The Democrat's Civil War has begun

[OCinBuffalo]

Way back in 2009, Rahm Emanuel knew this war was coming: http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2010/01/26/rahm-emanuel-liberals-are-f-king-retarded/. He called the far-left, who was insisting on single payer: "F'ing Retarded", for threatening to run ads against the Blue Dog Democrats who refused to go along with them. That link is hilarious btw.

 

(Once and for all, the above makes clear that it was the Blue Dog Democrats, who've largely been replaced by Republicans in subsequent elections, who refused to vote for single payer. Republicans had NOTHING to do with that. The Blue Dogs were correct in being afraid of government managed health care. They tried to buy insurance = Lousiana purchase, Cornhusker Kickback, but to no avail. They got caught in the crossfire, between the idiot left, and 65% of the country, wearing the wrong uniform, and they have/will pay the price for that. This is the basis for the Civil War.)

 

We ended up with Obamacare as a result. The far-left, instead of learning, takes away that Single Payer was the right approach all along, and that the reason for FAIL is Obamacare's design, and not the truth: government intervention into health care causes more problems than it solves.

 

Hence this nonsense:

its-time-for-democrats-to-embrace-obamacare

democrats_must_defend_obamacare_327701

special_election_doesn't_prove_obamacare_is_a_loser

dana-milbank-obama-has-a-problem-connecting-to-young-on-health-care

 

Which, if you actually read these, and you are a clear-headed thinker, are quite hilarious. Read them, and you will see the intellectual equivalent of nerds at gym class. Nothing like a good laugh after the week is finished. I especially like the "Blame the Internet" notion from the last one. This is the worst sort of "blame the customer" mentality, combined with "Get off my lawn". As I said: hilarious.

 

Obamacare, the product, sucks. And, we haven't even begun to see the contortions to avoid admitting that. Twister Champions have nothing on these people, but it's all pointless: If Obamacare was delivered by telegram or explained by the boss of the union we were all in, it would still suck, and we would still hate it.

 

Meanwhile, there's things like this(from the Chicago Tribune, not exactly the Weekly Standard):

florida signals Obamacare backlash

 

And, of course, there's the pile on from the right, like this:

sebelius-happy-talk-makes-it-worse-for-democrats

or, whatever B-man posts next in the Obamacare thread.

 

And it's not just limited to Obamacare(but if you think Obamacare can be pushed aside? Idiot.) There's the Keystone pipeline, and the fact that many Democrat politicians are in full retreat mode on Global Warming, while many far-left agitators and donors, are trying to stem the tide. Look at that all night Senate session: that's based on the whims of 1(one) environtologist donor, and his $100 million. This is an election losing issue, so again, Civil War.

 

Meanwhile, there's the abject failure of far-left foreign policy = "engagement" and "reset buttons", and trying to force the USA into being "just a guy", when we are the star player on the team that is NATO. This is an election losing issue, so again, Civil War

 

The far-left, progressive, whatever we call the agenda that comes from Harvard/Berkley, has failed. Failed miserably. We all knew it would, but now most moderate Ds, and ALL independents know: it HAS. Big difference. The lowest of information voter can now be thrown "If you like your doctor, change your Senator", which is right down the middle, so he will hit it out of the park.

 

Only a clown denies that the D party is in big trouble, and much bigger trouble than the GOP. The GOP's problems are largely theoretical, and semantic. The Ds have multiple real-world policy failures that can be used against them, and hurt them severely.

 

Therefore, their Civil War has begun. The only reason you don't hear it: media blackout, and the desire to stay unified to protect their biggest mistake = Obama. They don't want to have to answer for nominating him as well, so they will try to avoid dealing with the policy issues for as long as possible. But, that is their 2nd biggest mistake: staying unified for the sake of defending Obama means there won't be enough time left, in the spring/summer of 2016, for them to have it out on policy, like they would in a normal campaign.

 

No. These issues are far too big for that. They should be getting to work now, and that starts by forcing the far-left to admit that their policies from the 1960s have put the D party in this mess, and now its time for new and better ideas.

 

They will not do this, and all hell is going to break loose. The media, trying to suppress the existence of these policy FAILfrogs, is like trying to hide them in a microwave on high. Sooner or later, it's going to blow, and when it does? That's a mess they can't clean up or deny.

[Tiberius]

I can't find my keys, has anyone seen them?

[Deranged Rhino]

I can't find my keys, has anyone seen them?

I hear the NSA is good at that kind of problem solving...

[3rdnlng]

http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/2014/03/18/facts-and-factions-republicans-turning-on-their-own/?subscriber=1

At a time when polls show public opinion turning against the Democrats, some Republicans seem to be turning against each other. Even with the prospect of being able to win control of the Senate in this fall's elections, some Republicans are busy manufacturing ammunition for their own circular firing squad.

A Republican faction's demonization of their own Senate Minority Leader, Mitch McConnell, is a classic example. If you listen to some of those who consider themselves the only true conservatives, you would never guess that Senator McConnell received a lifetime 90 percent ranking by the American Conservative Union -- and in one recent year had a 100 percent ranking.

Ann Coulter -- whose conservative credentials nobody has ever challenged -- points out in her column that Mitch McConnell has not only led the fight for conservative principles repeatedly, but has been to the right of Ted Cruz on immigration issues.

Someone once said that, in a war, truth is the first casualty. That seems to be the case for some in this internal war among Republicans. As the late Daniel Patrick Moynihan said, "You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts."

Why should those of us who are not Republicans be concerned about any of this?

Fortunately or unfortunately, we have a two-party system in this country. And -- very unfortunately -- we are at a crucial point in the history of America, and perhaps approaching a point of no return.

[Tiberius]

[url="http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/2014/03/18/facts-and-factions-republicans-turning-is fall's elections, some Republicans are busy manufacturing

Someone once said that, in a war, truth is the first casualty. That seems to be the case for some in this internal war among Republicans. As the late Daniel Patrick Moynihan said, "You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts."[/background][/size][/font][/color]

Why should those of us who are not Republicans be concerned about any of system in this country. And -- very unfortunately -- we are at a crucial point in the history of America, and perhaps approaching a point of no return.

no return from what?

[TakeYouToTasker]

http://www.gopusa.com/commentary/2014/03/18/facts-and-factions-republicans-turning-on-their-own/?subscriber=1

At a time when polls show public opinion turning against the Democrats, some Republicans seem to be turning against each other. Even with the prospect of being able to win control of the Senate in this fall's elections, some Republicans are busy manufacturing ammunition for their own circular firing squad.

A Republican faction's demonization of their own Senate Minority Leader, Mitch McConnell, is a classic example. If you listen to some of those who consider themselves the only true conservatives, you would never guess that Senator McConnell received a lifetime 90 percent ranking by the American Conservative Union -- and in one recent year had a 100 percent ranking.

Ann Coulter -- whose conservative credentials nobody has ever challenged -- points out in her column that Mitch McConnell has not only led the fight for conservative principles repeatedly, but has been to the right of Ted Cruz on immigration issues.

Someone once said that, in a war, truth is the first casualty. That seems to be the case for some in this internal war among Republicans. As the late Daniel Patrick Moynihan said, "You are entitled to your own opinion, but not to your own facts."

Why should those of us who are not Republicans be concerned about any of this?

Fortunately or unfortunately, we have a two-party system in this country. And -- very unfortunately -- we are at a crucial point in the history of America, and perhaps approaching a point of no return.

As I've said many times before, I'll worry about the team sport, false choice agenda when one of the two parties represents me, which it never will if I capitulate before I'm represented.

 

Give me libertarian candidates, or I'll vote Democrat in every election, working to destroy your party.

[KD in CA]

Typical Republican stupidity -- crowing about an election that's 7 1/2 months away while your party still has no national identity. They'll blow their big Senate takeover just like in 2010.

[keepthefaith]

I can't find my keys, has anyone seen them?

 

I don't think you can find your ass with either hand.

[Deranged Rhino]

Typical (Modern) Republican stupidity -- crowing about an election that's 7 1/2 months away while your party still has no national identity. They'll blow their big Senate takeover just like in 2010.

This might be the first post we've ever agreed on in PPP, ever.

[KD in CA]

This might be the first post we've ever agreed on in PPP, ever.

 

Really? I generally give you more credit than that!

[IDBillzFan]

Typical Republican stupidity -- crowing about an election that's 7 1/2 months away while your party still has no national identity. They'll blow their big Senate takeover just like in 2010.

 

I get this. I absolutely do. But the truth is, the people who helped botched 2010 realize what they did wrong and have started to come around to the simple truth that losing on principle is still losing. It's better to have an establishment GOP win than a conservative newbee lose.

 

This is how Rahm Emmanuel got control of the WH, House and Senate in 2008. Progressives where he could, Blue Dogs everywhere else. Which is why Barry had to wear knee pads to get ACA passed.

 

Establishment is a big problem in this country, but until they get the Senate and House, they're the least of our concerns.

[Doc]

Typical Republican stupidity -- crowing about an election that's 7 1/2 months away while your party still has no national identity. They'll blow their big Senate takeover just like in 2010.

No, they'll still win the Senate and keep the House.

[John Adams]

Typical Republican stupidity -- crowing about an election that's 7 1/2 months away while your party still has no national identity. They'll blow their big Senate takeover just like in 2010.

 

They won't blow it--we're too far into the current Dem upswing for it not to swing back this year. But while some will call it a sign of Dem Civil War, I see it more as just the usual cycle.

 

The Dems seem more united than the Reps right now. Like you said, the Reps have zero identity. You have the Paul/Ryan Libertarian types who I would hope have more appeal to the middle, the Santorum types who turn the middle off, and the the Bush-era Reps who are basically fiscal Democrats masquerading as Republicans.

[Azalin]

Like you said, the Reps have zero identity. You have the Paul/Ryan Libertarian types who I would hope have more appeal to the middle, the Santorum types who turn the middle off, and the the Bush-era Reps who are basically fiscal Democrats masquerading as Republicans.

that's probably the most accurate summary of the current republican party I've seen in a while.

[TakeYouToTasker]

that's probably the most accurate summary of the current republican party I've seen in a while.

I concur.

[IDBillzFan]

They won't blow it--we're too far into the current Dem upswing for it not to swing back this year. But while some will call it a sign of Dem Civil War, I see it more as just the usual cycle.

 

The Dems seem more united than the Reps right now. Like you said, the Reps have zero identity. You have the Paul/Ryan Libertarian types who I would hope have more appeal to the middle, the Santorum types who turn the middle off, and the the Bush-era Reps who are basically fiscal Democrats masquerading as Republicans.

 

I believe the Santorum types are realizing the country, overall, doesn't care enough about social issues (beyond abortion) any more than they care about a minimum wage hike. Or more to the point, those who do care are learning to just keep quiet for fear of being publicly and repeatedly ridiculed by those who disagree with them.

 

The trick, though, isn't just to keep quiet about these items, but to be prepared for the oddball progressive-media question about abortion or gay rights or whatever. Likewise, when someone on the right screws up, unfortunately the rest of the right needs to be prepared for the onslaught of "Will you denounce that person?" question from the media, which always gets big play.

 

Lay low. Shut up. And just let the progressives stew in their failures because no matter how much you want to play it down the middle, most any sane person can see that the left is a complete mess right now.

Edited March 19, 2014 by LABillzFan

[TakeYouToTasker]

I believe the Santorum types are realizing the country, overall, doesn't care enough about social issues (beyond abortion) any more than they care about a minimum wage hike. Or more to the point, those who do care are learning to just keep quiet for fear of being publicly and repeatedly ridiculed by those who disagree with them.

 

The trick, though, isn't just to keep quiet about these items, but to be prepared for the oddball progressive-media question about abortion or gay rights or whatever. Likewise, when someone on the right screws up, unfortunately the rest of the right needs to be prepared for the onslaught of "Will you denounce that person?" question from the media, which always gets big play.

 

Lay low. Shut up. And just let the progressives stew in their failures because no matter how much you want to play it down the middle, most any sane person can see that the left is a complete mess right now.

However, because of the two party system, that's not how things work.

 

Candidates like Santorum will run, and be very vocal, and put them in the national forefront, to try and get their issues built into the party platform.

[IDBillzFan]

However, because of the two party system, that's not how things work.

 

Candidates like Santorum will run, and be very vocal, and put them in the national forefront, to try and get their issues built into the party platform.

 

And while Santorum does it on the right, people like Cuomo and Bernie Sanders will do similar damage to the left in their challenge to Hillary.

 

Things will be different in 2016 than they were in 2012 because the left will have its primary, so the idiocy of the right won't be as obvious.

[Azalin]

And while Santorum does it on the right, people like Cuomo and Bernie Sanders will do similar damage to the left in their challenge to Hillary.

 

Things will be different in 2016 than they were in 2012 because the left will have its primary, so the idiocy of the right won't be as obvious.

to be honest, I think that Obama has already done a great deal of damage to the democrat party in the eyes of the middle/undecided/unengaged/moderates/etc. until the implementation of Obamacare, the republicans were considered by many to be either paranoid or simply over exaggerating by calling the left 'socialists'. now, many people are realizing that such charges are largely accurate. people can be swayed into thinking themselves as 'liberal' or 'progressive' because those terms imply contemporary thinking as opposed to the perceived stodgy, old-fashioned way of thinking that the word 'conservative' inaccurately implies. for the most part, americans view socialism as it truly is - governmental control of everything - and they still reject it, considering it (if nothing else) to be un-american.

 

I believe the republicans could likely gain more seats in the house and take the senate back simply because many people will be casting their votes against democrats.

Edited March 19, 2014 by Azalin

[OCinBuffalo]

You guys don't see it yet, huh? Curious.

 

Here's another example: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2014/03/19/maddow_without_crimeas_votes_ukraine_is_no_longer_a_pro-russian_nation.html

 

What is really happening with Maddow here? Answer: this whole thing is actually...a "good thing". Because? Now Ukraine is going to be our pals, and Russia has actually screwed up. Which means? Obama's bungling, and in fact, his entire foreign policy of "engagement", known in this case as the "reset button", hasn't actually failed. It's produced good results, albeit unintentionally.

 

What Maddow is really saying: "We shouldn't come down too hard on Obama. This whole thing doesn't matter, because it's producing some good results too."

 

Another example of Maddow thinking she's smarter than she actually is. Were you fooled by this? It's fun to watch people who think they are smarter than me, toil away at their work. What "Pat" doesn't seem to get? She's only contributing to the Democrat Civil War with stuff like this.

 

Consider: is this going to be the take from Democrats in Erie County? Niagara County? Where you live? No way. All but a very few are going to say: "we need to get tougher on foreign policy". Meanwhile? The Campus liberals, who are responsible for the "reset button" in the first place? They are all cheering Maddow, because she is trying to let them, and Obama, the leader of their group, off the hook.

 

It's the same pattern = covering for Obama, and thus NOT having a real dialogue within the Democratic party that says: "do we really want to be known as the party of weakness, again?" Or, "I thought we were done being known as the party of Jimmy Carter, since Clinton, and especially since Obama got Osama, but, now this?".

 

The dialogue needs to happen, and it needs to start now. If they don't try to get on the same page, this whole thing is going to cause a serious rift later. The longer it is allowed to fester, the better chance of blowing up in 2016. What is happening instead? Covering Obama is keeping the Ds from having this discussion.

 

Meanwhile, the Rs are having all sorts of discussions, and yeah having it out with each other. But, in the end, we all know it's better to work out your problems, rather than pretend they don't exist. The result of this will be a healthy process creating R strength and real unity. The media, and some of you: seize on the news that Rand Paul said something bad about Ted Cruz. You are missing the point(which is fairly normal for some of you). He said it, now, which means he won't say it again/somebody is going to win that argument, and then? It's over. It's behind us. It's not coming up again in a year. Better to get these things out of the way NOW, rather than in the Primary season.

 

In contrast: the phony unity created by covering for Obama is only another "Missouri Compromise" and will do nothing to prevent this Civil War either.