NoSaint Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 Curious...if Jim Harbaugh was a black coach with dreads, would there be a 10 page thread about how he is a "punk" and / or "thug"? weve had plenty of discussions about him being terrible. i dont think that the word thug has been used. might be the $8 walmart khakis though.
Bronc24 Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 weve had plenty of discussions about him being terrible. i dont think that the word thug has been used. might be the $8 walmart khakis though. So "no" to punk or thug and "yes" to cheap. Got it.
NoSaint Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 (edited) So "no" to punk or thug and "yes" to cheap. Got it. ive heard punk, classless, whiner, poor sport, terrible human being etc.... but i cant say that i have heard "thug" specifically. i cant say that ive heard it about a black man in $8 walmart khakis, and cleats on the sideline either. most of us get it. the word thug is loaded. some use it loosely to replace much more controversial words, others probably just use it in a lazy association with hip hop culture (ie why i made my $8 walmart khakis joke), and some without thinking about the implications probably just echo it because lots of people say it. i dont think the main thrust of this discussion has been sherman is a thug, as much as sherman is classless - just like you would hear directed towards other middle aged pasty white figures from sunday including pete carroll, jim harbaugh, and bill belicheck. thats not universal across all posters here or all commentaries you will read, but i think acting like the "thug" angle is the primary takeaway in the last 9 pages is unfair. a lot of us just dont like his personality. Edited January 20, 2014 by NoSaint
Jauronimo Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 So "no" to punk or thug and "yes" to cheap. Got it. If Harbaugh took the mic and did his best impression of DMX meets Hulk Hogan perhaps we might be calling him a thug, but he didn't. The term was used many times in the coverage of the Richie Incognito scandal, however. The opinion of "thug" as some type of racist code word might have more validity if the term thug hadn't largely been revived and colloquially redefined in hip hop culture.
NoSaint Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 (edited) If Harbaugh took the mic and did his best impression of DMX meets Hulk Hogan perhaps we might be calling him a thug, but he didn't. The term was used many times in the coverage of the Richie Incognito scandal, however. The opinion of "thug" as some type of racist code word might have more validity if the term thug hadn't largely been revived and colloquially redefined in hip hop culture. it also might be more fitting in this discussion if it appeared before approx the end of the second page, and was mentioned by more than i think about 3-4 posters in total directed towards sherman (if you include the ones saying he acted thuggish, not that he was a thug -- disclaimer i didnt read EVERY page, but i scanned several quickly to make sure memory wasnt totally deceiving me here). i think more people complained about the use of the term than actually even used it though. Edited January 20, 2014 by NoSaint
Bronc24 Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 it also might be more fitting in this discussion if it appeared before approx the end of the second page, and was mentioned by more than i think about 3-4 posters in total directed towards sherman (if you include the ones saying he acted thuggish, not that he was a thug -- disclaimer i didnt read EVERY page, but i scanned several quickly to make sure memory wasnt totally deceiving me here). i think more people complained about the use of the term than actually even used it though. I wasn't trying to make any point...it is something I was legitimately curious about. Personally I found the whole thing entertaining....and I am entertained by the debate that has subsequently ensued.
purple haze Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 (edited) im aware it comes with connotations, and generally try to avoid the term myself to stay out away from those extra implications. i also dont think that everyone that uses it intends to associate all of that (im sure i have simply as its a commonly used term thats quick), but another talk for another thread (and likely a different board). i think the term classless, or as others have used boorish, serves plenty well in this situation, just like it would in the others you mentioned (as opposed to "silly"). what he did was unneeded, and uncalled for regardless of race. is it the end of the world? no, of course not - but its still not something thats needed or adds to my enjoyment of the game. i get that some players thrive on it, but i dont generally like it as a fan and the fans that LOVE it tend to be the ones that drive me the most crazy (not directed at any individual personally in this talk) You’d be surprised at how many people are saying exactly what they mean and couching it behind that term. That’s what I don’t like about the use of “thug” in this instance. Sherman, as far as any of us can know, has never been violent in the public arena or in any type of legal trouble. Yet, he’s a “thug." Was he loud? Yep. Was he over the top? Yep. Was it literally, seconds after an emotional game? Yep. Will that turn off a lot of people? Yep. But there is a large swath for who any young, black male is a thug regardless of other facts about the individual person. In another thread someone brought up Sherman being from Compton and guns, etc. And that person probably hasn’t been to Compton recently if ever. I have. A lot of different people in Compton like anywhere else. Where I’m from a braggart is a braggart and a loud mouth is a loud mouth. A thug will knock you over your head and rob you, or steal your car or some such criminality. Sherman is not now known and has not been known to do anything of that sort. And we wonder why racism still exists? It takes two sides at this point in today's world. By your post here only white men found Sherman's actions after the game to be not exactly the classiest. I can assure you that many black men and women found his actions to be embarrassing to himself. You’re right. But I assure you many of those black men and women aren’t labeling Sherman a “thug” or blowing this thing up all out of proportion. He’s a loudmouth. That’s very different than what many have described him as. One would think Sherman beat up Erin Andrews, cursed America out and stole the camera. Sherman has been a loud talker for a long time. It’s not new. Why does everyone act like it is? Edited January 20, 2014 by purple haze
NoSaint Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 Sherman has been a loud talker for a long time. It’s not new. Why does everyone act like it is? because it was a bit more blatant last night, and on a MUCH larger stage than when he does it on sunday September 23rd against the rams. for a lot of casual fans, this was something kind of new to them. also, there were only two games worth of content to discuss and he made himself a spectacle on a slower nfl news day.
purple haze Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 (edited) NoSaint, I hear you. I would contend that the broadcast networks LOVE Richard Sherman. For all those that don’t care for his on-field persona, they will still watch the Super Bowl. And those casual fans will watch too and root for Sherman to get his azz kicked; just like they rooted against a Deion Sanders or Mike Irvin or a Charles Barkley or a Muhammad Ali, etc… Eyeballs means more ad dollars which means more money all around. Sherman will make money because he will make everyone else money. Think about why Erin Andrews grabbed him instead of the guy who actually caught the interception. Or Marshawn. Or Russell. Because he’s a live wire. He speaks his mind. He’s entertaining. Sherman is not in it alone. All that said, I can understand why Sherman’s antics rubs some people the wrong way. I don’t take any issue with that. My old coach would have had us sitting on the bench. But all Sherman is is a loud talker. There is nothing else to be extrapolated from his outspokenness. For people to do that is what I take issue with because often it is not innocuous; there is more behind it. And in the grand scheme Sherman’s antics are just about meaningless. Edited January 20, 2014 by purple haze
bbb Posted January 20, 2014 Posted January 20, 2014 If Harbaugh took the mic and did his best impression of DMX meets Hulk Hogan perhaps we might be calling him a thug, but he didn't. The term was used many times in the coverage of the Richie Incognito scandal, however. The opinion of "thug" as some type of racist code word might have more validity if the term thug hadn't largely been revived and colloquially redefined in hip hop culture. Great post. Every Sherman defender is saying "What if (white guy) did this?" Well, they didn't..............Does anybody remember anybody doing something like that? I'm quite sure if it was any white guy, Incognito being a great example, I'd think the same thing as I do of Sherman's act. Everybody hated Boz and loved when Bo Jackson ran him over, right? Now what race were those two guys? Everybody hated Tony Mandarich and loved that he was a bust, right?
atlbillsfan1975 Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 You’d be surprised at how many people are saying exactly what they mean and couching it behind that term. That’s what I don’t like about the use of “thug” in this instance. Sherman, as far as any of us can know, has never been violent in the public arena or in any type of legal trouble. Yet, he’s a “thug." Was he loud? Yep. Was he over the top? Yep. Was it literally, seconds after an emotional game? Yep. Will that turn off a lot of people? Yep. But there is a large swath for who any young, black male is a thug regardless of other facts about the individual person. In another thread someone brought up Sherman being from Compton and guns, etc. And that person probably hasn’t been to Compton recently if ever. I have. A lot of different people in Compton like anywhere else. Where I’m from a braggart is a braggart and a loud mouth is a loud mouth. A thug will knock you over your head and rob you, or steal your car or some such criminality. Sherman is not now known and has not been known to do anything of that sort. You’re right. But I assure you many of those black men and women aren’t labeling Sherman a “thug” or blowing this thing up all out of proportion. He’s a loudmouth. That’s very different than what many have described him as. One would think Sherman beat up Erin Andrews, cursed America out and stole the camera. Sherman has been a loud talker for a long time. It’s not new. Why does everyone act like it is? I can tell you why i did not like what he said. To me it sounded as if Sherman took a lot more credit then was due. It was a nice play for sure. Sherman however never once mentions another member of his team. He went on and on about himself and Crabtree. Humility is something that many people are going to enjoy watching Sherman learn about. Sportmanship needs to be relished, Sherman has no clue what it is. As D. Sanders said, once the game is over you drop it, specially if you win the game. Sherman showed no class. I get between the lines and the whistle talking trash, i do. I use to do it a lot when i played. Get in your opponents head. I can not tell you how many Dlinemen i pulled off talking trash to them before the snap. After the game i would smile and shake their hands and tell them great game.
Yard Monkey Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 While watching the game with some friends, the conversation turned to the decline of interest among us with the "product" that is the NFL. A league of classless, ignorant, street punks who can't act mature. You have coaches like Harbaugh that act like complete degenerates and the camera can't get enough. Then this punk gives the most ignorant post game interview I've ever seen and the fact that people think that's ok cements the argument. The league has now a large cohort of fans who act this way and think this is ok. Look back at the hall of famers from other eras.... Would Ronnie Lott act like that? Would Kelly, Smith, or Thomas? The nfl is a reflection of the worst of our culture and society and it's turning many people away. Go to a Bills game. It's evident. I didn't have seasons last year because it's out of control and no longer fun... Sherman's act is repeated every game in every section in upper deck and end zones. Life imitating morons. And one of the people watching last night with us was a lifelong Hawks fan who thought Sherman was neither funny nor profession and downright embarrassing. A bit of a dramatic take! Neon Deion would have done an interview like that back in the day when all players were class acts that you seem to recall... Plenty of others were jackasses in that era, but would be filtered by the teams or media which is much harder to do these days with all of the media outlets and quite frankly fan demand for stories like this.
bobobonators Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 L.O.B Legion Of Boom, the nickname for Seattle's Defense But, you know... a black man yelled loudly towards me through a television, so he must be a monster and a thug, and I'm sure related to gangs somehow... oh, middle America... LMFAO. that was great hours later he submitted a written piece taking shots at crabtree. sherman points the fingers on how everyone else has missed it on this one, but has yet to put himself on the high road - even with plenty of time to reflect. heck, hes had SEVERAL incidents to learn from if that was his true goal, but its not. i think its clear he wants to create a brand and be a household name. its not about emotion, or being between the lines. he knows hes out in a media blackhole unless he draws attention to himself. well, there was the camera and here we are talking about him. and its not just us on our football message board - its america. everyone knows his name, and that hes the self proclaimed best corner in football. I almost always find ur comments insightful. However, be honest, Sherman's hawks destroying your saints skews your perception of THE BEST CB IN THE NFL! !!! :D :worthy:
bobobonators Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 ive heard punk, classless, whiner, poor sport, terrible human being etc.... but i cant say that i have heard "thug" specifically. i cant say that ive heard it about a black man in $8 walmart khakis, and cleats on the sideline either. most of us get it. the word thug is loaded. some use it loosely to replace much more controversial words, others probably just use it in a lazy association with hip hop culture (ie why i made my $8 walmart khakis joke), and some without thinking about the implications probably just echo it because lots of people say it. i dont think the main thrust of this discussion has been sherman is a thug, as much as sherman is classless - just like you would hear directed towards other middle aged pasty white figures from sunday including pete carroll, jim harbaugh, and bill belicheck. thats not universal across all posters here or all commentaries you will read, but i think acting like the "thug" angle is the primary takeaway in the last 9 pages is unfair. a lot of us just dont like his personality. Agreed
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 NoSaint, I hear you. I would contend that the broadcast networks LOVE Richard Sherman. For all those that don’t care for his on-field persona, they will still watch the Super Bowl. And those casual fans will watch too and root for Sherman to get his azz kicked; just like they rooted against a Deion Sanders or Mike Irvin or a Charles Barkley or a Muhammad Ali, etc… Eyeballs means more ad dollars which means more money all around. Sherman will make money because he will make everyone else money. Think about why Erin Andrews grabbed him instead of the guy who actually caught the interception. Or Marshawn. Or Russell. Because he’s a live wire. He speaks his mind. He’s entertaining. Sherman is not in it alone. All that said, I can understand why Sherman’s antics rubs some people the wrong way. I don’t take any issue with that. My old coach would have had us sitting on the bench. But all Sherman is is a loud talker. There is nothing else to be extrapolated from his outspokenness. For people to do that is what I take issue with because often it is not innocuous; there is more behind it. And in the grand scheme Sherman’s antics are just about meaningless. Nicely done.
Just in Atlanta Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 (edited) Theres no better way to combat racism, perceived or otherwise, than to build straw men and knock them down in the most ironic fashion imaginable. You, sir, will likely never be convinced, on this issue at least, that you possess faux collectivist intellectualism and race obsession. He acted like a thug. You can read into that whatever your obviously enlightened mind wants to. Edit: Directed at the guy who instigated the above response, not Jauronimo. Edited January 21, 2014 by Just in Atlanta
NDBUFFCUSEFAN Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 Stanfords head coach has said that Sherman is the most competitive player he has ever been around so it should not be a surprise that he is full of emotion immediately after he makes a play that seals a victory, against his teams biggest rival, to go the Super Bowl. Although it has been a fun day on the internet as people project how they feel a player should act without ever having been close to playing sports at a high level.
Maury Ballstein Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 (edited) Seattle secondary > rest of nfl. Put up or shut up. Walk the walk and talk the talk. Works as long as your winning. Edited January 21, 2014 by Ryan L Billz
3rdand12 Posted January 21, 2014 Posted January 21, 2014 This thread has officially been reduced, with these two gems, to absurdity. seems i am just in time then Party on thug dudes ! Absurdity is a great place to visit .
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