Miyagi-Do Karate Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 Jimmy Leonard had, what-- 5 picks this year? If you are getting that type of production from a scrub off the street, it makes me wonder whether Byrd would be worth it over other cheaper options. By the way, regardless of my view, I think they are going to tag and trade Byrd. they drafted the young guys to replace him.
NoSaint Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 Jimmy Leonard had, what-- 5 picks this year? If you are getting that type of production from a scrub off the street, it makes me wonder whether Byrd would be worth it over other cheaper options. By the way, regardless of my view, I think they are going to tag and trade Byrd. they drafted the young guys to replace him. well, 4, but i have to think even you know theres more to production than simply INTs. you wouldnt qualify the two players performances as even near the same level.
Ed_Formerly_of_Roch Posted January 9, 2014 Posted January 9, 2014 If you can't get a contract worked out, you could tag him then try and trade him too. No team would likely trade for him unless they were able to work out a long term deal, or the offer from the team would be very low. So worst case, you tag him with the intent of trading, can't work out a trade, unless the rules have changed, as long as he hasn't signed the tender, which doubt he would sign it right away as then he'd be on the hook to report for OTA's etc. you can then retract the tender. That could hose Byrd somewhat as if you pulled the offer say in May, most of the big FA $$ would all be soaked up by then and he may have to take less or less options of teams still willing to sign him. Despite this research, I thin they franchise him again.
NoSaint Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 If you can't get a contract worked out, you could tag him then try and trade him too. No team would likely trade for him unless they were able to work out a long term deal, or the offer from the team would be very low. So worst case, you tag him with the intent of trading, can't work out a trade, unless the rules have changed, as long as he hasn't signed the tender, which doubt he would sign it right away as then he'd be on the hook to report for OTA's etc. you can then retract the tender. That could hose Byrd somewhat as if you pulled the offer say in May, most of the big FA $$ would all be soaked up by then and he may have to take less or less options of teams still willing to sign him. But potentially be screwing yourself out of a compensatory pick
Bill from NYC Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 >>>>>would you rather have Byrd or CJ Spiller or Marcel Dareus?<<<<< Spiller would easily be last on that list. >>>>>I would say that on the open market Byrd can get the same amount that CJ and Marcel combined.<<<<< The market for running backs isn't great. Eddy Lacy was drafted in round 2 and he is a far better running back than Spiller. If Dareus plays well and keeps his head on straight he will command and receive untold millions. A focused Dareus is worth more than Byrd imo but remember, the Bills have the cap space to sign both of them.
bigK14094 Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Byrd is good, not great. I would point out that his performance this year was good, he got the same number of ints that Leonard, Williams and Alonso got. He missed, say 5 games. I don't really see that he was a difference maker out there. He was solid, so were the others safeties. Now, I am not a believer in Meeks or the Duke, so I don't advocate they are equal replacements. Byrd's biggest shortcoming is his speed. I have posted this on other threads, but again here it is. The Bills are in TB, and the TB rb rips off an 80 td run. Byrd is in pursuit.....he doen't catch the rb, but thats OK....what is not OK, is that Bradham ran Byrd down from behind and passed him in pursuit of the same guy. Folks, he can't outrun the olb...not even close. Now, maybe its his feet, I don't know...but the Byrd we saw this year is getting by on instinct and skill, but is not top tier physically like other safeties in the league. My take here, franchise him.....one more year to see if he is sound physically...might not want to pay top dollar for multiyears for a guy who is slowing down permanently. Also, can he play 16 games with the right attitude.....not so sure on that one. Finally, there was a great article about the free agent class of 2015, and the Bills have got to be ready to spend a bunch of money on those guys. (Spiller, Darius, others) And, if they trade a franchasied Byrd for a #2, well, so be it. It is bothersome that the Bills have been a farm team for DB's going all the way back to Thomas Smith.....Winfield, Clements, come to mind....but passing on some of those was right also. those guys were all B+ players.....Byrd is another B+. We can use him on the team, but not at any price, and the $ may be needed elsewhere. and, I am not priviledged to the big picture at OBD,
DC Grid Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 It seems like GM 101, to just tag him and either get a deal the Bills can live with or trade him for a 1st. People always talk about trades and over value guys, but in Byrds case, even with his contract demands, a contender will give up a low first round pick for the guy.
filthymcnasty08 Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Because we are on the cusp of becoming an elite defensive unit that will own the AFC East the next decade that is such an AWESOME thought. Give the man what he wants + 10%. Stop fooling around. mmmmmmthis!
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 well, 4, but i have to think even you know theres more to production than simply INTs. you wouldnt qualify the two players performances as even near the same level. The question is whether basically the combination of a couple of low-priced vets like Leonard and Searcy is better than the highest-paid safety in the league in Byrd. If the analytics department is doing anything, I would hope it's running numbers on what the value percentage of Byrd x cost is compared to a value percentage x cost of Leonard/Searcy. I am sure there is a way to quantify whether Byrd is really worth the money.
Rob's House Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 My preference would be to re-sign him first, and if they can't reach a deal to tag and trade. For some reason I feel like neither will happen, but I can't think of a reason why they'd let him walk without compensation. Anyone else share my feeling or have any explanation why they might do such a thing?
cantankerous Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 My preference would be to re-sign him first, and if they can't reach a deal to tag and trade. For some reason I feel like neither will happen, but I can't think of a reason why they'd let him walk without compensation. Anyone else share my feeling or have any explanation why they might do such a thing? Because this is the Buffalo Bills we're talking about and they've done this before. They let Nate Clements walk away in what...2006?
Utah John Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 I think Byrd wants to get paid, and he wants to win. If he doesn't believe the organization is committed to winning and is capable of winning, it won't matter what he's offered, he'll walk. I don't blame him. If the Bills don't end the Toronto fiasco, it's a clear sign they don't care about winning, just padding Ralph's estate and the bank account of his evil beancounter, Jeff Littman. I think Spiller when healthy is a very good RB. The part where he carries the ball is where he excels. He doesn't do so well at blocking. He also doesn't stay healthy, even though he splits duty with Jackson. And when he's not healthy, he's not even ordinary. He doesn't run well enough between the tackles, and if he's not 100% he doesn't outrun LBs to the corner. I like having him on the team but if there's anyone thinking we should keep him instead of Byrd, please stop that. Byrd is an elite player, Spiller is a Chris Johnson wannabe who has never shown the potential to dominate. Dareus is a very good player too but has underperformed. Maybe his part-game benchings will get his attention and give him some focus. There are a lot of DTs out there who play as well as Dareus has played; most do not have his potential, but I think the Bills should pay based on performance and not potential.
DDD Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 No. He's done in Buffalo and will sign with playoff contending team a la Donte Whitner.
timtebow15 Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Will Byrd even play if he is tagged? Look what he pulled this year. I don't want a repeat of that. He is a solid free saftey but not spectacular. Okay, he is excellent. But $10M a year? We have other more important needs at linebacker and guard. Interceptions are overrated as an indicator of play. Sometimes they are caused by pressure, sometimes by tips. As it was pointed out Leonard had five! With Gilmore, McKelvin and Williams we looked pretty good. I'd let Bryd go as a necessary evil and find more depth in the secondary. Just my opinion and I hated the attitude he displayed this year. His agent is what's wrong with the game. You play by the league rules and when you sign a contract you honor it. I can't stand when these guys complain about getting the tag and making a ton of money. If you don't want the tag sign a long term deal but stop whining about it! The Bills offer was fair and they are just using the strategy that exists under league rules when you choose not to accept it.
Terrakon Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Honestly, I haven't read all the posts in this thread. However, the Bills will be much better off with Byrd and I think they know that. It won't be the end of the world if he goes, next man up, but I think he wants to be a part of this new defense.
Martifal Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Are we serious about making winning a priority? ????? That's the question. Good question Ralph Wilson did spend a handfull of years hellbent on proving a small market team couldn't be competitive in this league while he pushed for revenue sharing, and the product on the field reflected that, which I believe has contributed heavily to the 14 year playoff drought.
Dragonborn10 Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Then we disagree... The Bills made him an offer that would have put him in the top 5 among Safeties in the NFL...Byrd and his agent wanted him to be the top paid...He can say anything he wants...Actions speak louder...He's not going to come out and say it anyway...I think the only way Byrd considers staying in Buffalo is if they overpay compared to his true market value...If he really wanted to be in Buffalo a deal would already be done... Now...Maybe he's changed his mind/stance after this past season...I doubt it though...And honestly I don't see why anyone would be really surprised about it considering Byrd grew up and payed College ball on the West Coast... HIs true market value is not top 5. It's 5-10 % more than the top guy right now. That is the point you are obviously missing.
BillnutinHouston Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 its not creating holes for the sake of having to fill them again, at the very least. even if we dont want to give him his long term asking price because we dont feel its the right value for our systems and the place to invest (or hes actually crazy in his demands) atleast we get 1 year at an affordable rate and absolutely no long term risk. as a worst case scenario, i take that over letting him walk out the door in march as the possible alternative. So you create the hole in the year after next. Tell me what you've accomplished.
Beerball Posted January 10, 2014 Posted January 10, 2014 Will Byrd even play if he is tagged? Look what he pulled this year. I don't want a repeat of that. He is a solid free saftey but not spectacular. Okay, he is excellent. But $10M a year? We have other more important needs at linebacker and guard. Interceptions are overrated as an indicator of play. Sometimes they are caused by pressure, sometimes by tips. As it was pointed out Leonard had five! With Gilmore, McKelvin and Williams we looked pretty good. I'd let Bryd go as a necessary evil and find more depth in the secondary. Just my opinion and I hated the attitude he displayed this year. His agent is what's wrong with the game. You play by the league rules and when you sign a contract you honor it. I can't stand when these guys complain about getting the tag and making a ton of money. If you don't want the tag sign a long term deal but stop whining about it! The Bills offer was fair and they are just using the strategy that exists under league rules when you choose not to accept it. I know, I know, I know...but, the flip side from the player perspective is that you (the owner) can cut them whenever you want so teams aren't "honoring" those contracts either. Byrd is good, not great. I would point out that his performance this year was good, he got the same number of ints that Leonard, Williams and Alonso got. He missed, say 5 games. I don't really see that he was a difference maker out there. He was solid, so were the others safeties. Now, I am not a believer in Meeks or the Duke, so I don't advocate they are equal replacements. Byrd's biggest shortcoming is his speed. I have posted this on other threads, but again here it is. The Bills are in TB, and the TB rb rips off an 80 td run. Byrd is in pursuit.....he doen't catch the rb, but thats OK....what is not OK, is that Bradham ran Byrd down from behind and passed him in pursuit of the same guy. Folks, he can't outrun the olb...not even close. Now, maybe its his feet, I don't know...but the Byrd we saw this year is getting by on instinct and skill, but is not top tier physically like other safeties in the league. My take here, franchise him.....one more year to see if he is sound physically...might not want to pay top dollar for multiyears for a guy who is slowing down permanently. Also, can he play 16 games with the right attitude.....not so sure on that one. Finally, there was a great article about the free agent class of 2015, and the Bills have got to be ready to spend a bunch of money on those guys. (Spiller, Darius, others) And, if they trade a franchasied Byrd for a #2, well, so be it. It is bothersome that the Bills have been a farm team for DB's going all the way back to Thomas Smith.....Winfield, Clements, come to mind....but passing on some of those was right also. those guys were all B+ players.....Byrd is another B+. We can use him on the team, but not at any price, and the $ may be needed elsewhere. and, I am not priviledged to the big picture at OBD, Sorry for going OT here, but, why would the bills spend a bunch of money on a part time player (Spiller)? Unless he shows marked improvement I'd let him walk away.
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