who thinks we will go OT in the 1st round

[Baba Booey]

You build your line with proven OL's in Free Agency, you draft playmakers. We need someone for EJ to throw to. TE's and WR's / LB's is who we should be targeting.

 

#1 Watkins if there, Ebron or Mosely

#2 Serifian-Jenkins / Moncrief / Skov

[thewildrabbit]

You build your line with proven OL's in Free Agency, you draft playmakers. We need someone for EJ to throw to. TE's and WR's / LB's is who we should be targeting.

 

#1 Watkins if there, Ebron or Mosely

#2 Serifian-Jenkins / Moncrief / Skov

and how has that worked out for this franchise the last 14 years? Because that is more or less what they have in constantly drafting defense, DB's, RB's , and the one time they go O line in Eric Wood they get a very good starter.

 

2004 WR Lee Evans 13th & QB JP Losman 22nd.. how much impact did those #1's skill players have? were they difference makers?

 

2005 WE Roscoe Parrish #55 second round pick, because the team traded away its first to the Cowboys for JP

 

2006 DB Donte Whitner #8, John McCargo #26 how did these two work out? Whitner in SF, and McCargo a complete bust

 

2007 RB Marshawn Lynch #12, now has a SB ring with the Seahawks because the Bills traded him for a 4th

 

2008 DB Leodis McKelvin #11....

 

2009 DE Aaron Maybin #11, C Eric Wood #28. Maybin a complete bust and Wood a solid starter.

 

2010 RB CJ Spiller #9, when the team was desperate for a decent LT the team chose a RB in a position that already had a #1 RB in Lynch. skill player.

 

2011 DT Marcell Dareus #3 overall. in retrospect do the Bills even consider MD? AJ Green- Patrick Peterson-Julio Jones-Aldon Smith-JJ Watt

 

2012 Stephon Gilmore #10....

 

Any of those skill players make the difference between a bad team and a playoff team? Let me answer, NO!

 

 

The last time the Bills built the O line with high priced free agents in Derrick Dockery - Langston Walker they were screwed as neither player played anywhere near expectations, and all they did was manage to piss off the starting all pro LT who was underpaid.

Edited February 15, 2014 by FeartheLosing

[frogger]

I'm guessing the only reason to draft a tackle is because they assume re-signing Glenn will not happen...Buffalo musical chairs.

I'd rather spend money on players Strief, players who can give 3 to 5 good years, while developing younger players taken in the middle rounds.

[CSBill]

I don't like taking OTs that high.

 

if they're worthy, it's a great pick. But then again, we never know until you pick them, and then let the results show … that goes for any high pick, no matter what position.

[Bill from NYC]

and how has that worked out for this franchise the last 14 years? Because that is more or less what they have in constantly drafting defense, DB's, RB's , and the one time they go O line in Eric Wood they get a very good starter.

 

2004 WR Lee Evans 13th & QB JP Losman 22nd.. how much impact did those #1's skill players have? were they difference makers?

 

2005 WE Roscoe Parrish #55 second round pick, because the team traded away its first to the Cowboys for JP

 

2006 DB Donte Whitner #8, John McCargo #26 how did these two work out? Whitner in SF, and McCargo a complete bust

 

2007 RB Marshawn Lynch #12, now has a SB ring with the Seahawks because the Bills traded him for a 4th

 

2008 DB Leodis McKelvin #11....

 

2009 DE Aaron Maybin #11, C Eric Wood #28. Maybin a complete bust and Wood a solid starter.

 

2010 RB CJ Spiller #9, when the team was desperate for a decent LT the team chose a RB in a position that already had a #1 RB in Lynch. skill player.

 

2011 DT Marcell Dareus #3 overall. in retrospect do the Bills even consider MD? AJ Green- Patrick Peterson-Julio Jones-Aldon Smith-JJ Watt

 

2012 Stephon Gilmore #10....

 

Any of those skill players make the difference between a bad team and a playoff team? Let me answer, NO!

 

 

The last time the Bills built the O line with high priced free agents in Derrick Dockery - Langston Walker they were screwed as neither player played anywhere near expectations, and all they did was manage to piss off the starting all pro LT who was underpaid.

 

Very good history lesson above. People forget just how bad the Bills OL was several years ago. This crew is a group of all stars compared to them. Still, they need to improve, especially at LG. And as I said before, they are extremely thin at OT.

 

[CSBill]

Posted Yesterday, 05:48 PM

QCity, on 14 February 2014 - 01:53 PM, said:

 

Any members of the Buffalo media reading this thread? We need some news on Chris Hairston. He missed a year with an "undisclosed" leg injury, which sounds odd. Is this guy rehabbing with plans to be in camp this year? Is he done?

I periodically do a search to see if there is any news, but not a peep.

 

- - - -

 

This is, indeed, a most intriguing thing. I'm sure we all hope he comes back. He showed real promise when he did play. I think the Bills thought he was the answer at RT. And, if they think he is going to be back, then don't expect us to take a RT at the 9 spot. If the Bills do take a tackle, that signals Hairston is done, or is very "iffy" to return. But I do hope he does.

 

You build your line with proven OL's in Free Agency, you draft playmakers. We need someone for EJ to throw to. TE's and WR's / LB's is who we should be targeting.

 

#1 Watkins if there, Ebron or Mosely

#2 Serifian-Jenkins / Moncrief / Skov

 

I'd be okay with any of those picks, but I take exception to your premise. I would rather it said, "you build your team by picking the best football players you can, when you can." Purposely trying to build a good o-line through free-agency is purposely trying to be mediocre at best.

[d_wag]

Any members of the Buffalo media reading this thread? We need some news on Chris Hairston. He missed a year with an "undisclosed" leg injury, which sounds odd. Is this guy rehabbing with plans to be in camp this year? Is he done?

 

according to his twitter feed, he's spending time with his family, playing an abnormal amount of flappy bird, and attending super bowl week

[Kirby Jackson]

I don't get why all of you are like "RTs aren't difference makers" or "we should get an elite player, and RTs aren't elite" and all that. If one of the best players in the draft happens to be a tackle, and for now you can plug him in at RT because you have an even better tackle already at LT, then you have the foundation of an absolute kick@$$ dominant line. If that tackle becomes better Cordy, or Cordy gets hurt, he could then slide over to LT, and there's no drop off at the position. So argueing that we shouldn't draft one of the best players in the draft simply because we already have a very good LT in Cordy Glenn makes absolutely no sense to me.

 

All that being said, I believe that if Sammy Watkins is still on the board when we draft, he should definitely be the pick. If not, then one of the two top tackles. I believe that 3-4 QBs will go before we draft, as well as Clowney, so if all of those are off the board, you go with either Barr or Mack. That's my opinion.

I guess that I can speak for myself on this as an opponent of RT at 9. This team clearly needs a RT but my philosophy is that that you can find starting RTs in free agency or all of the way to the middle rounds of the draft. You really don't find QBs, pass rushers, LTs or elite skill players there. Obviously there are some exceptions, Terron Armstead & Keenan Allen were both 3rds last year. Those areas you try to snatch up early because they are tougher to get later than a RT, LG, TE, run stuffing LB, etc...

 

and how has that worked out for this franchise the last 14 years? Because that is more or less what they have in constantly drafting defense, DB's, RB's , and the one time they go O line in Eric Wood they get a very good starter.

 

2004 WR Lee Evans 13th & QB JP Losman 22nd.. how much impact did those #1's skill players have? were they difference makers?

 

2005 WE Roscoe Parrish #55 second round pick, because the team traded away its first to the Cowboys for JP

 

2006 DB Donte Whitner #8, John McCargo #26 how did these two work out? Whitner in SF, and McCargo a complete bust

 

2007 RB Marshawn Lynch #12, now has a SB ring with the Seahawks because the Bills traded him for a 4th

 

2008 DB Leodis McKelvin #11....

 

2009 DE Aaron Maybin #11, C Eric Wood #28. Maybin a complete bust and Wood a solid starter.

 

2010 RB CJ Spiller #9, when the team was desperate for a decent LT the team chose a RB in a position that already had a #1 RB in Lynch. skill player.

 

2011 DT Marcell Dareus #3 overall. in retrospect do the Bills even consider MD? AJ Green- Patrick Peterson-Julio Jones-Aldon Smith-JJ Watt

 

2012 Stephon Gilmore #10....

 

Any of those skill players make the difference between a bad team and a playoff team? Let me answer, NO!

 

 

The last time the Bills built the O line with high priced free agents in Derrick Dockery - Langston Walker they were screwed as neither player played anywhere near expectations, and all they did was manage to piss off the starting all pro LT who was underpaid.

This is not really fair considering that the John Guy/Modrack tandem (no not Marv he had ZERO to do with it) was pretty much overseeing personnel for most of those picks.

 

The Buddy Nix/ Whaley group has drafted pretty well.

Edited February 15, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[OldTimer1960]

 

Fisher got hurt and nearly lost his starting job to poor play--in fact, the team is currently considering re-signing Branden Albert out of fear that Fisher can't play LT (the position he was drafted to play)

Joeckel played a total of 5 games, during which the team went 0-5

Lane Johnson started for an offensive line that gave up 46 sacks (two fewer than Buffalo's)

Jonathan Cooper did not play a down

Chance Warmack was a huge disappointment in Tennessee

Fluker played well at RT...not so much on the left.

 

And as Kirby has pointed out...that was largely a function of there being a dearth of talent in last year's class. That's not the case this year with guys like Mack, Barr, Watkins, etc.

 

 

 

One of the two guards drafted in the top 10 didn't play a down, the other was a massive disappointment.

 

I agree, however, that you draft the best players. I don't think it'll be a tackle, because I think both Robinson and Matthews will be gone, and I'm not big on either Lewan or Kouandjio

 

I think that it is risky to judge players after only their rookie year. Nearly all rookies have some trouble adjusting to the NFL. Chances are good that some of the OL that struggled last season will go on to have good careers and a few will continue to struggle - but the same can be said for players at every position.

 

 

[thebandit27]

 

 

I think that it is risky to judge players after only their rookie year. Nearly all rookies have some trouble adjusting to the NFL. Chances are good that some of the OL that struggled last season will go on to have good careers and a few will continue to struggle - but the same can be said for players at every position.

 

Agree on all counts--I was refuting the false logic of "look what happens when you draft an OL men in the top 11--you make the playoffs!"

 

My position is typically that it takes at least 20-25 games to get a feel for a player

[TPS]

I'm all over the place with this draft, but more recently leaned toward OT. I started a thread on OTs a week or so ago wondering if Lewan was justifiable at 9 because I thought Robinson and Mathews would be gone. I've seen Lewan ranked as high as 10, and has moved up other boards.

At this point, I'm going to withdraw my OT pick and remain neutral until I see what happens in FA. However, as of now, their biggest holes/weaknesses are OL and a LB to pair with kiko to stop the run.

[Iowabillsfan4life]

I am still a big believer in having a good offensive line and with OT a big need for this team I would have no problem if Bills take a tackle at 9

 

I also think adding a legit number 1 receiver is a big need so wouldn't have a problem with Watkins either but I don't think he will be there

 

IMO IF WATKINS IS GONNA TAKE THE BEST TACKLE AVAILABLE. TE IS OK TRUST ME WITH MOEAKI and Chandler #2 Iowa produces TE's like no other school. Wisconsin maybe. Olb/WR in the second

[KOKBILLS]

I'm all over the place with this draft, but more recently leaned toward OT. I started a thread on OTs a week or so ago wondering if Lewan was justifiable at 9 because I thought Robinson and Mathews would be gone. I've seen Lewan ranked as high as 10, and has moved up other boards.

At this point, I'm going to withdraw my OT pick and remain neutral until I see what happens in FA. However, as of now, their biggest holes/weaknesses are OL and a LB to pair with kiko to stop the run.

 

Well...I'm a Michigan fan...And though I like Lewan I think there is a gulf-like gap between Lewan and Robinson...Some are comparing Lewan to Jake Long...I would compare him more to Nate Solder with a bit of a mean streak...Lewan is a good prospect...I'm just uncertain he's #9 overall good...

 

I think Matthews is a cut above Lewan as well because at this point he's more polished...But they are close, and Lewan may have the higher ceiling if he can round off his game...

 

I'm in favor of a trade down from #9 unless Robinson is there...I think the Bills can trade down a bit and still get one from a group that includes Lewan at OT, Evans or Benjamin at WR, or Ebron at TE...That's the way I would approach this Draft if I was Whaley...But we'll see...

[RK_BillsFan]

You build your line with proven OL's in Free Agency, you draft playmakers. We need someone for EJ to throw to. TE's and WR's / LB's is who we should be targeting.

 

#1 Watkins if there, Ebron or Mosely

#2 Serifian-Jenkins / Moncrief / Skov

 

Now, I hate to sound like a broken record, but once again, you can have all the weapons in the world, and a pretty good D but it doesn't matter if your QB doesn't have the time to make the plays. Only proof you need is the Broncos. That line is better than ours, their QB phenomenal, and enough weapons for him to pass to that he could almost close his eyes, throw the ball anywhere and have a TD. They make it to the superbowl, and get embarrassed all because their QB didn't have time to throw/ was harassed constantly, and all deep routes were snuffed out.

 

Watkins won't be there are 9, simply won't happen. If by some miracle he is, rather than run up to the podium, you would HAVE to field the phone calls for those looking to trade up for him.

 

Moncrief and skov will be there in the 3rd round no need to take them that high.

 

I would prefer ASJ over Ebron. Not sure if it's in this post of the Collection of Mock drafts post where some of us have stated we feel he is just the better product/prospect.

 

Mosely imo is not worth a 9th overall selection.

 

 

SO if at #9 Robinson or Matthews is still on the board, they should be our pick. Otherwise, it would behoove us to trade down and pick up a second and third. This would be an amazing draft to pull back and stock up on the depth of talent.

[thewildrabbit]

I guess that I can speak for myself on this as an opponent of RT at 9. This team clearly needs a RT but my philosophy is that that you can find starting RTs in free agency or all of the way to the middle rounds of the draft. You really don't find QBs, pass rushers, LTs or elite skill players there. Obviously there are some exceptions, Terron Armstead & Keenan Allen were both 3rds last year. Those areas you try to snatch up early because they are tougher to get later than a RT, LG, TE, run stuffing LB, etc...

 

This is not really fair considering that the John Guy/Modrack tandem (no not Marv he had ZERO to do with it) was pretty much overseeing personnel for most of those picks.

 

The Buddy Nix/ Whaley group has drafted pretty well.

Man do I disagree with that remark.

 

 

Anyway, the entire point of that post wasn't to argue about the draft, or who was responsible!

 

It was to show that this team has done nothing but spend picks on skill positions / defense save one lone pick with a first round draft choice on the O line the last ten years, and he is still there as the center pin of that line.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

Now, I hate to sound like a broken record, but once again, you can have all the weapons in the world, and a pretty good D but it doesn't matter if your QB doesn't have the time to make the plays. Only proof you need is the Broncos. That line is better than ours, their QB phenomenal, and enough weapons for him to pass to that he could almost close his eyes, throw the ball anywhere and have a TD. They make it to the superbowl, and get embarrassed all because their QB didn't have time to throw/ was harassed constantly, and all deep routes were snuffed out.

 

Watkins won't be there are 9, simply won't happen. If by some miracle he is, rather than run up to the podium, you would HAVE to field the phone calls for those looking to trade up for him.

 

Moncrief and skov will be there in the 3rd round no need to take them that high.

 

I would prefer ASJ over Ebron. Not sure if it's in this post of the Collection of Mock drafts post where some of us have stated we feel he is just the better product/prospect.

 

Mosely imo is not worth a 9th overall selection.

 

 

SO if at #9 Robinson or Matthews is still on the board, they should be our pick. Otherwise, it would behoove us to trade down and pick up a second and third. This would be an amazing draft to pull back and stock up on the depth of talent.

That's really not fair either because the Broncos had the most prolific offense of all time!! They got worked by a phenomenal defense but to act like that offense had problems this year is crazy.

[3rdand12]

You would hope that a top ten pick would be of pro bowl quality, and as good as Fluker. Think what an improvement to the offense a player like that could make, and the impact of a top player at his position.

 

http://www.footballo...-downs-afc-east

 

This franchise has been picking at or near the top ten of the draft for over a decade and the results have been far from stellar.

 

The main reason for a new, renewed hope is young GM Doug Whaley who seemed to hit several home runs in not only last years draft class. Plus, he did excellent in a trade to with the Colts to acquire Jerry Hughes, free agent acquisitions Manny Lawson & Alan Branch.

 

Now if he can find five new starters this off season, and some decent depth this team should be ready for a playoff run. LG-RT-WR-TE-LBer

 

I read a that Chris Hairston states he is getting better, so who knows what his current situation is. Personally, If healthy, I'd rather see him as the backup RT

We need a swing tackle an d Hairston is the only one with that potential. Lets not forget we need some solid depth still !!

The line is weeeaakk as it stands today

 

Very good history lesson above. People forget just how bad the Bills OL was several years ago. This crew is a group of all stars compared to them. Still, they need to improve, especially at LG. And as I said before, they are extremely thin at OT.

well said Bill.

[Kirby Jackson]

Man do I disagree with that remark.

 

 

Anyway, the entire point of that post wasn't to argue about the draft, or who was responsible!

 

It was to show that this team has done nothing but spend picks on skill positions / defense save one lone pick with a first round draft choice on the O line the last ten years, and he is still there as the center pin of that line.

I am not an EJ fan but other than that: Spiller, Aaron Williams, Glenn, Kiko, Woods, Goodwin, Gilmore (had a rough year). You really take issue with their drafts????

 

The other point is a fair one but you need to judge drafts differently by regime. The Bills staff that is no longer in place made those mistakes. Nix/Whaley used a 2nd on a franchise LT that was by far the best OL on the team (check PFF).

 

Wood actually had a miserable year last year. I know that in some ways it was a function of the awful play at LG but Glenn played next to the same guys. My point again is that you do not need to reach at 9. If you feel that Robinson or Matthews is worth the 9th pick (Robinson is the only one that I would consider) -go for it. You can find starting OL in potentially the 2nd and 3rd pretty easily (for example: Tiny Richardson and Gabe Jackson). You cannot find a Watkins or Mack type of playmaker in the 2nd or 3rd unless you get lucky.

 

My intuition (again unscientific) would tell me that the % of pass rushers in the top 20 or so in sacks, starting QBs, pro bowl skill players and franchise LTs is much higher than the % of RT, LG, TE, run stuffing LB starters that were selected in the 1st 50 picks. You can find starters at those other positions in a lot of places.

 

It is not that RT, etc... are not needs because they are HUGE needs. If the value is there (ie Robinson) that is fine. He could become great. If not do not reach because you will be getting a solid RT (Lewan) while the next team gets a 10+ sack guy with 100 tackle potential (Mack). Which player is more important to a team's success? Which of those is harder to find?

Edited February 15, 2014 by Kirby Jackson

[thewildrabbit]

Now, I hate to sound like a broken record, but once again, you can have all the weapons in the world, and a pretty good D but it doesn't matter if your QB doesn't have the time to make the plays. Only proof you need is the Broncos. That line is better than ours, their QB phenomenal, and enough weapons for him to pass to that he could almost close his eyes, throw the ball anywhere and have a TD. They make it to the superbowl, and get embarrassed all because their QB didn't have time to throw/ was harassed constantly, and all deep routes were snuffed out.

 

Watkins won't be there are 9, simply won't happen. If by some miracle he is, rather than run up to the podium, you would HAVE to field the phone calls for those looking to trade up for him.

 

Moncrief and skov will be there in the 3rd round no need to take them that high.

 

I would prefer ASJ over Ebron. Not sure if it's in this post of the Collection of Mock drafts post where some of us have stated we feel he is just the better product/prospect.

 

Mosely imo is not worth a 9th overall selection.

 

 

SO if at #9 Robinson or Matthews is still on the board, they should be our pick. Otherwise, it would behoove us to trade down and pick up a second and third. This would be an amazing draft to pull back and stock up on the depth of talent.

Man, stop it with this complicated thing called logic!

 

There you have it, the best and brightest passing QB, and legend of the NFL can't complete a pass because he no time to throw to his cast of elite receivers.

 

Bills fans here just don't want a boring future all pro OT that could protect the QB's for years to come. They all want a speedy WR that nobody can get the ball to because the QB doesn't have time to throw. They want a TE that can score in the red zone, and never mind that the QB can't hit him with the ball because he is on his back.

[Kirby Jackson]

To clarify: I believe that the team needs 4 OL (3 if Hairston is healthy). I am not downplaying the need for OL; I just don't think that it is needed in the 1st unless it is a franchise LT.

Edited February 15, 2014 by Kirby Jackson