K-9 Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 Don't be surprised if the Bills draft the safety out of Alabama with the 9th pick this year & if they do that I am cancelling my season tickets the next morning. I don't entirely blame the Bills in this whole situation. It sounds like they made him a more then fair offer. I just don't think he wants to play for the Bills anymore. With that being said, this is just a typical type move for the Bills. A very good player leaves & they draft their replacement. The problem with this is you never get to build on the prio season. Don't worry, you won't have to give up your tickets. They will not be taking a safety at 9. GO BILLS!!!
mrags Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 Don't be surprised if the Bills draft the safety out of Alabama with the 9th pick this year & if they do that I am cancelling my season tickets the next morning. I don't entirely blame the Bills in this whole situation. It sounds like they made him a more then fair offer. I just don't think he wants to play for the Bills anymore. With that being said, this is just a typical type move for the Bills. A very good player leaves & they draft their replacement. The problem with this is you never get to build on the prio season. i completely understand your frustration and you make a very good point. But at the end of the day. It's something all teams do. Players leave in Free Agency, you replace then with the best you can. If that person is on the roster, in FA, or in the draft, you do what you can. All teams have this problem. Some teams get lucky and happen to draft replacements prior to this happening. For example, the Texans parted ways with Mario Williams simply because they found their defensive pass rusher in JJ Watt prior to his release. Other teams are not so lucky, like the Chiefs after the loss of Tony Gonzales. When you have a really good player at a certain position, you always run the risk of losing that player. It's just the way of the NFL. With all that being said, I really hope we don't draft a FS at #9. Stick with Williams and Meeks and Leonard for the year, maybe draft a mod round talent if he's a steal in the draft. Other than that, we should concentrate on other positions that mean more to this team.
Mike in Syracuse Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 A bit of advice: pay close attention to what Murph has to say on his show. For over a week now he's been all about not re-signing Byrd. I truly believe he's been given inside information. His job is to lube us up. I truly believe that. The second I heard him speak on the subject I knew Byrd wouldn't be tagged. I don't think that's entirely accurate. He's been asking repeatedly if people feel that the Safety position is worth $10M ? He's openly stated that he doesn't believe it is and has pointed to the fact that Safeties have one of the lowest franchise tag numbers. They're only slightly above punters, kickers and TE's. He also points out that very few teams in the league are willing to pay a safety huge $. He's asked people to call in and give their position, I think that's what he's supposed to do!
BADOLBILZ Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 i completely understand your frustration and you make a very good point. But at the end of the day. It's something all teams do. Players leave in Free Agency, you replace then with the best you can. If that person is on the roster, in FA, or in the draft, you do what you can. All teams have this problem. Some teams get lucky and happen to draft replacements prior to this happening. For example, the Texans parted ways with Mario Williams simply because they found their defensive pass rusher in JJ Watt prior to his release. Other teams are not so lucky, like the Chiefs after the loss of Tony Gonzales. When you have a really good player at a certain position, you always run the risk of losing that player. It's just the way of the NFL. With all that being said, I really hope we don't draft a FS at #9. Stick with Williams and Meeks and Leonard for the year, maybe draft a mod round talent if he's a steal in the draft. Other than that, we should concentrate on other positions that mean more to this team. The Bills aren't all teams.......by definition they are the least successful team in the NFL over the last 14 years. At some point you have to fight your way out of that or be resigned to failure. They had the money and the leverage. They didn't use it. Inexcusable.
birdog1960 Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 Don't be surprised if the Bills draft the safety out of Alabama with the 9th pick this year & if they do that I am cancelling my season tickets the next morning. I don't entirely blame the Bills in this whole situation. It sounds like they made him a more then fair offer. I just don't think he wants to play for the Bills anymore. With that being said, this is just a typical type move for the Bills. A very good player leaves & they draft their replacement. The problem with this is you never get to build on the prio season. this is the take away from this series of events. the bills fo is just not good enough to produce a winner consistently or even likely ever. whether they couldn't make the deal because the gm was ineffectual, the gm wasn't really in control, byrd and parker were immovable and unreasonable, they actually offered less than market, byrd couldn't stomach working in a losing, dysfunctional environment any more or all of the above, is inconsequential. this recurring theme of not re signing your best drafted players while preaching the philosophy of building through the draft is futile and stupid. i only hope it's not also dishonest but i suspect it is.
Cash Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 No doubt. One point though is that if they tagged him, they have to pay him $8.3M, according to what I've read. Then the leak was that they offered a long-term deal that paid him $30M in the first 3 years. Then they decided not to tag him. The numbers don't seem to work for the strictly budget-driven concept though. $8.3M is less than $10M. So, they offered more than "sticker price" and then balked? And, if he's worth $10M for the next three years, might it not have been worth paying that last year to avoid this eventual fiasco? Or was the $6.9M too much? The difference, $3M, was less than the dead money they ate on the Fitzpatrick deal, which was ballyhooed at the time as a good deal because they could turn around and get rid of Fitzpatrick at any time by some... I get it that Byrd wants to try free agency. That's the system and that's what he wants. And, if he doesn't care to be part of the Buffalo Bills any longer, there isn't much they can say now to change his mind. Good luck to him. The only question is, what was in the rest of that offer? There's probably a reason that the Bills only leaked the part about $10mil/year for the first 3 years. Maybe it was a 6-year, $45 million deal? Maybe it was 4 years, $36 million, but with no guaranteed money? If the Bills are really misrepresenting the nature of their offer, then this situation changes. I don't really think they are, though. Don't get me wrong -- if the full offer was as good as the part they leaked, they would've leaked the whole thing. But I get the impression that they really want(ed) to keep Byrd and made a legitimately reasonable offer. Byrd might be sick of losing and having a new DC every year, and maybe it means more to him to go to a more stable situation where he's got a better chance of making the playoffs. Or maybe he just really wants to see what his true market value is, and once he does, he'll consider the Bills' offer. I don't expect that, but I wouldn't 100% rule it out at this point. Anyway, I don't have any anger or outrage over this, at least not yet. I do think the Bills made a legit attempt to keep him, and I also think that there has to be a limit where the price tag is too high, no matter how good the player is. I knock management a lot, but I honestly do think that if there was likely to be a decent trade market, the Bills would've tagged him. This is at least a little similar to Levitre last year so far. The problem there wasn't necessarily letting him walk -- even at the time, you could easily argue the Titans overpaid. The problem was the plan to replace him was basically, "sit on a pile of money." I hope that the Bills have learned their lesson, and have a much better plan to replace Byrd. That doesn't necessarily mean spending a ton on his immediate replacement, but it does mean taking the money budgeted towards Byrd and spending it to help the team.
Gordio Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 this is the take away from this series of events. the bills fo is just not good enough to produce a winner consistently or even likely ever. whether they couldn't make the deal because the gm was ineffectual, the gm wasn't really in control, byrd and parker were immovable and unreasonable, they actually offered less than market, byrd couldn't stomach working in a losing, dysfunctional environment any more or all of the above, is inconsequential. this recurring theme of not re signing your best drafted players while preaching the philosophy of building through the draft is futile and stupid. i only hope it's not also dishonest but i suspect it is. This sums up my frustration exactly. Well said.
mrags Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 The Bills aren't all teams.......by definition they are the least successful team in the NFL over the last 14 years. At some point you have to fight your way out of that or be resigned to failure. They had the money and the leverage. They didn't use it. Inexcusable. i agree that what has happened in the past has proved we don't do things correctly. But you are not looking past the Bills failures in the past. The fact is, all NFL teams lose free agents. It happens. Some of them are huge names and have better games than Byrd. Mario Williams and Julius Peppers are huge examples of that. I agree that at some point you have to keep your talent. And we are under the cap and why wouldn't you pay for arguably the best player you have in your team. But arguments could easily be made that you don't pay $10m+ for a safety. Most teams wouldn't even think about it. Because of the leverage with the franchise tag, I agree that is inexcusable. But we're not in that room when that conversation goes down. What if Byrd and his agent say they will hold out until week 10 this year??? What if they say, no matter where you trade is we won't sign the tender??? What if they say they will refuse to sign with ANY team that we trade then to??? In the end, maybe Byrd just wants to test the waters and see what he's worth. In the end, what if the best anyone offers him is $9m. We offered him $10m. And then he comes crawling back for what would be the best offer???
MDH Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 (edited) I agree that at some point you have to keep your talent. And we are under the cap and why wouldn't you pay for arguably the best player you have in your team. But arguments could easily be made that you don't pay $10m+ for a safety. Most teams wouldn't even think about it. I keep seeing this said, "you don't pay $10M for a safety." Two points about this: One, I agree, safeties are generally the least important position on the D. However, how much do you pay for a player who is near the league leader in turnovers year in year out? Byrd does it no matter the D he's in. He has a knack for being in the right place over and over again. Turnovers are pretty much universally accepted as the most important stat in football. The one that correlates to a team winning more than just about any other. How much is a player worth who causes so many turnovers? I think this has to enter somewhere into the equation. Two, if an organization isn't willing to pay top dollar for certain positions then for the love of god stop drafting those positions early in the draft! Draft positions that you think ARE important and worth paying top dollar for. Byrd was drafted #42, that's pretty early for a spot not considered that important. The only way to hold onto players after their first contract is up is to pay them market value. If you hit on high draft picks those contracts are going to cost a team so make sure you're willing to pay that money when you draft them. Otherwise you're just running on a treadmill and getting nowhere. Edited March 4, 2014 by MDH
mannc Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 For those who say Byrd is good, but not "elite" (whatever that means), from an article on Si.com.: "In 2013, per Pro Football Focus’ game charting, Byrd was targeted 22 times on 359 passing snaps played. He gave up a ridiculously low 83 total yards (51 after the catch) in just 11 receptions, which is especially impressive for a player who defends the deep half a great deal of the time. Byrd gave up just one touchdown and intercepted four passes. No qualifying safety — including those who play in the box most of the time — gave up fewer total yards. In 2012, Byrd was targeted 21 times in 561 passing snaps, allowing 16 receptions for 156 yards (76 of those after the catch), no touchdowns, and five picks. So, there’s an argument to be made that from a pure pass defense perspective, Byrd has been the NFL’s most dominant in total over the last two years." The Bills' decision not to tag Byrd is puzzling, to say the least, but none of us knows what went on in the negotiating room. It is possible that the Bills agreed not to tag Byrd as a show of good faith, in exchange for a promise by Byrd to give the Bills the right to match any offer Byrd receives on the open market. In any case, I fully expect Byrd to be the highest paid Safety in football next year.
Gugny Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 The Bills aren't all teams.......by definition they are the least successful team in the NFL over the last 14 years. At some point you have to fight your way out of that or be resigned to failure. They had the money and the leverage. They didn't use it. Inexcusable. I have literally never seen you post anything positive about the Bills. Why do you continue to "be a fan" if you hate them so much? I'm not asking you to stop posting. I couldn't care less. But I am curious as to why you continue to follow them and frequent a website devoted to them. The constant bashing must get as old for you as it has for me.
TallskiWallski83 Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 i completely understand your frustration and you make a very good point. But at the end of the day. It's something all teams do. Players leave in Free Agency, you replace then with the best you can. If that person is on the roster, in FA, or in the draft, you do what you can. All teams have this problem. Some teams get lucky and happen to draft replacements prior to this happening. For example, the Texans parted ways with Mario Williams simply because they found their defensive pass rusher in JJ Watt prior to his release. Other teams are not so lucky, like the Chiefs after the loss of Tony Gonzales. When you have a really good player at a certain position, you always run the risk of losing that player. It's just the way of the NFL. With all that being said, I really hope we don't draft a FS at #9. Stick with Williams and Meeks and Leonard for the year, maybe draft a mod round talent if he's a steal in the draft. Other than that, we should concentrate on other positions that mean more to this team. The logic last year was that we let Levitre walk to sign byrd. The logic will now be that we let Byrd walk to sign Dareus Or Spiller....its a repeatable pattern with this organization and its been going on for 10 + years.
Storm Front Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 It would be funny if Byrd signed for bid dollars with a bad team and then went out and played like he did his second or third seasons with the Bills. Fans of his new team are gonna be mightily disappointed.
maryland-bills-fan Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 Byrd was coming off two subpar seasons until his great 2012 season. So the 2013 season cemented his greatness as a top safety. Also, there are teams out there that Byrd wants clearly to go to who have the cap space that the Bills would have been able to do a sign and trade deal with. So I don't buy that he wouldn't have signed a Bills contract with the intent of being traded. If all of that fell through, the Bills would still not have a gaping hole to fill in their secondary. Now not only are they bad at stopping the run, they will be bad at stopping the pass. This was an epic fail by the Bills. Byrd and his agent are the gaping hole. The franchise system was worked out by the league and the player's association in order to protect the rights and investments of both owners and players. A foundation of it is that if the player signs the franchise tender and salary, the player will perform and play. NOT take a third of the year off with a fake injury and establish the he will take 80% of the year off if tagged again. The Bills shouldn't deal with slimeballs.
mrags Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 The logic last year was that we let Levitre walk to sign byrd. The logic will now be that we let Byrd walk to sign Dareus Or Spiller....its a repeatable pattern with this organization and its been going on for 10 + years. we let Levitre walk so we could sign Byrd? Really??? That's your argument? That's what your going with? Show me anywhere that states that is why we let Levitre walk. I'll give you a dollar. Pretty sure we let Levitre walk because he was in the exact same boat Byrd was in. You don't overpay for a position that is not a DE, LT, WR, QB, CB at the top of their games. If you wanted to pay a guard $50m then thank god that your not our GM. And if you think Spiller is worth keeping at any price, then I don't know what to say either. He hasn't shown anything overly spectacular that warrants a high priced contract. And anything he has shown gets negated by his lack of staying healthy or consistent.
maryland-bills-fan Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 The logic last year was that we let Levitre walk to sign byrd. The logic will now be that we let Byrd walk to sign Dareus Or Spiller....its a repeatable pattern with this organization and its been going on for 10 + years. Tiny Tim Levitre was a finesse, zone-blocking, fast feet type offensive guard. Notice that his listed weight is 20-30 pounds below any of the other starters. He doesn't fit the profile of the Bills offensive line. He can not anchor or push back the very big and good nose guards in the AFL East. What do you expect to have gotten for him? You get guards in the 3rd to 5th round most of the time.
Mike in Syracuse Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 (edited) Buffalo Sports @Buffalo_Sports 37m So I have heard the #Bills official offer to Byrd that he turned down was 6 years, $62.5 million (Front loaded). I'm starting to see that nothing Whaley does is going to change Byrd's position. He wants out and his agent is pushing all the buttons: Aaron (LA) How weird would it be to play for another team? Jairus Byrd (12:15 PM) It will be extremely different. You spend so much time in one place. It will be a big change for me. To adapt and everything. Jeff [via mobile] Are u planning to meet with as many teams as you can ? Jairus Byrd (12:15 PM) I don't really know what the plan is. I'm letting my agent handle all of that stuff. I'm waiting to hear from him. Edited March 4, 2014 by Mike in Syracuse
boyst Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 Buffalo Sports @Buffalo_Sports 37m So I have heard the #Bills official offer to Byrd that he turned down was 6 years, $62.5 million (Front loaded). who is that?
TC in St. Louis Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 Is it possible that Byrd and his guy are just trying to see what the market will bear? maybe they'll come back and give the Bills a chance to sign him.
Luxy312 Posted March 4, 2014 Posted March 4, 2014 Byrd and his agent are the gaping hole. The franchise system was worked out by the league and the player's association in order to protect the rights and investments of both owners and players. A foundation of it is that if the player signs the franchise tender and salary, the player will perform and play. NOT take a third of the year off with a fake injury and establish the he will take 80% of the year off if tagged again. The Bills shouldn't deal with slimeballs. Kudos to you for not having the typical short term Bills fan memory. People continue to try to place the blame squarely at the feet of the organization without any consideration for the remainder of the facts. The simple fact here is that he sat out 6 games last season and to me it wasn't very clear at all that it was injury related. Anyone who knows anything at all about Parker knows that he's a complete turd. I for one am glad that the Bills stepped above the fray here and simply let Byrd test the market. If I were the Bills, there is ZERO chance I would revisit the 6-year $62.5 million offer that they turned down.
Recommended Posts