FireChan Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Wait, why does EJ only get to the end of 2014? How come he doesn't get the same three seasons that Rodgers got? GO BILLS!!! Because Rodgers was a backup. EJ is the starter. In Rodgers first full season, he threw 28 TD's to 13 picks. Does that sound like EJ? Manziel will start in 2015 if EJ sucks next year. Manziel has a chance to win the job next year, but most likely will not, and will ride the pine. What HoFer do you think we'll get at #9 k-9? Will he win 4 more games for us? Or is it all on EJ either way? Were you an advocates of letting Gabbert play a third year? He didn't hit 1000 attempts? I'm sure you thought he was gonna make huge strides last season. Edited March 20, 2014 by FireChan
K-9 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Because Rodgers was a backup. EJ is the starter. In Rodgers first full season, he threw 28 TD's to 13 picks. Does that sound like EJ? Manziel will start in 2015 if EJ sucks next year. Manziel has a chance to win the job next year, but most likely will not, and will ride the pine. What HoFer do you think we'll get at #9 k-9? Will he win 4 more games for us? Or is it all on EJ either way? Permit me to rephrase: "In Rodgers' fourth season in the league, he threw for 28 TDs to 13 picks." What HOFer do I think we'll get at 9? I think that's a ridiculous question as the odds of getting an HOFer ANYWHERE in the draft are not good. I do know this though: regardless of who we get at 9, he's already a better prospect as a football player than ANY QB in this draft. And the fact that EJ would accrue his first 3 years as the starter is an ADVANTAGE over Aaron Rodgers'. He should be that much more developed based on experience alone. GO BILLS!!!
FireChan Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Permit me to rephrase: "In Rodgers' fourth season in the league, he threw for 28 TDs to 13 picks." What HOFer do I think we'll get at 9? I think that's a ridiculous question as the odds of getting an HOFer ANYWHERE in the draft are not good. I do know this though: regardless of who we get at 9, he's already a better prospect as a football player than ANY QB in this draft. And the fact that EJ would accrue his first 3 years as the starter is an ADVANTAGE over Aaron Rodgers'. He should be that much more developed based on experience alone. GO BILLS!!! I don't care if the BPA at 9 is the best football prospect in the history of the game. If he's not a QB, we don't win unless EJ plays better. Did Mark Sanchez and Gabbert have a better chance to succeed compared to Rodgers? You can't really believe that. Marrone and company were very comfortable with picking EJ and letting him ride the bench behind Kolb. Why can't we do the same again? Edited March 20, 2014 by FireChan
Dorkington Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 I've read this whole tread and don't remember anyone saying that EJ was a bust or should be benched ASAP. The only things I see are people worried that he will not pan out and that we will be left with nothing AGAIN. Drafting a QB would at least ensure that we have someone to take over next year if EJ doesn't pan out. At best this years drafted QB would be EJ back-up. A case could be made to draft a QB in the later rounds, but if we are trying to play the odds here drafting one in round 1 is the better bet. So you're really wanting to draft a guy just to sit on the bench for a year, just in case EJ doesn't pan out? What happens if bench guy isn't any good either? Guess we draft another QB the next year, as well. Or maybe we should let EJ develop realistically, instead of expecting pro bowl right away. If he stinks it up this upcoming season, then draft a guy in the next draft, instead of wasting a pick on someone who's not going to see the field until 2016 anyways. I say get EJ weapons, and fill up some depth. We already have two backup QBs and a PS QB, no? Why do we want to spend a first round pick for another backup QB?
dave mcbride Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Wait, why does EJ only get to the end of 2014? How come he doesn't get the same three seasons that Rodgers got? GO BILLS!!! Didn't the Packers have a guy named Bret Favre ahead of him?
Section242 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Didn't the Packers have a guy named Bret Favre ahead of him? And were so sure of Rodgers they took Brian Brohm in the 2nd rd going into the year Rodgers was starting for the first time.
K-9 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Didn't the Packers have a guy named Bret Favre ahead of him? That's beside the point. You'd have to ask FireChan what that point is, exactly. He seems to believe that a QB should have the benefit of the time Rodgers had to develop, which is why it's ok for us to draft a QB to play behind EJ, apparently. I just want to know why EJ himself doesn't get the same time frame to develop. GO BILLS!!!
FireChan Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 That's beside the point. You'd have to ask FireChan what that point is, exactly. He seems to believe that a QB should have the benefit of the time Rodgers had to develop, which is why it's ok for us to draft a QB to play behind EJ, apparently. I just want to know why EJ himself doesn't get the same time frame to develop. GO BILLS!!! 1 year to develop. EJ will actually get at least 2, whereas "Manziel" would get one behind the bench, or more if EJ hasn't played himself out of the position like Favre. Rodgers would have been sitting a lot longer if Favre was still playing well.
dave mcbride Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) And were so sure of Rodgers they took Brian Brohm in the 2nd rd going into the year Rodgers was starting for the first time. ... which sort of proves the point of people advocating the drafting of a qb. The Packers always drafted QBs in the Favre years figuring that they'd be great trade bait if Favre stayed the starter. Examples include Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselback, Aaron Brooks, Ty Detmer, Matt Flynn, Brian Brohm, and more. They took Flynn and Brohm in the same year In the 1990s/2000s, they took a QB most years. They weren't always high picks, but they've publicly said that they value the position above all other positions and will always take a QB they like late if he's there. The Bills don't operate like this. Edited March 20, 2014 by dave mcbride
K-9 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 1 year to develop. EJ will actually get at least 2, whereas "Manziel" would get one behind the bench, or more if EJ hasn't played himself out of the position like Favre. Rodgers would have been sitting a lot longer if Favre was still playing well. Why can't EJ get the same three years that Rodgers got? Why, why, why? The additional time Rodgers "would have spent" if Favre hadn't "retired" is irrelevant. For all anyone knows, Rodgers would have unseated Favre anyway, he was playing so well. GO BILLS!!!
dave mcbride Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 That's beside the point. You'd have to ask FireChan what that point is, exactly. He seems to believe that a QB should have the benefit of the time Rodgers had to develop, which is why it's ok for us to draft a QB to play behind EJ, apparently. I just want to know why EJ himself doesn't get the same time frame to develop. GO BILLS!!! The thing is, the Packers DID draft two QBs in the draft immediately following the departure of Favre. Doesn't that prove his point -- i.e., bring in competition and ensure that you have the right guy?
Beerball Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 He still has to earn the position. He still has to establish and maintain credibility within that locker room by proving, like he did last year, he is the best QB on the squad. He still has to compete and make every rep count. The idea that EJ Manuel won't have to compete for his job is just not true. GO BILLS!!! So, by definition, if EJ can beat out Lewis he has earned the starting QB job for the Buffalo Bills. Gotta like those odds. I wish I could say that this would make me feel all warm & fuzzy inside but it won't. How confident will you be in the fortunes of the 2014 Bills if Lewis or one of the other 3 amigos beats out Manuel? What likelihood would you place on the Bills having a winning season in this scenario?
K-9 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 The thing is, the Packers DID draft two QBs in the draft immediately following the departure of Favre. Doesn't that prove his point -- i.e., bring in competition and ensure that you have the right guy? I have no problem with the Bills taking a guy in the mid-rounds. Something like a Reich pick in the 3rd would be fine with me. I see no benefit in investing a pick at 9 when there are prospects rated ASTRONOMICALLY higher. ESPECIALLY when we invested in our guy the year before who has shown enough to warrant a further look. I've already stated my reasoning upthread. I let it rest. GO BILLS!!!
Luxy312 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Just to make sure I have this straight...the Bills should not worry about finding a franchise QB until all the other pieces are in place. Whoa. You're missing the point. They drafted EJ to be a franchise QB. There's very few rookie QB's in NFL history that are great right out of the gates. You don't draft a guy you intend to develop into your franchise QB and then turn around the next year and spend another high draft pick on a QB. The Bills have so many more needs. Glad that Whaley agrees with me.
Beerball Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 Wait, why does EJ only get to the end of 2014? How come he doesn't get the same three seasons that Rodgers got? GO BILLS!!! because i could be dead by the end of the 2015 season
K-9 Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 So, by definition, if EJ can beat out Lewis he has earned the starting QB job for the Buffalo Bills. Gotta like those odds. I wish I could say that this would make me feel all warm & fuzzy inside but it won't. How confident will you be in the fortunes of the 2014 Bills if Lewis or one of the other 3 amigos beats out Manuel? What likelihood would you place on the Bills having a winning season in this scenario? He hasn't earned anything. And it doesn't matter how good or bad Thad Lewis is. It's all about Manuel keeping the job, regardless. While I certainly prefer an Andrew Luck, as I've stated already, none of these guys come close. Especially when there are so many other MUCH higher rated players that would be in better positions to contribute significantly sooner. GO BILLS!!! because i could be dead by the end of the 2015 season I would hope you are giving yourself better than the 30% odds you give Manuel. GO BILLS!!!
Beerball Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 He hasn't earned anything. And it doesn't matter how good or bad Thad Lewis is. It's all about Manuel keeping the job, regardless. While I certainly prefer an Andrew Luck, as I've stated already, none of these guys come close. Especially when there are so many other MUCH higher rated players that would be in better positions to contribute significantly sooner. GO BILLS!!! What I said (intended) was that IF EJ beats out Lewis & Company you feel that he will have earned the job. I'm OK with that. I think it's a forgone conclusion, but that's just me. I've been wrong before. IF it goes the other way and EJ is beaten out, we have to consider this as a real possibility in a competition, how will you feel about the Bills prospects for 2014? Regarding my life expectancy...it depends on how wound up the Bills make me. I am glad to see that you are willing to give EJ until the end of the 2015 season. I think that is only fair.
RuntheDamnBall Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 ... which sort of proves the point of people advocating the drafting of a qb. The Packers always drafted QBs in the Favre years figuring that they'd be great trade bait if Favre stayed the starter. Examples include Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselback, Aaron Brooks, Ty Detmer, Matt Flynn, Brian Brohm, and more. They took Flynn and Brohm in the same year In the 1990s/2000s, they took a QB most years. They weren't always high picks, but they've publicly said that they value the position above all other positions and will always take a QB they like late if he's there. The Bills don't operate like this. Point being they weren't always high picks. Most of the people who think drafting a first round QB is a bad idea also think it'd be a good idea to draft one sometime this April. Only one of those guys was a #1 pick and he got a lot of time.
Dorkington Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 I have no problem with a 4th or later being used on a QB. I think the first three picks should be WR, TE, and OL (in whatever order). Get EJ the tools he needs to be successful.
FireChan Posted March 20, 2014 Posted March 20, 2014 (edited) Why can't EJ get the same three years that Rodgers got? Why, why, why? The additional time Rodgers "would have spent" if Favre hadn't "retired" is irrelevant. For all anyone knows, Rodgers would have unseated Favre anyway, he was playing so well. GO BILLS!!! Rodgers wasn't starting. He didn't play bad enough to lose the back up job. Neither has EJ. But EJ might play bad enough to lose the starting job. Just like if Favre played bad, Rodgers would have started sooner. Edited March 20, 2014 by FireChan
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