stony Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 They spend a ton of money, too. When you have an all-time great at QB nearing the end of his career, you can do that with the expectation that you win the Super Bowl immediately and then can cut them all (or some) and rebuild a couple years later. Yup. I love Peyton and hope he gets another, but a harsh reality will set in next season or season after if they haven't won it all. Cool position to be in, no doubt. But it'll be a very sobering reality if they're ring-less in two years and have a bunch of 33-34 yr old guys making 7-10 mil. But like I said, cool position to be in.
BADOLBILZ Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 If the Bills would have signed Byrd, I bet many would feel WAY different about this move and more references to Urbic's career would be made. So much emotion. I think you are half right. Williams is UNDENIABLY a very underwhelming player........but the contract value is still very insignificant IMO and if the Bills hadn't just lost an All Pro player from their roster then the expectations to replace him wouldn't be part of the equation. The reality is that the Bills are perceived by 100% of people to be one of the very worst franchises in the league. It's not subjective whatsoever at this point. As such, they will have to overpay for free agents to get them to make the move as long as they continue to be losers. The question is does the revolving door of premium talent being allowed to leave make financial sense when it then causes you to have to overpay for journeyman-types like Chris Williams? I mean if you overpay a Chris Williams by a million per year.....what are you gaining in the long run by deciding Byrd isn't worth a million more than some other team? It's like the old anti-drug commercial "I do cocaine so I can work more..so I can make more money...so I can buy more cocaine".....the failure is circuitous with this organization. At some point you have to try a different approach. You simply can't keep doing the same things and expecting different results.
NoSaint Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Not that they are done with the OL or that he wouldn't need to earn the starting job. i dont think they are done with the OL - not at all what i was trying to imply, but i will include this quote from chris browns article on BB.com with regards to the starting job Left guard is where Williams said he is expected to line up as Buffalo’s commitment to him makes the starting job his to lose
auburnbillsbacker Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 I am of course hoping for the best, but I am expecting the worse. Williams has not been a very good player. It is my fear that the bills will use the 8.6 they saved by not using the franchise tag on Byrd by signing more guys like Williams. They would have been much better of in my opinion, using the tag on Byrd then using a 3rd-5th round pick on a LG. I think they could have gotten similar production to Williams by signing a vet at the league minimum. Maybe our coaches will be the ones that can finally get Williams to play well. I guess we can dream.
Beerball Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Agreed. Considering Levitre got 8M LAST year, his contract seems very middling to me. For all we know, he'll play RG. Plus, in addition to Legursky/Brown, these are the personnel guys who also brought us Glenn and from the scrap heap Peers and Urbrik. I'm guessing they have slightly more credibility than a website who whittles offensive line play to numbers (sounds comical at face value) Henceforth Chris Williams will be known as Chris "The Big Cat" Williams in your honor. Congratulations!
stony Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 I think you are half right. Williams is UNDENIABLY a very underwhelming player........but the contract value is still very insignificant IMO and if the Bills hadn't just lost an All Pro player from their roster then the expectations to replace him wouldn't be part of the equation. The reality is that the Bills are perceived by 100% of people to be one of the very worst franchises in the league. It's not subjective whatsoever at this point. As such, they will have to overpay for free agents to get them to make the move as long as they continue to be losers. The question is does the revolving door of premium talent being allowed to leave make financial sense when it then causes you to have to overpay for journeyman-types like Chris Williams? I mean if you overpay a Chris Williams by a million per year.....what are you gaining in the long run by deciding Byrd isn't worth a million more than some other team? It's like the old anti-drug commercial "I do cocaine so I can work more..so I can make more money...so I can buy more cocaine".....the failure is circuitous with this organization. At some point you have to try a different approach. You simply can't keep doing the same things and expecting different results. That's hilarious, I don't remember that. Not the failure part, the commercial.
Astrobot Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Advantages of the Chris Williams signing: former first-round pick Bill Polian had him in his Top 50 Free Agents - ahead of Jairus Byrd Coach Marrone played O line in the NFL and knows talent better then any of us. came from a team that could run the ball once drafted 14th overall solid character turns 29 before next season. Mar 12 won't break the bank: four-year, $13.5 million contract with $5.5 million guaranteed. Rams did want him back believes he can still improve as a player with offensive line coach Pat Morris and Marrone on the staff. has lined up at guard and tackle, so is a safety net at LG and RT in case the draft steers Bills elsewhere started all 16 games in 2013 at LG for the Rams experience, which drafted kid won't have Day1: Thirty-six of his 54 career starts have come at OG with another 18 at OT. This would be his seventh season in NFL. you can wear a Williams jersey and cover 13% of the Bills "Disadvantages": Won't change the draft at all; if their guy is available (in RD3 or RD5 we think), Bills still draft LG graded out as Pro Football Focus' No. 74 guard among 81 qualifiers in 2013, and finished 76th in pass blocking (but on a very bad Rams' line) Williams was part of that line that got Bradford killed for the few years. Coach Marrone arms look bigger than his ripped as being pretty bad by the guy covering the Rams for ESPN Not the signing I was hoping for (Jones from Packers at WR)
RealityCheck Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 I think you are half right. Williams is UNDENIABLY a very underwhelming player........but the contract value is still very insignificant IMO and if the Bills hadn't just lost an All Pro player from their roster then the expectations to replace him wouldn't be part of the equation. The reality is that the Bills are perceived by 100% of people to be one of the very worst franchises in the league. It's not subjective whatsoever at this point. As such, they will have to overpay for free agents to get them to make the move as long as they continue to be losers. The question is does the revolving door of premium talent being allowed to leave make financial sense when it then causes you to have to overpay for journeyman-types like Chris Williams? I mean if you overpay a Chris Williams by a million per year.....what are you gaining in the long run by deciding Byrd isn't worth a million more than some other team? It's like the old anti-drug commercial "I do cocaine so I can work more..so I can make more money...so I can buy more cocaine".....the failure is circuitous with this organization. At some point you have to try a different approach. You simply can't keep doing the same things and expecting different results. I think that the real lynchpin to all of the Bills problems is the QB position. I know that some fans obsess over the Bills finances and the business of the game, but based on these boards, I feel that many are barely qualified to handle their own financial affairs. I have to do all I can to keep mine in order, and focusing on a billion dollar industry's financial mechanics has nothing to do with my enjoyment of watching football. Players come and players go. One thing holds true for the past 15 years. A franchise QB has not come, and they haven't become one when they left. What else is there? That is the problem. I can't possibly agree to anything else.
Pete Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 I think Bradford and Cutler got beat up more then any other QBs the past 5 years. Williams was part of both those lines
BADOLBILZ Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 I think that the real lynchpin to all of the Bills problems is the QB position. I know that some fans obsess over the Bills finances and the business of the game, but based on these boards, I feel that many are barely qualified to handle their own financial affairs. I have to do all I can to keep mine in order, and focusing on a billion dollar industry's financial mechanics has nothing to do with my enjoyment of watching football. Players come and players go. One thing holds true for the past 15 years. A franchise QB has not come, and they haven't become one when they left. What else is there? That is the problem. I can't possibly agree to anything else. Well, if that's your opinion you would probably agree with my "draft a QB in round one every year philosophy". If you are constantly letting your early picks go as their first contracts are expiring....when they are just really reaching their prime....what's the difference? Lynch, Poz, Edwards draft class........first three rounds....all gone next season? Maybin, Wood, Byrd, Levitre draft class......three out of 4 gone. They actually hit on 5 of 7 picks and all they have left to show for it is Wood......who incidentally was acquired with the pick from the Eagles for All Pro Jason Peters I absolutely agree that QB is the key.......but if you are going to do something......do it right. If that means drafting RB's and DB's then sign the f'ing guys when they pan out.
Lothar Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) From the guys who covered him on the Bears and Rams ... this just feels like a "meh" signing. http://espn.go.com/b...-chris-williams Rodak: Nick, what was your sense on how the Rams valued Williams? Do you think they wanted to bring him back as a starter? Wagoner: They had interest in bringing him back, though I think it's likely if he'd come back he would have either been a backup or, more likely, in a competition for the starting job like he was in 2013. To me, it made sense if they could get him back to serve as a swing man simply because he could play anywhere on the line except center. Having a player like that at a cheap price is pretty much ideal for a backup. But I don't think they were going to extend themselves too far to bring him back. Offensive line coach Paul Boudreau has a great reputation for taking reclamation projects and getting something out of them. Although this is another starter subtracted from the line, I believe the Rams feel they can upgrade the starter at this spot and develop someone else to fill a backup swing role he could have had. Edited March 12, 2014 by Lothar
Buffaloed in Pa Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Polian has him a B grade. Not too bad.Feel alittle better now.
NoSaint Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 From the guys who covered him on the Bears and Rams ... this just feels like a "meh" signing. http://espn.go.com/b...-chris-williams Rodak: Nick, what was your sense on how the Rams valued Williams? Do you think they wanted to bring him back as a starter? Wagoner: They had interest in bringing him back, though I think it's likely if he'd come back he would have either been a backup or, more likely, in a competition for the starting job like he was in 2013. To me, it made sense if they could get him back to serve as a swing man simply because he could play anywhere on the line except center. Having a player like that at a cheap price is pretty much ideal for a backup. But I don't think they were going to extend themselves too far to bring him back. Offensive line coach Paul Boudreau has a great reputation for taking reclamation projects and getting something out of them. Although this is another starter subtracted from the line, I believe the Rams feel they can upgrade the starter at this spot and develop someone else to fill a backup swing role he could have had. a couple weeks ago he speculated that they might be well served and probably able to extend another contract similar to last years (1 year, 1m plus incentives).... hes been pretty vocal that he cant believe the deal he received.
Billsguy Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Advantages of the Chris Williams signing: former first-round pick Bill Polian had him in his Top 50 Free Agents - ahead of Jairus Byrd Coach Marrone played O line in the NFL and knows talent better then any of us. came from a team that could run the ball once drafted 14th overall solid character turns 29 before next season. Mar 12 won't break the bank: four-year, $13.5 million contract with $5.5 million guaranteed. Rams did want him back believes he can still improve as a player with offensive line coach Pat Morris and Marrone on the staff. has lined up at guard and tackle, so is a safety net at LG and RT in case the draft steers Bills elsewhere started all 16 games in 2013 at LG for the Rams experience, which drafted kid won't have Day1: Thirty-six of his 54 career starts have come at OG with another 18 at OT. This would be his seventh season in NFL. you can wear a Williams jersey and cover 13% of the Bills "Disadvantages": Won't change the draft at all; if their guy is available (in RD3 or RD5 we think), Bills still draft LG graded out as Pro Football Focus' No. 74 guard among 81 qualifiers in 2013, and finished 76th in pass blocking (but on a very bad Rams' line) Williams was part of that line that got Bradford killed for the few years. Coach Marrone arms look bigger than his ripped as being pretty bad by the guy covering the Rams for ESPN Not the signing I was hoping for (Jones from Packers at WR) I enjoyed your summary even though most of it is invalid. (No offense intended) I would argue about the big picture. On the whole, you can't build a championship team if your franchise is a bottom feeder. Signing players off the worst teams in the league will not catapult your team into the top echelon of the league. The Bills only hope is that they hit a couple of home runs in the draft. If they continue to bring in borderline free agents, then the future remains bleak!
Rubes Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Polian has him a B grade. Not too bad.Feel alittle better now. Nonsense. Plenty of people here know a hell of a lot more than Polian.
Beerball Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Nonsense. Plenty of people here know a hell of a lot more than Polian. Apparently Polian is on an island. Difficult to find much else positive about the guy.
Peter Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Nonsense. Plenty of people here know a hell of a lot more than Polian. . . . especially on this board . . . . Apparently Polian is on an island. Difficult to find much else positive about the guy. Revis Island?
Buffaloed in Pa Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Ha,ha,ha.Time will tell Ruby. I really don`t care anymore. Till or if we get a new owner,nothing will change. More than anything,we need a FRANCHISE QB.
RealityCheck Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 Well, if that's your opinion you would probably agree with my "draft a QB in round one every year philosophy". If you are constantly letting your early picks go as their first contracts are expiring....when they are just really reaching their prime....what's the difference? Lynch, Poz, Edwards draft class........first three rounds....all gone next season? Maybin, Wood, Byrd, Levitre draft class......three out of 4 gone. They actually hit on 5 of 7 picks and all they have left to show for it is Wood......who incidentally was acquired with the pick from the Eagles for All Pro Jason Peters I absolutely agree that QB is the key.......but if you are going to do something......do it right. If that means drafting RB's and DB's then sign the f'ing guys when they pan out. Dude, now that first round QBs aren't getting 30 million guaranteed anymore, I agree that this team should take one in the draft every year until they find one. I disagree on constant first round picking as some automatic thing, but to go and get who they like each year. There is more than one round to consider. I disagree on the idea of bouncing the roster off the cap however until you actually find "the guy". I won't debate that part with you as I am in general set in my ways with how I budget my own business and focus on my "lynchpins" before hitting the throttle. You are clear on your position also. People speak lightly of how others should spend their capital and I have no ear for those types of conversations. It's a point that I will agree to disagree with you on. But yeah bro, this team may not be in the market for a QB with their first round pick, but somewhere along the line I think they should draft another one this year. So on and so forth until they get it right. If this season is more of the same, then next year's first round it is. Bad QB play kills the ROI of the cash spent each season it occurs. Why max out the cap when the QB will handicap the big show? To each his own. Cheers.
Lv-Bills Posted March 12, 2014 Posted March 12, 2014 On the ride home today, I was listening to Jim Miller and Pat Kirwan and a fan who likes the Bills called in and asked them how they like what the Bills have done so far. In a nutshell, said they re-signed their kicker. Nothing more. No comments on Caussin. Debated Byrd a bit both ways. And the most decisive answer about Chris Williams was that they hoped that Williams wasn't signed to be a starter. Period. If he was, they aren't impressed. Miller said the smallest glimmer of hope from Williams thus far in his career was the brief period that the Bears tried him at RT. Other than that, he hasn't been that good. Kirwan said he's a backup.
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