Johnny Manziel thread

[billsfan_34]

What scares me about this kid is when he takes off and runs the ball its in his hand way back behind and away from his body, he has to learn to tuck it. In the NFL that will equate to a lot of turnovers if he doesn't grasp that concept. I also don't see him finding throwing lanes like Russell Wilson does. He may turn out to be ok, who really knows. I don't see the risk/reward being high enough to take him in the first. Late second to mid 3rd is where I see him going.

[Bronc24]

What scares me about this kid is when he takes off and runs the ball its in his hand way back behind and away from his body, he has to learn to tuck it. In the NFL that will equate to a lot of turnovers if he doesn't grasp that concept. I also don't see him finding throwing lanes like Russell Wilson does. He may turn out to be ok, who really knows. I don't see the risk/reward being high enough to take him in the first. Late second to mid 3rd is where I see him going.

 

He goes in Round 1. Guaranteed.

[Over 29 years of fanhood]

I think he is really talented. I don't know if he would be a Jim Kelly-like franchise QB, but I could see him being pretty successful like Doug Flutie.

 

In the CFL right?

 

 

Reminds me of colt McCoy.... He'll flop in the nfl

[FireChan]

 

 

In the CFL right?

 

 

Reminds me of colt McCoy.... He'll flop in the nfl

 

What reminds you of McCoy?

 

Manziels' resume speaks for itself. I can see being on the edge about him, but I don't understand the "he'll flop" logic. Maybe he won't win 17 Super Bowls, but does anyone really think he won't have any success? I mean, even Vince Young had some success.

[Mr. WEO]

So you've been following Manziel since the very first game he started? And there have been a lot of QB's who played well in college who fizzled in the pros. But you're on record for Manziel and McCarron. Any others you saw who you thought played well?

 

Yes, for the third time, I am on the record with Manziel (this is the worst cross examination in history). McCarron, sure--why not?

 

I didn't see the first game. I tuned in around Arkansas 2012. Does that put me on the bandwagon by your dictionary's definition? What's the cutoff--I gotta know.

 

Other QBs? Don't really know. Don't gamble on college football and I don't have a fetish for a school that I didn't attend, so didn't see much other than what was on the major networks that interested me. You want some primo bandwagon meat--jump on the Blake Bortles express. No one was sniffing on that guy until the bowl game.

[NoSaint]

What reminds you of McCoy?

 

Manziels' resume speaks for itself. I can see being on the edge about him, but I don't understand the "he'll flop" logic. Maybe he won't win 17 Super Bowls, but does anyone really think he won't have any success? I mean, even Vince Young had some success.

 

if vince young is the bar, youll surely have more folks that hop on the bandwagon. i think nearly all have echoed he could have some entertainment value short term even if they dont like him long term.... but remember, vince young was a #3 pick in the draft and has only made the 53 man roster 6(?) times in his career despite being ROY and a probowler twice.

 

 

 

Yes, for the third time, I am on the record with Manziel.

 

could you elaborate on what you mean by this? I mean, are you trying to say you have joined the bandwagon?

Edited February 28, 2014 by NoSaint

[Mr. WEO]

if vince young is the bar, youll surely have more folks that hop on the bandwagon. i think nearly all have echoed he could have some entertainment value short term even if they dont like him long term.... but remember, vince young was a #3 pick in the draft and has only made the 53 man roster 6(?) times in his career despite being ROY and a probowler twice.

 

 

 

could you elaborate on what you mean by this? I mean, are you trying to say you have joined the bandwagon?

 

I've been following and fascinated by this kid's career since early 2012. That doesn't make me a bandwagoneer (except by doc's special dictionary).

 

Doc keeps asking me about being "on the record" with endorsing Manziel as a future successful NFL starter. I keep responding that I am.

[NoSaint]

 

 

I've been following and fascinated by this kid's career since early 2012. That doesn't make me a bandwagoneer (except by doc's special dictionary).

 

Doc keeps asking me about being "on the record" with endorsing Manziel as a future successful NFL starter. I keep responding that I am.

 

so you are saying you are?

[Doc]

Yes, for the third time, I am on the record with Manziel (this is the worst cross examination in history). McCarron, sure--why not?

 

I didn't see the first game. I tuned in around Arkansas 2012. Does that put me on the bandwagon by your dictionary's definition? What's the cutoff--I gotta know.

 

Other QBs? Don't really know. Don't gamble on college football and I don't have a fetish for a school that I didn't attend, so didn't see much other than what was on the major networks that interested me. You want some primo bandwagon meat--jump on the Blake Bortles express. No one was sniffing on that guy until the bowl game.

There's no 3rd time doc. I already had you down as predicting success for Manziel. And now we can add McCarron.

 

Sure you were there from the beginning. Just like with Wilson. We'll see how long it takes you to jump off the Manziel bandwagon.

 

What reminds you of McCoy?

 

Manziels' resume speaks for itself. I can see being on the edge about him, but I don't understand the "he'll flop" logic. Maybe he won't win 17 Super Bowls, but does anyone really think he won't have any success? I mean, even Vince Young had some success.

How many QB's have had a resume that speaks for itself, outside of the Heisman win, which is usually a death knell for pro QB potential? What people see is his immaturity and shoot-from-the-hip playing style that may work in college, but be harder to replicate in the pros.

[Mr. WEO]

There's no 3rd time doc. I already had you down as predicting success for Manziel. And now we can add McCarron.

 

Sure you were there from the beginning. Just like with Wilson. We'll see how long it takes you to jump off the Manziel bandwagon.

 

 

How many QB's have had a resume that speaks for itself, outside of the Heisman win, which is usually a death knell for pro QB potential? What people see is his immaturity and shoot-from-the-hip playing style that may work in college, but be harder to replicate in the pros.

 

Nope. I wasn't there from the beginning with Wilson. You seem to be having a conversation with yourself.

 

If Manziel bombs, I won't endlessly argue agains the obvious, doc...

[FireChan]

 

There's no 3rd time doc. I already had you down as predicting success for Manziel. And now we can add McCarron.

 

Sure you were there from the beginning. Just like with Wilson. We'll see how long it takes you to jump off the Manziel bandwagon.

 

 

How many QB's have had a resume that speaks for itself, outside of the Heisman win, which is usually a death knell for pro QB potential? What people see is his immaturity and shoot-from-the-hip playing style that may work in college, but be harder to replicate in the pros.

 

Immaturity? Like when he was the youngest Heisman winner ever and went to college parties?

 

The whole "Johnny Football parties too much and is a distraction" was the most overblown media construct since Tebow. Were his teammates not going to parties? Did Mike Evans, a highly rated WR in this draft, not go out drinking at frat parties? Manziel was the most famous college football player because of what he did. He had one of the worst college defenses and beat the "dynasty" team in the SEC which is filled with future NFL players. Is it any shock that people took pictures and videos of him doing what every other college athlete was doing?

[NDBUFFCUSEFAN]

Immaturity? Like when he was the youngest Heisman winner ever and went to college parties?

 

The whole "Johnny Football parties too much and is a distraction" was the most overblown media construct since Tebow. Were his teammates not going to parties? Did Mike Evans, a highly rated WR in this draft, not go out drinking at frat parties? Manziel was the most famous college football player because of what he did. He had one of the worst college defenses and beat the "dynasty" team in the SEC which is filled with future NFL players. Is it any shock that people took pictures and videos of him doing what every other college athlete was doing?

 

If you dislike SJ13 you will certainly be rustled by JM, his actions on the field were pretty awful.

[Dragonborn10]

He is going to be a huge bust. But as others say let's hope he is top 8 material!

[NoSaint]

 

 

Immaturity? Like when he was the youngest Heisman winner ever and went to college parties?

 

The whole "Johnny Football parties too much and is a distraction" was the most overblown media construct since Tebow. Were his teammates not going to parties? Did Mike Evans, a highly rated WR in this draft, not go out drinking at frat parties? Manziel was the most famous college football player because of what he did. He had one of the worst college defenses and beat the "dynasty" team in the SEC which is filled with future NFL players. Is it any shock that people took pictures and videos of him doing what every other college athlete was doing?

 

I don't mind disagreeing on a guy but it irks me when people blatantly misrepresent things. If it were just a few frat parties, no one would've said a word. It was putting himself in dumb places after he already had a few big public mess ups and had the spotlight on him.

 

If Evans was arrested for fighting in the streets and giving police a fake ID, or after the heisman went to a major WR camp and decided to go a few hours down the road and party til 4am and not be able to show up for work the next morning - he would have his maturity questioned.

 

Maybe if he was accused of risking his college career over getting paid with his handler "uncle Nate" for some autographs, the two of them being photographed with stacks (or even a trash bag) of cash and then after serving a brief suspension for the cash related issues returned to the field making money related hand gestures Evans would be questioned.

 

Maybe if his family contributed to a long form espn profile questioning his ability to handle life people would wonder more about Evans maturity.

 

 

Will johnny answer the questions? Maybe, and I can get disagreeing there... But he's certainly earned having to deal with them being asked and to act like its over some photos of him at a frat party is just dishonest.

Edited March 1, 2014 by NoSaint

[Doc]

Nope. I wasn't there from the beginning with Wilson. You seem to be having a conversation with yourself.

No, you were there with Wilson after he had success with the Hawks. But again, that's the wonderful thing about hindsight.

If Manziel bombs, I won't endlessly argue agains the obvious, doc...

"Endlessly argue against the obvious"? Must be a conversation you've been having with yourself.

Immaturity? Like when he was the youngest Heisman winner ever and went to college parties?

 

The whole "Johnny Football parties too much and is a distraction" was the most overblown media construct since Tebow. Were his teammates not going to parties? Did Mike Evans, a highly rated WR in this draft, not go out drinking at frat parties? Manziel was the most famous college football player because of what he did. He had one of the worst college defenses and beat the "dynasty" team in the SEC which is filled with future NFL players. Is it any shock that people took pictures and videos of him doing what every other college athlete was doing?

It's not just the immaturity, which is why I also mentioned his style of play.

[Mr. WEO]

If you dislike SJ13 you will certainly be rustled by JM, his actions on the field were pretty awful.

 

Really? List them.

 

I don't mind disagreeing on a guy but it irks me when people blatantly misrepresent things. If it were just a few frat parties, no one would've said a word. It was putting himself in dumb places after he already had a few big public mess ups and had the spotlight on him.

 

If Evans was arrested for fighting in the streets and giving police a fake ID, or after the heisman went to a major WR camp and decided to go a few hours down the road and party til 4am and not be able to show up for work the next morning - he would have his maturity questioned.

 

Maybe if he was accused of risking his college career over getting paid with his handler "uncle Nate" for some autographs, the two of them being photographed with stacks (or even a trash bag) of cash and then after serving a brief suspension for the cash related issues returned to the field making money related hand gestures Evans would be questioned.

 

Maybe if his family contributed to a long form espn profile questioning his ability to handle life people would wonder more about Evans maturity.

 

 

Will johnny answer the questions? Maybe, and I can get disagreeing there... But he's certainly earned having to deal with them being asked and to act like its over some photos of him at a frat party is just dishonest.

 

Did he not answer them this season? What were the episodes that concerned you off the field this season?

[NoSaint]

 

 

Really? List them.

 

 

 

Did he not answer them this season? What were the episodes that concerned you off the field this season?

 

He may have turned the page, but the money thing on the field after his suspension struck me as pretty darn immature still. If we are limiting the discussion to widely reported incident between November and February, he's passed the test - it's a low bar but you have to start somewhere. Realistically, you and I don't know a ton about how the kids handling his business day to day right now or what's in his head today so I'll stick to my assessment that he's earned some questions and we will see how he answers them.

 

I'll take the redemption story over the crash and burn one for any athlete - so hopefully he's on the right track. If he's doing the work to be a work in progress both as a football player and a person, good on him.

 

 

[3rdand12]

He is going to be a huge bust. But as others say let's hope he is top 8 material!

Well said !

[Ozymandius]

I've been "on the record" before but won't mind repeating it again.

 

Manziel will be a better QB than EJ Manuel. Therefore, should the Bills be in a position to draft Manziel, they should do so. If they pass on him, they'll regret it.

 

We'll see how it plays out.

[YoloinOhio]