Max997 Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 My initial reaction also. I feel this was a good pickup, I was concerned by Pettines departure. Only concern I have is how much will he tweak this defense from last year? If he goes 4-3 will that turn this upcoming season into another "transition"? They were more 4-3 then. 3-4 last year so I really don't see any transition other then to a new system
DefenseWinzChampionshipz Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 (edited) Dude, *I* am an upgrade over George Edwards and Wanny... Then you have my vote for Linebackers coach if O'Neil leaves. Point being, since Schwartz is better than Wanny and Edwards, I look forward to seeing exciting football on the defensive side of the ball. I'm just glad Marrone didn't bring in some unknown the way he did with Hackett. Defensewinzchampionships also took took a girl that wasn't his cousin to the prom.... Set the bar low, and you clear it way more often. Never been to a prom (HS drop out), but I have a gorgeous girl who happens to not be my cousin. You were half right. Edited January 25, 2014 by DefenseWinzChampionshipz
Kellyto83TD Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 I for one really like the move. Look at the Man's career and record as a DC, its damn good
Hazed and Amuzed Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 I'm confident that you totally missed my point. I was not speaking of Stafford's performance in the slightest way. The post I referenced talked about Stafford's mechanics (they are ugly) and Downing's inability to improve them. My point is that I do not believe Stafford had any interest in changing his mechanics. I have no clue what your first sentence means or is referencing. This is true, it was widely reported that Stafford didn't want any help with his mechanics.
ChasBB Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 This fake field goal attempt (and similar decisions from what I gather) probably did him in: and Bears fans talking about it after - kind of funny: http://www.sportshoopla.com/forums/chicago-bears/125413-detroit-lions.html
Don't stop billievein Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 I feel like if schwartz does well this year he will be around for a while as long as Marrone is here. I don't see him getting a lot of attention for a head coaching job anytime soon, definitely not after one year. So the positive is some consistency on the coaching staff. Still sad to see Pettine go though.
Bronc24 Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 I understand it might not have been a viable option because of the history, but since you asked, Wade Phillips' resume is leaps & bounds ahead of Schwartz's. I have yet to see a national writer who does not love this move. Wade Phillips knows defence, no doubt, but one is grasping at straws if he is second guessing this move.
billsfan1959 Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) I think it's funny how much credit he gets for the TN defense. Being a DC under a defensive HC is usually a completely different role from being DC under an offensive HC. If anyone thinks Jeff Fisher brought him in and just said "do your thing" I've got some lucrative real estate deals I'd like to discuss with you. It's encouraging that he's worked with successful defenses in the past, it's also discouraging that his defenses in Det (and often in TN also) were mediocre. My opinion is that his defenses on average have been middle of the pack and I assume he's a middle of the pack DC, which is better than what we've had for a while prior to Pettine, so I'm not devastated by the news, but for those ecstatic about it, you either know something you're not sharing or you're drinking kool aid. FTR, there's nothing wrong with Kool-aid, it's tasty and refreshing in the summer as well as during a typical Bills off-season. I'm usually a heavy drinker of the stuff. You could have said the same about Pettine under Ryan in NY - but it isn't true, just as it wasn't true about Schwartz. The fact of the matter is that the defensive coordinator typically (not always, but the vast majority of time) is the one handling the vast majority of game prep and in-game calling of defensive game plans/plays - not the head coach. Pettine proved he was a good defensive coordinator in NY and Schwartz proved he was a good coordinator in Tenn - I don't care that the head coaches of their teams were Ryan and Fisher. As far as what Schwartz did as a head coach...I couldn't care less, since it is a completely different role than DC. Edited January 26, 2014 by billsfan1959
Numark Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 You could have said the same about Pettine under Ryan in NY - but it isn't true, just as it wasn't true about Schwartz. The fact of the matter is that the defensive coordinator typically (not always, but the vast majority of time) is the one handling the vast majority of game prep and in-game calling of defensive game plans/plays - not the head coach. Pettine proved he was a good defensive coordinator in NY and Schwartz proved he was a good coordinator in Tenn - I don't care that the head coaches of their teams were Ryan and Fisher. As far as what Schwartz did as a head coach...I couldn't care less, since it is a completely different role than DC. Exactly, schwartz isnt a good HC, but who cares. He isn't the HC here.
Not at the table Karlos Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 Any word on his staff? Is he going to keep any of the position coaches
YoloinOhio Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) Any word on his staff? Is he going to keep any of the position coaches Ian Rapoport @RapSheet18m #Bills have til Mon to decide if they’ll allow DC candidate Jim O’Neil to take CLE job. If not, Ravens LB coach Don Martindale is a target I have yet to see a national writer who does not love this move. Wade Phillips knows defence, no doubt, but one is grasping at straws if he is second guessing this move. One more... Peter King @SI_PeterKing 1h RT @jjbreeze27: Thoughts on the Bills hiring of Jim Schwartz? ... Brilliant. Surprised he didn't work as a head coach. Edited January 26, 2014 by YoloinOhio
FluffHead Posted January 26, 2014 Author Posted January 26, 2014 Any word on his staff? Is he going to keep any of the position coaches I'd imagine he will bring at least a couple of his own guys. Teaching a new system to an entire staff seems like a task made easier if you bring along a few guys who already know it and can help teach the holdover coaches
NoSaint Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) Stumbled into some titans message board debates towards the tail end of his tenure there and I feel like a lot of the sentiment is not the elite coordinator many are expecting- here's an example of the posts: Since taking over in 2001, he's ranked: 25th, 11th, 13th, 30th, 29th, 31st, and 8th in scoring D and 25th, 10th, 12th, 27th, 19th, 32nd, and 5th in yardage D, averaging 21st and 19th, respectively, throughout his career. His track record just doesn't scream above average to me. The average includes last years very impressive season... a season that had them as the top ranked unit deep into the season... that was derailed when one player having a career season went down. A drop off was expected, but did anyone expect it to be so dramatic? From top 3 to bottom 5 because of 1 player? Can we really credit the DC for last year's success? That one player of course being when haynesworth went from lazy jerk to contract year all pro. Another post mentioned when haynesworth went down they went 0-3 and were the 32nd ranked D the final 3 weeks after carrying #1 much of the year. He stuck around 1 more (successful) year before the lions stretch that many seem to want to take off his résumé. Edited January 26, 2014 by NoSaint
hondo in seattle Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 Stumbled into some titans message board debates towards the tail end of his tenure there and I feel like a lot of the sentiment is not the elite coordinator many are expecting- here's an example of the posts: That one player of course being when haynesworth went from lazy jerk to contract year all pro. Another post mentioned when haynesworth went down they went 0-3 and were the 32nd ranked D the final 3 weeks after carrying #1 much of the year. He stuck around 1 more year before the lions stretch that many seem to want to take off his résumé. Good find. Confirms what many of us have been saying - the guy's produced pretty merely average results. I'm not sure what Marrone sees in Hackett, Crossman, or Schwartz. Nothing in any of their resumes screams "winner."
YoloinOhio Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 Stumbled into some titans message board debates towards the tail end of his tenure there and I feel like a lot of the sentiment is not the elite coordinator many are expecting- here's an example of the posts: That one player of course being when haynesworth went from lazy jerk to contract year all pro. Another post mentioned when haynesworth went down they went 0-3 and were the 32nd ranked D the final 3 weeks after carrying #1 much of the year. He stuck around 1 more (successful) year before the lions stretch that many seem to want to take off his résumé. lol... just kidding
NoSaint Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) Some more stand out quotes: I think its just crazy how detailed people are getting with this discussion. It's pretty obvious when watching the games the scheme is weak outside of the front 4. If the front 4 does nothing, the scheme falls apart. Guys sitting alone in a zone with no one close for about 7 yards. No, the defense shouldnt crumble if a line gets no pressure. That's where football knowledge usually comes into play. If you rely FULLY on your defensive line, like Schwartz was doing until Haynesworth got hurt, you can get away with being lazy and uncreative.. BUT.. When Haynes got hurt and was sat out Jim Schwartz lacked the creativity and brains to change things in the 3 games we lost when Haynes was out due to the fact that he couldn't rely on it anymore. A good defensive coordinator adjusts to changes... Schwartz makes a change in the beginning of the year and you don't see another one until next season. Look at the Texans game when we continued to get blasted on Nick Harper side... Not one change was made and a good coordinator would atleast implement some type of change and a change wasn't made... This happened throughout the season. Zones were easily exploited by the opposing teams in critical situations. and it usually always happened.. That doesn't suppose to happen period when you have a "good" coordinator who has good enough talent on defense to succeed.. and that should never be an excuse for him... From someone backing his bend but don't break vanilla D: Now what makes him an Above Average Defensive Cordinator is his record . I did not make this topic just to backup Schwartz truthfully I do not like his style of Defense . I like Bend but dont break at times , but would like sending the Odd Blitzes from all angles when they least expect it . Edited January 26, 2014 by NoSaint
Kelly the Dog Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 Stumbled into some titans message board debates towards the tail end of his tenure there and I feel like a lot of the sentiment is not the elite coordinator many are expecting- here's an example of the posts: That one player of course being when haynesworth went from lazy jerk to contract year all pro. Another post mentioned when haynesworth went down they went 0-3 and were the 32nd ranked D the final 3 weeks after carrying #1 much of the year. He stuck around 1 more (successful) year before the lions stretch that many seem to want to take off his résumé. But that one year they were not only successful, they were great, weren't they? http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/oti/2008.htm
Nitro Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 Schwatrz is a solid hire. He had some very good years with the Titans and one or two bad ones. Overall, they were tough to play against. He will have more talent here than the did there. His tenure as HC in Detroit proved that he is not a good one. I think some guys are better at being a OC or DC but not the head guy. To quote a funny movie: "May the Schwartz be with you"!
Rob's House Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 I have yet to see a national writer who does not love this move. Wade Phillips knows defence, no doubt, but one is grasping at straws if he is second guessing this move. I'm coming around. I have said this is a far better hire than what could have otherwise happened. I've not been impressed with much of what he's done in Detroit, defense included, but he's here so rather than continue to be negative about it I'll just be glad we got a guy with experience instead of some newb whose primary qualification is already being on the payroll. I just hope he leaves that Wide 9 garbage in his rear-view.
NoSaint Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 (edited) But that one year they were not only successful, they were great, weren't they? http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/oti/2008.htm Yup - top 5-10 I believe... and it seems id venture the guess if I stumbled into the conversation a year later the theme from several would be that it was haynesworth playing out of his mind in his second straight contract year under the tag not the complex schemes that I think some are expecting. That said we have a very talented front 4, and Marcell coming up on some contract years that might see him VERY motivated. Edited January 26, 2014 by NoSaint
Recommended Posts