Mango Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Don't forget Brian Brohm! Can't exclude the Chroise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1billsfan Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 +2 And somewhere you have to include Kurt Warner in this mix if you include Young Elway Marino or Kelly Elway and Marino belong in the conversation of whether they're among the greatest of the great QBs. In no way does Warner, Young or Kelly belong in that conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
C.Biscuit97 Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 (edited) I always wonder whether the greats of the 80s and 90s like Montana would be nearly as good in today's game, with free agency and less stacked teams. Imagine Montana without Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Roger Craig, Brent Jones, and a ridiculous defense. I just doubt that he would have the same success if you put him on the Patriots, throwing to Julian Edelman and Aaron Dobson.... At the same point, it has never been easier to pass the ball. It's a penalty if you hit a wr or QB. Offenses are so protected. It's hard to come up with a list right now but a few points that stand out for me: - Jim Kelly isn't close to being a top 5 QB. - I think Elway might be the best ever. He did more with less. Those first SBs he made, he might have had the worst offensive weapons ever. - Brady over Peyton for me - If he can stay healthy, Rodgers will get there. - Marino's pass records are a million times more impressive than records set today. Edited January 14, 2014 by C.Biscuit97 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 (edited) +2 +3 Edited January 14, 2014 by Marauder'sMicro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boyst Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Elway and Marino belong in the conversation of whether they're among the greatest of the great QBs. In no way does Warner, Young or Kelly belong in that conversation. I am not advocating for Warner and I do not think he really is a top 5 QB but he is easily a QB who should be considered for the HOF. In a very short time he lit the league up and put up amazing numbers. Led two teams to the Super Bowl. Has the rings, too. He did as much in a short time as Young did with less weapons. He did more then Kelly, Marino or Elway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Any top-5 list without Unitas on it is crap. If you've seen any film of Superbowl III, Unitas coming off the bench for the second half of Superbowl III, towards the tail end of his career, still looks like a man among boys. Omitting Johnny U from a "top 5 QBs list" is like saying Willy Mays wasn't a top-5 baseball player or Gordie Howe wasn't one of the 5 best hockey players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 I defer to people who've watched football for a lot longer than I have. I can't possibly say where Brady stacks up against Unitas or Otto Graham. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yungmack Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Not to single out the guys here because this is a wide spread condition of just about anyone under the age of 40, this focus on the present moment, accompanied by an almost complete amnesia about anything that happened even just a few years ago, but it does drive me a little bit nuts when people say, "Well, that's before my time so it doesn't matter to me" or "That was a different time and the stars from that era shouldn't be compared to those of today," and so on. So what then? There's no need or relevance to study Thomas Jefferson, Aristotle, Einstein, Tesla and the like because "that was before my time"? Or Napoleon, Alexander the Great or Admiral Nelson shouldn't be studied because "they dominated before machine guns, airplanes and submarines." As to picking the best players of all time, they each have to be judged against the competition of their time, with the rules that existed in their day. For example, the QBs and receivers of today are going to blow up all the records of QBs and receivers from as recently as ten years ago because of rule changes. Andre Reed had the second most receptions in the history of the NFL when he retired but the way things are going, he likely won't be in the top 50 in another twenty years. Will that prove to a generation yet to be born that he really wasn't a very good receiver? With that in mind, I maintain that the greatest QB in NFL history has to be Otto Graham because he totally dominated his era...and was an almost revolutionary throwing QB as well, not just a hand-off guy. And from his era, we have to consider Unitas, Sammy Baugh, Y.A. Tittle and Bobby Lane just for starters. Moving along, let's not overlook Norm Van Brocklin, Bob Waterfield, Fran Tarkenton, Joe Theisman, Darryl LaMonica, Ken Stabler, Dan Fouts and Len Dawson. I'm sure I'm overlooking several others who qualify but you get the idea: that there are far more great QBs to consider besides ones from the last two decades. Learn about them, study them, it's fun and illuminating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RI Bills Fan Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 1 - Otto Graham 2 - Johnny Unitas 3 - Joe Montana 4 - Dan Marino 5 - Sammy Baugh 6 - Payton Manning 7 - Roger Staubach 8 - Tom Brady 9 - John Elway 10 - Archie Manning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prickly Pete Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 (edited) Not to single out the guys here because this is a wide spread condition of just about anyone under the age of 40, this focus on the present moment, accompanied by an almost complete amnesia about anything that happened even just a few years ago, but it does drive me a little bit nuts when people say, "Well, that's before my time so it doesn't matter to me" or "That was a different time and the stars from that era shouldn't be compared to those of today," and so on. So what then? There's no need or relevance to study Thomas Jefferson, Aristotle, Einstein, Tesla and the like because "that was before my time"? Or Napoleon, Alexander the Great or Admiral Nelson shouldn't be studied because "they dominated before machine guns, airplanes and submarines." As to picking the best players of all time, they each have to be judged against the competition of their time, with the rules that existed in their day. For example, the QBs and receivers of today are going to blow up all the records of QBs and receivers from as recently as ten years ago because of rule changes. Andre Reed had the second most receptions in the history of the NFL when he retired but the way things are going, he likely won't be in the top 50 in another twenty years. Will that prove to a generation yet to be born that he really wasn't a very good receiver? With that in mind, I maintain that the greatest QB in NFL history has to be Otto Graham because he totally dominated his era...and was an almost revolutionary throwing QB as well, not just a hand-off guy. And from his era, we have to consider Unitas, Sammy Baugh, Y.A. Tittle and Bobby Lane just for starters. Moving along, let's not overlook Norm Van Brocklin, Bob Waterfield, Fran Tarkenton, Joe Theisman, Darryl LaMonica, Ken Stabler, Dan Fouts and Len Dawson. I'm sure I'm overlooking several others who qualify but you get the idea: that there are far more great QBs to consider besides ones from the last two decades. Learn about them, study them, it's fun and illuminating. I agree that these things have to be considered. But for instance with Graham how much of his success had to do with the fact that pass defending wasn't really developed or understood at that time? Yes, it was revolutionary, but are we talking about great QB's or great strategists? I think all kinds of factors have to be considered, but it's silly to compare guys from completely different eras. Edited January 14, 2014 by Marauder'sMicro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Unitas P. Manning Brady Montana Favre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigBuff423 Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 It's a good discussion, but to me the key is defining what a top 5 QB would be...is it winning championships, because if so Marino is out...is it passing yards / TDs? Is it all of the above?? So much more difficult if you think in terms of *how* you would define it. Again, if it's championships, Peyton is out b/c ONE does not make you top 5, IMO.... then again, it would seem that production should be a fairly good measure as defined by yards and TDs, but then not winning the big game or multiple big games shortens the list however, should a QB be responsible for poor Defense? Or should a winning QB with a great Defense be in the same category as a QB who may "lose" a game but put up incredible numbers?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kellyto83TD Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 No even I cant put him in top 5 but I will fight tooth and nail against anyone saying not top 10. He started the no huddle everyone today wants to run and no QB will EVER turn around a city, team like he did and lead his team to 4 straight superbowls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gugny Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 No even I cant put him in top 5 but I will fight tooth and nail against anyone saying not top 10. He started the no huddle everyone today wants to run and no QB will EVER turn around a city, team like he did and lead his team to 4 straight superbowls. He turned the city of Buffalo around? And I think the defense led the team to 4 straight super bowls. But he deserves to be in the HOF; I'll give him that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damian Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Before 1980: Johnny Unitas, Bart Starr, Otto Graham 1980-2000: Marino, Kelly, Young, Montana, Elway 2000- :Brady, P. Manning, Brees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Dog Named Kelso Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 I always wonder whether the greats of the 80s and 90s like Montana would be nearly as good in today's game, with free agency and less stacked teams. Imagine Montana without Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Roger Craig, Brent Jones, and a ridiculous defense. I just doubt that he would have the same success if you put him on the Patriots, throwing to Julian Edelman and Aaron Dobson.... We don't have too all you need to do is look at his success in KC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xsoldier54 Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 My top-5 in order would be: Dan Marino - still had quickest release of any quarterback ever. If his defenses would have been better, there's no doubt he would have had rings (which are irrelevant for this post). Peyton Manning - Only QB I know of in the modern era that is still calling his own plays. Knows the play book as good or better than the OC's he's worked with. Joe Montana - He played for some great teams of course, but he's up their in terms of all time comebacks, QB rating, passing efficiency, etc. Steve Young - Dual threat coupled with extremely high completion percentage puts him here for me. Tom Brady - Never been on a bad team, has a great coach and good talent around him offensively and defensively. Still gets it done late in games. You have Marino number one and Kelly is not even in the top five? I saw these guys head to head live several times and in each case Kelly outperformed Marino. Not saying he doesn't deserve to be in your top five, but if he's there, Kelly has got to be there as well for it to have any credibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alphadawg7 Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 I always wonder whether the greats of the 80s and 90s like Montana would be nearly as good in today's game, with free agency and less stacked teams. Imagine Montana without Jerry Rice, John Taylor, Roger Craig, Brent Jones, and a ridiculous defense. I just doubt that he would have the same success if you put him on the Patriots, throwing to Julian Edelman and Aaron Dobson.... Do you know that Montana went to KC his last 2 years and did not have a single offensive player on his team that would even make the SF roster yet took them into the Playoffs both years and deep? And that was at the end of his career. His offensive cast was one of the worst I have seen those last 2 years in KC, yet he still nearly took them to the SB as an old QB with concussion and back problems. Montana is #1 on the list IMO. My list, in order: 1. Montana - Best period 2. Brady - Done more with less like no other QB in history 3. Young - Most effective dual weapon QB of all time 4. Marino - Would be higher on the list if he actually own a SB 5. Elway - Second most effective dual weapon QB of all time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
It's in My Blood Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 For most of us, it's all relevant to our ages. 1. Fu**in' Brady 2. Montana 3. Peyton 4. Marino 5. Favre Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Dog Named Kelso Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 No even I cant put him in top 5 but I will fight tooth and nail against anyone saying not top 10. He started the no huddle everyone today wants to run and no QB will EVER turn around a city, team like he did and lead his team to 4 straight superbowls. Actually Sam Wyche and Boomer Esiason with the Bengals started the no huddle. The Bills were the first to employ it as their offensive style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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