Dragonborn10 Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 Carpenter is a great story but Hopkins has the leg. Hopkins will be the guy. Carpenter would be dumb do sign a low ball team friendly offer from the Bills after the year he had. Another team will give him a good offer. If not there is no market for him because of the short kickoff issue then sure sign him and bring him to a team friendly deal camp to compete with Hopkins. Just don't see that happening. As for the tag on kickers. It is used all the time on kickers and even punters. It is a small amount of money to commit to a position and if there is no other need for the tag why not use it to your advantage? It is not meant to signify the player is your franchise player it is there to give the team some leverage in negotiations.
Mark Long Beach Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 (edited) Yeah Hopkins won the competition last year, but it was a competition between two new guys. The fresh draft pick always gets an edge in such competitions. Now we'll see how much he 'won' last years competition. Carpenter had a _fantastic_ year. edit: really? He beat out Lindell? I thought we got rid of him earlier. So much for memory. Yes Carpenter's not great on touchbacks, but then again our coverage was just terrible, If I was the other team I'd tell my returners to run it out from half deep in the endzone. Edited February 28, 2014 by Mark Long Beach
dubs Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 Yeah Hopkins won the competition last year, but it was a competition between two new guys. The fresh draft pick always gets an edge in such competitions. Now we'll see how much he 'won' last years competition. Carpenter had a _fantastic_ year. edit: really? He beat out Lindell? I thought we got rid of him earlier. So much for memory. Yes Carpenter's not great on touchbacks, but then again our coverage was just terrible, If I was the other team I'd tell my returners to run it out from half deep in the endzone. yep. Bills released Lindell after the 3rd preseason game. http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/63002/dustin-hopkins-wins-bills-kicking-job
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 signing Carpenter is going to require paying a signing bonus, os to sign him then havea compition and potentially cut him seems liek a waste. I'd let him test FA, see what teams offer im, try and match the offer if the Bill's want, if not move on to Hopkins. The other option could be to tag him assuming we don't use the tag on Byrd, but then you'd end up paying him big $$ anyway. He won the job, but it was against Lindell, not Carpenter. I think the Bills need to try and sign Carpenter and let the two battle it out in camp. I am not sure how much MORE you could expect from Hopkins than what you actually got from Dan last year. Maybe you can put Hopkins on the PS (I don't know, just wondering if that's an option).
dubs Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 signing Carpenter is going to require paying a signing bonus, os to sign him then havea compition and potentially cut him seems liek a waste. I'd let him test FA, see what teams offer im, try and match the offer if the Bill's want, if not move on to Hopkins. The other option could be to tag him assuming we don't use the tag on Byrd, but then you'd end up paying him big $$ anyway. Yeah. I guess what it comes down to is: 1) We never max out on the cap, so the different between 1 or 2 million shouldn't affect anything else the Bills want to do in pre-season. 2) If the cap or money shouldn't be the issue, then it comes down to who do you trust more. Carp showed last year that he's capable of being a very good kicker. Hopkins is more of an uncertainty. The last thing the Bills need to be worried about is kicking issues. I'd say go with Carp. Another way to think about it is, would we draft Hopkins this year if faced with the choice of signing Carpenter or drafting a rookie kicker. I doubt it. So why go with him now, he's a sunk cost.
Security Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 Yeah. I guess what it comes down to is: 1) We never max out on the cap, so the different between 1 or 2 million shouldn't affect anything else the Bills want to do in pre-season. 2) If the cap or money shouldn't be the issue, then it comes down to who do you trust more. Carp showed last year that he's capable of being a very good kicker. Hopkins is more of an uncertainty. The last thing the Bills need to be worried about is kicking issues. I'd say go with Carp. Another way to think about it is, would we draft Hopkins this year if faced with the choice of signing Carpenter or drafting a rookie kicker. I doubt it. So why go with him now, he's a sunk cost. Good way to look at it. Although we have 3 more years on the cheap. Really though, only 2. If he is good, Bills would want to lock him up before year 4 then.
dubs Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 Good way to look at it. Although we have 3 more years on the cheap. Really though, only 2. If he is good, Bills would want to lock him up before year 4 then. Can we redshirt Hopkins for another year. ha.
BillnutinHouston Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 I believe I heard he has a child who lives in Buffalo. That may help. Interesting way of putting it. Yes, I believe his wife had their first child during last season while they were living in town.
Tommy Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 There is no way Carpenter signs with the Bills for any kind of team-friendly/minimal guarantee deal, and he's not going to sign with us if he thinks he has to battle Hopkins in training camp. He played so well last season that some team will make him a good offer to come in and be the guy, so we will need to do the same if we want to keep him. Ultimately, I think the Bills will go with Hopkins because it will be more cost-effective, he's got the stronger leg, and because kicker performance can vary so much from year to year, so we don't know that Carpenter would be any better than Hopkins next year. I'd be happy with either one, and I truly do appreciate the performance Carpenter gave us last season, but I won't be too phased either way.
Rubes Posted February 28, 2014 Author Posted February 28, 2014 There is no way Carpenter signs with the Bills for any kind of team-friendly/minimal guarantee deal, and he's not going to sign with us if he thinks he has to battle Hopkins in training camp. He played so well last season that some team will make him a good offer to come in and be the guy, so we will need to do the same if we want to keep him. Ultimately, I think the Bills will go with Hopkins because it will be more cost-effective, he's got the stronger leg, and because kicker performance can vary so much from year to year, so we don't know that Carpenter would be any better than Hopkins next year. I'd be happy with either one, and I truly do appreciate the performance Carpenter gave us last season, but I won't be too phased either way. I think this is pretty much spot-on. While I'd like to see Carpenter back, I think the regime would prefer to sign Byrd and Chandler and save a little money by going with Hopkins. I don't think that would be a horrible idea, but I'd certainly like to see a guy like Carpenter be rewarded for having such a great year.
3rdand12 Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 Like Ed said , let him test FA and match or beat the offer. Let him know he is wanted though before sailing the FA waters. I have decided to keep Dan . Proven to kick very well for Bills and super consistent . also very cool headed. Keep Hopkins for now. Hey , Bills employed two kickers before didn't they ?
reddogblitz Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 I think the regime would prefer to sign Byrd and Chandler and save a little money by going with Hopkins. There's plenty of cap room and money to sign Byrd and Chandler and toss a couple of mil Carpenter's way. The real question is if we aren't too cheap to spend it. Carpenter had a great year for us. Whenever we needed a 50 or so yard FG he was almost for sure to supply it. Who knows for sure what Hopkins can do? As a rookie, he likely may struggle. You NEED a good FG kicker to make the playoffs. Since we are going for the playoffs this year, sign Carpenter.
McD Posted February 28, 2014 Posted February 28, 2014 The Bills Offense still sucks and will continue to suck until proven otherwise. Until then I say keep the better FG kicker because the Bills need the reliability when the O stalls in the oppositions side of the field. You won't need a guy for touchbacks when you can't score a TD or a FG!
papazoid Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 (edited) A deal with Carpenter figures to be a bit easier to execute. The Bills were not allowed to sign Carpenter before today’s start of the new league year, because he played last year on a one-year veteran minimum deal that gave the Bills salary cap relief. http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/bills-nfl/bills-look-to-sign-chandler-carpenter-as-free-agent-period-set-to-begin-20140310 the franchise tag for kickers is 3.55 mil Edited March 11, 2014 by papazoid
Buftex Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 A deal with Carpenter figures to be a bit easier to execute. The Bills were not allowed to sign Carpenter before today’s start of the new league year, because he played last year on a one-year veteran minimum deal that gave the Bills salary cap relief. http://www.buffalone...-begin-20140310 the franchise tag for kickers is 3.55 mil I had never heard this rule before.
YoloinOhio Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 I had never heard this rule before. He had some "veteran exception"Sal Capaccio @SalSports 3h Kicker Dan Carpenter cannot sign EVEN WITH THE BILLS until 4pm today due to the "veteran exception" contract he signed with Bills last year.
Luxy312 Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 Good post and fairly astute to a degree in terms of the importance of special teams. Let's not forget the prime example just a few short years ago. The San Diego Chargers factually had the #1 rated offense and #1 rated defense in the NFL. They ended up finishing second to the Chiefs in the AFC West and missed the playoffs, and you could attribute much of that to the fact that their special teams was atrocious. Actually, they were rated the worst in the NFL in that category. That said, I would not open up the check book for Carpenter. Hopkins has been rated one of the top kickers since his high school days. His leg is bigger than Carpenter as well. Heck, I've seen him put kickoffs THROUGH the uprights! FG accuracy is a positive, no doubt. However, this team isn't going to win games because our kicker is accurate. They're going to win games by scoring touchdowns instead of field goals when they get inside the 20 yard line. You can say you need a good kicker to make the playoffs, but I would ask the simple question of one of the best Bills kickers in awhile got this team last year. Oh yeh.....a 6-10 record and no playoffs.
The Wiz Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 (edited) I had never heard this rule before. He had some "veteran exception" Sal Capaccio @SalSports 3h Kicker Dan Carpenter cannot sign EVEN WITH THE BILLS until 4pm today due to the "veteran exception" contract he signed with Bills last year. From what it sounds like, since he was on that veteran deal, it gave the bills cap relief. Something added to the CBA for Minimum salary benefits for "older" players. That cap relief can not be applied to resigning the player that it was applied on prior to the FA. From my understanding anyways. Edited March 11, 2014 by The Wiz
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 That right there is the key, Carpenter is already been cut so is he really that good or just was on a roll?? Did he all of a sudden figure something out different? Could be our expert ST coaching made the difference?? kicker performance can vary so much from year to year, so we don't know that Carpenter would be any better than Hopkins next year.
sodbuster Posted March 11, 2014 Posted March 11, 2014 (edited) FWIW, Lt. Dan Carpenter is en route to Buffalo, per Graham, and several others. No brainer. Edited March 11, 2014 by sodbuster
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