here to talk sports.. A sport I love..

 

 

 

Cheers to you, and have a wonderful, glorious day!

 

Based on recent elections about half the country are liberal tilting, and probaly more on social issues so to say most men would be disgusted is an huge over step. Represt men, men who are not self realized sure, but not most

 

Tim-

[RuntheDamnBall]

All these wasted calories over a 7th round scrub. Biggest appearance in his career will probably be on the View or something.

Noted 7th round scrubs:

 

Steve Johnson

Marques Colston

TJ Houshmanzadeh

Brock Marion

Shannon Sharpe

Adam Timmerman

Tom Nalen

 

One of the best OL in our team's history (Kent Hull) was undrafted and one of the best QBs of all time was a sixth rounder.

 

If you deem it not worthy of conversation, there is an easy way out...

[Tintonfallsbillsfan]

Mickey –

 

Oh I am well aware that gay’s folks get beat up because they are gay. When I say it simply does not happen is really a play on words. What I meant was that it is simply so rare as to be insignificant, statistically. Furthermore, Michael Sam is not going to be beaten up by anyone. What was his fear of coming out? Was he afraid of being beaten up? Nice try, Mick. The narrative requires context to be validated, and YOU DON’T have context, let alone the facts. I notice you’re using the new politically correct buzz word for tranny, or shemale. Well played.. But forgive me if I continue to call them tranny’s and shedogs.. You don’t get to redefine deviance for me or anyone else.

 

Enjoy the rest of your 21^st century day.

 

Tim-

 

NoSaint -

 

Yes, please do, and if there's anything you wish to debate then I'm all ears. Coward!

 

Do you take any specific objection to anything I've stated here or anywhere else? Whatcha got, saint?

 

Tim-

Deviance ? What is deviant , and why do you get to be the Judge .

 

One other note I’d like to clear you up on. Science doesn’t or is not supposed to care about prejudice. Scientific conclusions that are factual have no axe to grind. Men do just fine with that. The problem with science is that those that are conducting it need to have integrity, something that seems to be lacking from both sides of this particular issue, but I assure you, not with me. If it were shown tomorrow that homosexuals have no choice is being gay, or identifying with opposite genders then I’d be the first to put on a gay pride shirt and march right alongside them. The problem that you and many others that knee-jerk the homophobe, bigot, and hater rhetoric is that, I’m not religious in any way, and I do NOT hate gays. What I do hate is people taking a position on a matter without even an ounce of thought put into why they believe the way they do. I am open to serious discussion on the subject matter, EVEN if that subject matter doesn’t mesh with me. Information is information, and data is data. The quality lies in the one collecting it, and the one’s disseminating it.

 

 

 

You nor anyone else can demonstrate this to be true. Again you’re lying, and I am pointing it out.

 

 

 

Well actually there is (As I have already demonstrated to you in previous engagements) a great deal of science to suggest that what I “think” might be going on, actually is going on. However, granted, it cannot be proven, yet, but I am hopeful that as we continue to map the brains higher executive functions, we will be able to demonstrate how sexuality is manifest in humans to a great degree of certainty. You know Einstein predicted several things with his theory on relativity that we are only now discovering over 100 years later. Gravitational lensing, time dilation, and the list goes on.

 

 

 

More lies eh? Gee don’t you get tired of that? You have about as much street cred with me as a buffoon. Here let me put this to bed right now. I am absolutely open to the idea that homosexuality or any sexuality is completely natural (in the sense you’re using the word natural) or naturally occurring. I am totally open to the idea that homosexuality is not a choice. Do I believe it to be true, no. Do I have good reason to believe it to be true, no, but if you have something that is compelling that I am unaware of, please share it.

 

 

 

Bro, you’re incapable of arguing this topic on my level. You’ve clearly demonstrated several times that you lack the knowledge to go toe-to-toe on it with me. I don’t champion ANY viewpoint from anyone and from any side of the fence. I look at the data, calculate the reliability of the data using a myriad of variables and controls, and then I form an opinion.

 

 

 

Well if you believe homosexuality is naturally occurring then science dictates that you should be repulsed by it. I don’t expect you to understand that salient point, but I thought I’d share anyway for those that are following along.

 

 

 

Neither am I.

 

 

 

How sweet of you to “tone it down” for me. I don’t dislike gay’s bro. Sheesh?? Talk about thick headed. What I do not support is gays being considered as important to societies overall long term health as heterosexual marriage. I “think” that heterosexual marriage is fundamental to society’s success for a number of valid reasons. But aside from all that. I think that because I said that two gay men having sex was/is repulsive you infer that I hate gays, opining without even a quick thought as to the reasons that might be.

 

 

 

I’m not hiding or trying too. You’re just not very good at mind reading over the internetz, and a terrible liar to boot.

 

Have a golden evening Jauronimo.

 

Tim-

 

 

 

Hey thanks. You've been very supportive thus far sparky.

 

Tim-

ok, for one minute assume you are correct and it is a choice, I still don't know what your objection is .

[Deranged Rhino]

Deviance ? What is deviant , and why do you get to be the Judge .

 

 

ok, for one minute assume you are correct and it is a choice, I still don't know what your objection is .

 

His objection is obvious. He's a bigot.

[Dante]

Of course but there are undrafted guys as well if you dig enough. I've exhausted the 5 total calories I'm willing to allocate to this overblown, gris for the mill nonsense. And I am indeed out

[RuntheDamnBall]

Deviance ? What is deviant , and why do you get to be the Judge .

 

 

ok, for one minute assume you are correct and it is a choice, I still don't know what your objection is .

Something something human evolution [graphic visual redacted]

[Deranged Rhino]

People should be free to think whatever they want. Also, free to do whatever they want, if it doesn't hurt anyone. Some people are against public displays of affection by anyone- homosexual or heterosexual. Personally, I couldn't care less- let them do as they will in public.

 

:beer:

[Derelichte]

All these wasted calories over a 7th round scrub. Biggest appearance in his career will probably be on the View or something.

 

Sam and Tebow could get their own show and blow the super bowl ratings out of the water

[Deranged Rhino]

Sam and Tebow could get their own show and blow the super bowl ratings out of the water

 

Actually, I know you're being funny, but that would be an terrific Amazing Race team. Imagine the conversations while riding on a camel those two could have!