ExiledInIllinois Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 I think they said 50. Bought them after the last snafu in 2011. Problem is with all the traffic they can't get through or touch a lot of the roads. Plus you're talking about a city that takes up a lot of square miles. I have a good buddy from college who also lives down here. We both live in what's considered Atlanta Metro. Door to door is 84 miles. Is that just the "city" itself? What I mean is, do you travel 84 miles and never leave Atlanta proper? Here Chicago city line south and city line north I think is something under 40 miles? Metro area here is well a 100 miles north-south... Heck if you count Milwaukee and Indiana, even more. Damn, that 80 miles is impressive! I think they should have a little more than 50 trucks... Maybe a couple hundred, even if it doesn't snow... Can't they fit city garbage trucks with blades and salt... Cheaper that way. I think Chicago does that?
KD in CA Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 From my Facebook feed: People sleeping in Krogers and CVSs, cars, strangers' houses, kids still stranded in busses. 14-plus hour commutes. Pile-ups... Atlanta is a disaster zone this morning. All from 2 inches of freaking snow. Government failed miserably at what should be its core function. NOOOO! Government's core function is to teach people not be idiots?
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 Government's core function is to teach people not be idiots? I see where you are coming from. We differ on a lot of things... But why would you want to see people fail? Human nature will not help itself. Only player here that can help weed this activity out is gov't. I don't know... Just must we the way I am. I see something that needs to be done, I jump in and do it. To many people sit around. To many people get off when stuff like this happens. Gov't here is what separates us from the tribes of Afghanistan or god knows where.
DrDawkinstein Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 It's funny that on my facebook feed, most of the people blaming "the Government" for not doing anything are the same people that usually champion the small government cause, and push to elect officials that will not "waste" (read: spend) money on things like salting the roads. We elect our local government on the foundation of small government and low spending, and then act surprised when they dont do anything to help us... We elected the guys who would rather strand children on buses overnight than chance wasting money on salting the roads and it not be needed. (They did the same thing in 2011 too) We rejected the TSPLOST plan which would have addressed the ongoing traffic situation, because we choose to sit in traffic rather than deal with a 1% hike in sales tax. I'm not condoning wild, unchecked spending. But when the foundation of the local government is built around being "financially conservative", and it has been publicly taken to the extreme with prior policies and actions, we shouldn't be surprised when they leave us high and dry during times of need. This is not a snow problem, this is a priorities problem. As Gov. Nathan Deal just said in his press conference "it would not have been good for business to tell people to stay home yesterday."
TheMadCap Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 imagine a real snowstorm, say a foot of snow. Atlanta would cease to exist!
DrDawkinstein Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 Pretty good article on what happened... http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/01/how-2-inches-of-snow-created-a-traffic-nightmare-in-atlanta/283434/
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 Question: What do they do with water lines down there? What I mean, how deep do they bury them? Up here, I want to say, 42" @ least and mine @ my house appears to be well below that. Do they have issues with freezing water pipes when the temps get even into to the 20's?
Corp000085 Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 Question: What do they do with water lines down there? What I mean, how deep do they bury them? Up here, I want to say, 42" @ least and mine @ my house appears to be well below that. Do they have issues with freezing water pipes when the temps get even into to the 20's? Never had a problem here
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) Pretty good article on what happened... http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2014/01/how-2-inches-of-snow-created-a-traffic-nightmare-in-atlanta/283434/ Wow... Look @ the traffic going the other way! That is where I would be going! Seems like it was mainly the 9-5, office crowd that ran into the doodoo. Looks like normal rush hour on a winter day in a big city up north. Edited January 29, 2014 by ExiledInIllinois
DrDawkinstein Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 Question: What do they do with water lines down there? What I mean, how deep do they bury them? Up here, I want to say, 42" @ least and mine @ my house appears to be well below that. Do they have issues with freezing water pipes when the temps get even into to the 20's? Im sure some people are, but Ive never had an issue. I believe most of the problems would be internal pipes freezing, not so much with the mains.
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 Im sure some people are, but Ive never had an issue. I believe most of the problems would be internal pipes freezing, not so much with the mains. Why not mains? Wouldn't heat be in the house. Atlanta can get pretty cold @ times, do they just have heat pumps or do most have regular furnaces?
Just in Atlanta Posted January 29, 2014 Author Posted January 29, 2014 It's funny that on my facebook feed, most of the people blaming "the Government" for not doing anything are the same people that usually champion the small government cause, and push to elect officials that will not "waste" (read: spend) money on things like salting the roads. We elect our local government on the foundation of small government and low spending, and then act surprised when they dont do anything to help us... We elected the guys who would rather strand children on buses overnight than chance wasting money on salting the roads and it not be needed. (They did the same thing in 2011 too) We rejected the TSPLOST plan which would have addressed the ongoing traffic situation, because we choose to sit in traffic rather than deal with a 1% hike in sales tax. I'm not condoning wild, unchecked spending. But when the foundation of the local government is built around being "financially conservative", and it has been publicly taken to the extreme with prior policies and actions, we shouldn't be surprised when they leave us high and dry during times of need. This is not a snow problem, this is a priorities problem. As Gov. Nathan Deal just said in his press conference "it would not have been good for business to tell people to stay home yesterday." We had 30 new sanders. They were never used beforehand. Tsplost has nothing to do with this. Poor planning, and everyone leaving at once Walking Dead style -- releasing kids at the same time, really? -- was the problem. THIS -- basic infrastructure and emergency preparedness -- should be the core function of government. It failed in every way it could yesterday.
DrDawkinstein Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 Wow... Look @ the traffic goin the other way! That is where I would be going! Seems like it was mainly the 9-5, office crowd that ran into the doodoo. It was everyone leaving the office/school at 1pm, getting into gridlocked traffic, and then the storm hit at about 1:30pm. I was actually in a similar situation up in Buffalo in October of 2000. Some here might remember that one. Around lunchtime, the news posted warnings about a major storm about to hit the city. All offices and schools closed, and everyone hit the streets. Right as traffic got bad, we got hit with about 4 feet of lake effect. Plenty of us had vehicles that could handle it, but there were simply too many that had vehicles which couldnt. Traffic just halted. I sat in my truck for 2 hours before deciding to park it on the side of Sheridan Dr, walked back to Independent Health HQ, and slept in my office. It's not just about being in the South and unprepared. While the local Government let us down by not salting the roads, it would have been bedlam either way, with all the drivers hitting the streets at once.
Just in Atlanta Posted January 29, 2014 Author Posted January 29, 2014 Government's core function is to teach people not be idiots? No one can drive in gridlock or black ice -- not even a Buffalonian. They had sanders, never used them, released government units and schools at the same time, and were completely unprepared for snow that was forecasted three days ago.
KD in CA Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 I see where you are coming from. We differ on a lot of things... But why would you want to see people fail? Human nature will not help itself. Only player here that can help weed this activity out is gov't. I don't know... Just must we the way I am. I see something that needs to be done, I jump in and do it. To many people sit around. To many people get off when stuff like this happens. Gov't here is what separates us from the tribes of Afghanistan or god knows where. What you're seeing is people sitting around waiting for the government instead of 'jumping in' to do what needs doing. That is the responsibility of everyone, not just the government. And it sounds like there's a significant government effort happening to respond to a very unique set of circumstances that created the problem. Just because something bad happens doesn't automatically mean the all-mighty government did anything wrong or has the power to snap its fingers and make all the problems disappear. Was there not a forecast? Do people in Atlanta not know that snow creates a big problem?
DrDawkinstein Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 We had 30 new sanders. They were never used beforehand. Tsplost has nothing to do with this. Poor planning, and everyone leaving at once Walking Dead style -- releasing kids at the same time, really? -- was the problem. THIS -- basic infrastructure and emergency preparedness -- should be the core function of government. It failed in every way it could yesterday. Well, I think the overall thing we should be able to agree on is that there wasnt just ONE single point of failure, or cause to blame. All the salt in the world wouldnt have prevented the traffic issues yesterday. Which does bring us back to (in a roundabout way) TSPLOST.
Just in Atlanta Posted January 29, 2014 Author Posted January 29, 2014 Jim Cantors has more than the weather to deal with http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvmmIHl8YzY&feature=youtube_gdata_player Cantors = Honey badger.
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 It was everyone leaving the office/school at 1pm, getting into gridlocked traffic, and then the storm hit at about 1:30pm. I was actually in a similar situation up in Buffalo in October of 2000. Some here might remember that one. Around lunchtime, the news posted warnings about a major storm about to hit the city. All offices and schools closed, and everyone hit the streets. Right as traffic got bad, we got hit with about 4 feet of lake effect. Plenty of us had vehicles that could handle it, but there were simply too many that had vehicles which couldnt. Traffic just halted. I sat in my truck for 2 hours before deciding to park it on the side of Sheridan Dr, walked back to Independent Health HQ, and slept in my office. It's not just about being in the South and unprepared. While the local Government let us down by not salting the roads, it would have been bedlam either way, with all the drivers hitting the streets at once. I hear you! My father was fit to be tied when somebody (a lady ;-)) stopped under the viaduct on Union road @ Broadway during The Blizzard... He was coming back from the VA. She blocked the whole road and everbody got stuck behind her! Instead of keep on going, she laid up short and stopped her momentum! Especially with those old tanks of vehicles! LoL... Just a few miles from home the stuck cars were doomed to the blowing an drifting snow. It happens. But, man this Atlanta storm had to be seen coming on the weather report? That Atlantic article was good! I
DrDawkinstein Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) What you're seeing is people sitting around waiting for the government instead of 'jumping in' to do what needs doing. That is the responsibility of everyone, not just the government. And it sounds like there's a significant government effort happening to respond to a very unique set of circumstances that created the problem. Just because something bad happens doesn't automatically mean the all-mighty government did anything wrong or has the power to snap its fingers and make all the problems disappear. Was there not a forecast? Do people in Atlanta not know that snow creates a big problem? As posted on reddit under the title "At what point does incompetence become evil?"... Just made it home from helping some folks on 78 East out by Stone Mountain. I have a 4 wheel drive truck with chains, tow straps, jumper cables and other stuff I thought may be helpful. I'd helped a couple people who were stranded after coming in on a jet early in the morning. Shuffled them up to a nearby walmart. Drove back to the Hugh Howell area which was a mess. I saw a woman stumbling along the side of the road, she looked ill. She said she was waiting on friends or an ambulance. She called 911 before and was told to wait. She was diabetic and hadn't eaten since the day before. There were two police officers standing (smiling & laughing) less than 50 feet from this woman. I took her up to a waffle house and got her some food before heading back to the 78 / Hugh Howell area. As I drove back to get on 78 (there were literally dozens on dozens of stranded cars many with people in them) I noticed that Gwinnett PD had suddenly blocked all access to 78. I rolled up beside one of the squad cars and explained what I had been doing all morning. He responded in a very loud, angry voice: do us a favor and stay off of 78. I explained that there were still a lot of people needing help. He said again with a tone of annoyance, that DeKalb PD would be helping those people. I drove off, thinking about the two officers I'd just seen laughing while a woman was obviously gravely ill just feet away. Drove on home through back roads in a foul mood. Listening to the news last night and this morning it sounded like everyone was getting rescued and the National Guard was out in full force and that the roads were being cleared. I saw literally zero evidence of this on the roads this morning. This is North Ave, a major street in the city, as of this morning: http://i.imgur.com/FfxGebe.jpg I have a truck and could go help people, but cant get out of my neighborhood on the ice. At this point, we are stuck waiting on the Government, like it or not. Edited January 29, 2014 by DrDareustein
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 What you're seeing is people sitting around waiting for the government instead of 'jumping in' to do what needs doing. That is the responsibility of everyone, not just the government. And it sounds like there's a significant government effort happening to respond to a very unique set of circumstances that created the problem. Just because something bad happens doesn't automatically mean the all-mighty government did anything wrong or has the power to snap its fingers and make all the problems disappear. Was there not a forecast? Do people in Atlanta not know that snow creates a big problem? I hear you! Fair enough... Just last night I was sitting around and posting on the board when my neighbor called. He said his sister-in-law was stuck in the driveway @ her elderly parent's house. It was -4 below, I suited up, grabbed a snow shovel and coal scoop and met my neighbor next door in 10 minutes. We got there and dug her out. They live about 10 miles away... She assured him that she was stuck in just the driveway (she had a brand spanking new Chevy Malibu). If she was in a ditch, I would have grabbed the Jeep and winch! Seems the guy that does the mowing and plowing there does a really crappy job! :-( The elderly parents are shut ins for the winter... And it didn't help that my neighbor and his in-laws are almost into their 60's. All hand's on deck!
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