C.Biscuit97 Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 If Johnny was 6'3" 220 with all the same ability and arm strength he would magically be an elite player and the hands down #1 pick, can't wait till he proves the naysayers (c biscuit) wrong. And if my aunt had balls... Point is, he's not. Yes, if Manziel was Cam Newton's size, he'd be the number #1 pick. No one would argue that. But he's 5" shorter and doesn't have as good as an arm. I also don't know the last time a highly rated college QB got to play behind 2 top 10 OTs and a top 10 6'5" wr. Manziel played with insane talent. Also, you endorsing him doesn't help. No offense but you are the SI and Madden cover curses all rolled into one.
YoloinOhio Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 I don't think his size is the limiting factor so much as the questions about his ability to make a living in the pocket. That is the biggest question mark scouts have about his transition to the next level. GO BILLS!!! The hardest thing for the scouts and GMs to predict is whether a player will be able to do something in the NFL that he was not asked to do in college. In this case, be disciplined to stay with his reads and make plays in the pocket until it is necessary to move out of the pocket. It is hard enough to predict whether they can do what they showed they could do in college once they get to the NFL.
C.Biscuit97 Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 The hardest thing for the scouts and GMs to predict is whether a player will be able to do something in the NFL that he was not asked to do in college. In this case, be disciplined to stay with his reads and make plays in the pocket until it is necessary to move out of the pocket. It is hard enough to predict whether they can do what they showed they could do in college once they get to the NFL. He's a slower Mike Vick with a lesser arm. How could he not be awesome?
K-9 Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 The hardest thing for the scouts and GMs to predict is whether a player will be able to do something in the NFL that he was not asked to do in college. In this case, be disciplined to stay with his reads and make plays in the pocket until it is necessary to move out of the pocket. It is hard enough to predict whether they can do what they showed they could do in college once they get to the NFL. This is true. When you look at the elite QB prospects taken high in drafts, they have at some time or another demonstrated an ability to make plays from the pocket. It's from the pocket that a QB forces the D to defend the entire field honestly, as the entire route route system is in play and progressions can be read properly. Manziel has shown little to no ability to do this in college. The same COULD be said about Cam Newton, but Newton is a physical freak that scouts were confident could learn the pocket game. While Manziel is one of the most exciting college players ever, he just doesn't possess that kind of athletic ability. If he can go to a place and learn for a couple years before being pressed into service, he stands a much better chance. But it's 50/50 at best at this point. GO BILLS!!!
billykaykay Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 He's a slower Mike Vick with a lesser arm. How could he not be awesome? Everyone is slower than Vick.
Green Lightning Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 He's a slower Mike Vick with a lesser arm. How could he not be awesome? So is Russell Wilson.
C.Biscuit97 Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 So is Russell Wilson. Russell Wilson was a much better pocket passer in college than Manziel or Vick. Everyone is slower than Vick. True, but by comparison, EJ ran a 4.65 40 at 6'5" 237lbs compared to 4.68 40 for JM at 5'11" 207 lbs.. http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/johnny-manziel?id=2543462 http://www.nfl.com/combine/profiles/ej-manuel?id=2539228 Guys like Brees and Wilson are the exception to the rule. It's like saying you can get a QB late because of Brady, Romo, and Warner. JM was a great college player. But IMO, his skills are elite enough to be a Newton type QB, and he's not as good of a pocket passer as Brees or Wilson to succeed in the NFl.
KOKBILLS Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 If the choice is between Ebron and Lewan, I don't think the Bills will pick Lewan at 9. If you are going to take the third best tackle, you don't do it at 9. Take one of the other good tackles in the second or third round and grab Ebron in the first. You're right...You do it at #4 like Philly did last year...
jumbalaya Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 There is always one guy that slips into the top ten o fifteen unexpectedly. But that is usually because the bills are drafting him, whitner, maybin, spiller.....Who will it be this year? My guess Zack (Penguin) Martin. Who will pick him? Bills
PaattMaann Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 the pick will have visited OBD pre draft - all previous 1st rounders in this regime have...so you can bet this one will too (read: Zach Martin if Matthews, Evans, Watkins are gone) I think I would prefer Ebron though, for the record
KOKBILLS Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 the pick will have visited OBD pre draft - all previous 1st rounders in this regime have...so you can bet this one will too (read: Zach Martin if Matthews, Evans, Watkins are gone) I think I would prefer Ebron though, for the record I would be shocked...Like floored shocked...if the Bills took Martin over Ebron...
BetterNextYearRight? Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 Does anyone know why Bortles name has plummeted in the draft? 2 weeks ago he was going in the top 10, this week he isnt even in the top 20. I'm not a huge supporter of his but it just seems very odd that the guy with the best tools and highest ceiling is behind Manziel and Teddy B.
PaattMaann Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 I would be shocked...Like floored shocked...if the Bills took Martin over Ebron... I wouldn't be shocked....kid has played for four years and has good track record of success, stabilize the right side of the line and protect EJ as well as open holes in the run game The company line has been "build up for EJ" - protect him and give him weapons....so do they give him a weapon, Ebron or protect him, Martin? Neither would shock me (again, this is if Matthews, Watkins and Evans are gone as they should probably be)
Kirby Jackson Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 Does anyone know why Bortles name has plummeted in the draft? 2 weeks ago he was going in the top 10, this week he isnt even in the top 20. I'm not a huge supporter of his but it just seems very odd that the guy with the best tools and highest ceiling is behind Manziel and Teddy B. Bridgewater is the most ready and outside of size Manziel has the best tools (arm, production, athleticism). Bortles has pretty good upside but isn't spectacular at anything. At this point if I had to guess Manziel will almost certainly be the 1st QB (Jacksonville or Cleveland). The 2nd will be between Carr and Bortles and Bridgewater will end up in Arizona at 20. I would be shocked...Like floored shocked...if the Bills took Martin over Ebron... I am with you. I think that there is about a 0.00% chance of Martin at 9 (and I am being generous).
Peter Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 (edited) I think that each of the top 3-4 QBs is elite (wink wink) and should go in the top eight. Edited April 29, 2014 by Peter
PaattMaann Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 I think that each of the top 3-4 QBs is elite (wink wink) and should go in the top eight. For sure...please forward this to the top 8 selecting GMs, they will read it as gospel and act accordingly
maddenboy Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 I think we trade up for Mack, if we can... Take Evans or Matthews at 9.... Or try to trade down.... I think Whaley wants to trade up to 4, Cleveland, and take Mack. The fan-base would love it. Then the best RT in the 3rd (having given up the 2nd). I dont think, and I dont think Whaley thinks, that WR is as big of a need as the fans do.
Kirby Jackson Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 I think Whaley wants to trade up to 4, Cleveland, and take Mack. The fan-base would love it. Then the best RT in the 3rd (having given up the 2nd). I dont think, and I dont think Whaley thinks, that WR is as big of a need as the fans do. If that is the case they can still get someone like Brandon Coleman from Rutgers in the 4th potentially. A receiver with some injury question marks but all kinds of skill.
PaattMaann Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 I think Whaley wants to trade up to 4, Cleveland, and take Mack. The fan-base would love it. Then the best RT in the 3rd (having given up the 2nd). I dont think, and I dont think Whaley thinks, that WR is as big of a need as the fans do. Well him saying his focus is on protecting EJ and continuing to surround him with weapons would be very contradictory to this
C.Biscuit97 Posted April 29, 2014 Posted April 29, 2014 Does anyone know why Bortles name has plummeted in the draft? 2 weeks ago he was going in the top 10, this week he isnt even in the top 20. I'm not a huge supporter of his but it just seems very odd that the guy with the best tools and highest ceiling is behind Manziel and Teddy B. Bortles shouldn't have been up there in the first place. He was complete hype. He has tools but they aren't any better than EJ's, who was a "reach" in the 1st. Watch his bowl game again. He had like 200+ yards and 3 td passes on screen passes.
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