The Affordable Care Act II - Because Mr. Obama Loves You All

[Magox]

 

Tell me when that has stopped him before.

 

I'm just thinking it would be nearly logistically impossible.

[Doc]

Look for the executive order delaying it to come out in...late September? Probably some bull **** about structural problems with the insurance companies over the co-ops or something...

I don't believe he could do that. Each state approves the rate hikes, not sure how he could tell them to delay it. Not to mention you'd most likely see a decent bit of carriers abruptly drop out. However, I wonder if he could somehow insert the risk corridor via executive action.

Tell me when that has stopped him before.

I'm just thinking it would be nearly logistically impossible.

 

If I were Trump, I'd point out the delay and say the reason for it is because the premium increases are gonna be UGE!

[Nanker]

They're gonna be so uge, I'm tellin' you they're gonna be unbelievable. Insurance companies are gonna be canceling, insurance companies are gonna be canceling. The insurance companies are gonna be cancelling healthcare policies. Hundreds and hundreds of thousands of them Millions even perhaps. Insurance companies are gonna be canceling these policies because Obamacare doesn't work. It doesn't work. It doesn't work for them, and it doesn't work for Americans who need healthcare. Millions and millions of Americans need healthcare and now they're gonna have their insurance cancelled. They're gonna have their insurance canceled, or they can't afford to pay for it. Either way it's a loser. Obamacare is a loser. Obamacare is a loser. Now I don't want to have people dying in the streets. We can't have people dying in the streets. Now wait. Once I'm elected, I'm gonna make America great again. It will be so beautiful. America is gonna be great again, and we won't have people dying in the streets. I can tell you that.

[IDBillzFan]

They're gonna be so uge, I'm tellin' you they're gonna be unbelievable. Insurance companies are gonna be canceling, insurance companies are gonna be canceling. The insurance companies are gonna be cancelling healthcare policies. Hundreds and hundreds of thousands of them Millions even perhaps. Insurance companies are gonna be canceling these policies because Obamacare doesn't work. It doesn't work. It doesn't work for them, and it doesn't work for Americans who need healthcare. Millions and millions of Americans need healthcare and now they're gonna have their insurance cancelled. They're gonna have their insurance canceled, or they can't afford to pay for it. Either way it's a loser. Obamacare is a loser. Obamacare is a loser. Now I don't want to have people dying in the streets. We can't have people dying in the streets. Now wait. Once I'm elected, I'm gonna make America great again. It will be so beautiful. America is gonna be great again, and we won't have people dying in the streets. I can tell you that.

 

Sadly, I can't tell if you're joking or actually quoting Trump.

[Nanker]

 

Sadly, I can't tell if you're joking or actually quoting Trump.

I'm sad too. It's not a direct quote from him, but I can clearly hear him say those words along with the redundancies in my head.

Maybe I could write speeches for him.

[IDBillzFan]

I'm sad too. It's not a direct quote from him, but I can clearly hear him say those words along with the redundancies in my head.

Maybe I could write speeches for him.

 

You could, but you'd end up putting a few chimps out of work, and apparently Trump fans take that to mean you hate all animals.

[B-Man]

Why Is Health Care So Much More Expensive Than It Used To Be?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Glenn Reynolds writes:

 

ANALYSIS: TRUE. Every Industry Gets Worse When Government Gets Involved. “This is easily provable with Public Choice Theory, and consistently proven in practice.”

 

 

 

I would add two points about the chart.

 

First, the increased cost of health care obviously has something to do with the metastasizing administrators. But it also is caused, in part, by an insufficient supply of doctors.

 

Second, I have no doubt that you could create a similar chart for colleges and universities, with professors graphed against administrators–and for the same reason. Colleges and universities, like clinics and hospitals, spend a ridiculous amount of time complying with government regulations.

[Joe Miner]

They're gonna be so uge, I'm tellin' you they're gonna be unbelievable. Insurance companies are gonna be canceling, insurance companies are gonna be canceling. The insurance companies are gonna be cancelling healthcare policies. Hundreds and hundreds of thousands of them Millions even perhaps. Insurance companies are gonna be canceling these policies because Obamacare doesn't work. It doesn't work. It doesn't work for them, and it doesn't work for Americans who need healthcare. Millions and millions of Americans need healthcare and now they're gonna have their insurance cancelled. They're gonna have their insurance canceled, or they can't afford to pay for it. Either way it's a loser. Obamacare is a loser. Obamacare is a loser. Now I don't want to have people dying in the streets. We can't have people dying in the streets. Now wait. Once I'm elected, I'm gonna make America great again. It will be so beautiful. America is gonna be great again, and we won't have people dying in the streets. I can tell you that.

Holy !@#$.

 

 

That's just... Holy !@#$.

[IDBillzFan]

Holy !@#$.

 

 

That's just... Holy !@#$.

 

Did you know Trump is a big Obamacare supporter?

 

True conservative, that Trump..

[reddogblitz]

Why Is Health Care So Much More Expensive Than It Used To Be?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Glenn Reynolds writes:

 

 

 

ANALYSIS: TRUE. Every Industry Gets Worse When Government Gets Involved. “This is easily provable with Public Choice Theory, and consistently proven in practice.”

 

 

 

I would add two points about the chart.

 

First, the increased cost of health care obviously has something to do with the metastasizing administrators. But it also is caused, in part, by an insufficient supply of doctors.

 

Second, I have no doubt that you could create a similar chart for colleges and universities, with professors graphed against administrators–and for the same reason. Colleges and universities, like clinics and hospitals, spend a ridiculous amount of time complying with government regulations.

 

How does prescriptions and medical devices fit into this chart? The rising costs there has got to be a sinificant part of it.

 

Did you know Trump is a big Obamacare supporter?

 

Are you sure about this. I know I've heard him say it's a disaster and he would replace it with something else. Can you provide a link or quote or something?

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/dandiamond/2015/07/31/donald-trump-hates-obamacare-so-i-asked-him-how-hed-replace-it/#1b71c0ad5d5e

 

Take his comments on health care this week. Speaking with CNN, Trump said that the Affordable Care Act has “gotta go” and that he would repeal the law and replace it with “something terrific.” (Trump added that he’d “work out some sort of a really smart deal with hospitals across the country,” to provide care for poor Americans.)

[FireChan]

 

 

How does prescriptions and medical devices fit into this chart? The rising costs there has got to be a sinificant part of it.

 

 

Are you sure about this. I know I've heard him say it's a disaster and he would replace it with something else. Can you provide a link or quote or something?

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/dandiamond/2015/07/31/donald-trump-hates-obamacare-so-i-asked-him-how-hed-replace-it/#1b71c0ad5d5e

 

Let's stop subsidizing R&D for the rest of the world and drug costs will plummet.

Edited May 4, 2016 by FireChan

[IDBillzFan]

Are you sure about this. I know I've heard him say it's a disaster and he would replace it with something else. Can you provide a link or quote or something?http://www.forbes.com/sites/dandiamond/2015/07/31/donald-trump-hates-obamacare-so-i-asked-him-how-hed-replace-it/#1b71c0ad5d5e

http://hotair.com/archives/2016/02/19/trump-on-obamacare-i-like-the-mandate/

 

So was he for it before he was against it? Is he a flip-flopper already? Wow. That was fast.

 

Imagine...Trump saying what he knows people want to hear? So odd, huh?

 

It's almost like he's conning everyone.

Edited May 4, 2016 by LABillzFan

[reddogblitz]

http://hotair.com/archives/2016/02/19/trump-on-obamacare-i-like-the-mandate/

So was he for it before he was against it? Is he a flip-flopper already? Wow. That was fast.

Imagine...Trump saying what he knows people want to hear? So odd, huh?

It's almost like he's conning everyone.

He said he doesn't want people to die in the streets and we gotta take care of people who can't afford it. Is that what you're talking about? In the video he said Obamacare is a disaster and should be repealed. How is that Being "for it."

[3rdnlng]

http://hotair.com/archives/2016/02/19/trump-on-obamacare-i-like-the-mandate/

 

So was he for it before he was against it? Is he a flip-flopper already? Wow. That was fast.

 

Imagine...Trump saying what he knows people want to hear? So odd, huh?

 

It's almost like he's conning everyone.

I've always liked your posts, but you are approaching gators logic here. That's not good.

[IDBillzFan]

I've always liked your posts, but you are approaching gators logic here. That's not good.

The reality is I've spent a lot of time for conservative causes over the years, and Trump is a nutbag too far for me. He's no conservative, and I'll be damned if I'm going to support a candidate whose only redeeming quality is 'he's not Hillary.'

 

He is Hillary. And if my knowing this makes you think I'm gatorman, who gives a phuck? I live in California. They called this state for Hillary four months ago. My vote means schitt.

 

Whe this race is over, and Hillary takes the WH...probably with WITH the Senate and possibly the House, come back and remind me who used gatorman logic.

[Magox]

 

 

How does prescriptions and medical devices fit into this chart? The rising costs there has got to be a sinificant part of it.

 

 

Are you sure about this. I know I've heard him say it's a disaster and he would replace it with something else. Can you provide a link or quote or something?

 

http://www.forbes.com/sites/dandiamond/2015/07/31/donald-trump-hates-obamacare-so-i-asked-him-how-hed-replace-it/#1b71c0ad5d5e

 

 

Prescriptions plays a role in rising medical costs, medical devices not so much.

 

Its hard to know Trump's positions because he changes them sometimes in mid sentence. But if you were to look at his position on healthcare going back 20 years and some of the things he has said on the campaign trail, I think its fair to say that he'd probably look to keep the expansion of medicaid and most of Obamacare in place with some additional fixes. He certainly is a proponent of heavy government involvement when it comes to healthcare.

Let's stop subsidizing R&D for the rest of the world and drug costs will plummet.

 

That's not quite true. Yes, R & D is becoming increasing expensive and is contributing to the cost of prescriptions but it certainly isn't the main factor to rising prescription costs in the US and subsidizing R & D for the rest of the world? Not sure how you come to the conclusion that this is a major factor, please explain.

 

Patent laws, lack of generic makers and competition along with R & D and some would argue lack of price controls are the primary culprits to rising prescription costs.

He said he doesn't want people to die in the streets and we gotta take care of people who can't afford it. Is that what you're talking about? In the video he said Obamacare is a disaster and should be repealed. How is that Being "for it."

What he said was that "he likes the mandate" and then he went on to make an Obama argument " he doesn't want people to die in the streets and we gotta take care of people who can't afford it", very similar to throw grandma off the Cliff argument that Democrats were making. In other words make a Moral plea when to sell your idea of government mandating things from its citizens.

[Greg F]

Prescriptions plays a role in rising medical costs, medical devices not so much.

Rising Cost of Inpatient Care Linked to Medical Devices and Supplies

 

 

At 24.2 percent of costs, supplies and devices, (defined as the supply items required for patient care) were the leading contributors to the increase in average cost per discharge.

That's not quite true. Yes, R & D is becoming increasing expensive and is contributing to the cost of prescriptions but it certainly isn't the main factor to rising prescription costs in the US and subsidizing R & D for the rest of the world?

Cost to Develop New Pharmaceutical Drug Now Exceeds $2.5B

 

 

A new report published by the Tufts Center for the Study of Drug Development (CSDD) pegs the cost of developing a prescription drug that gains market approval at $2.6 billion, a 145% increase, correcting for inflation, over the estimate the center made in 2003.

Patent laws, lack of generic makers and competition along with R & D and some would argue lack of price controls are the primary culprits to rising prescription costs.

And some would be stupid to not know that price controls always lead to shortages.

[Magox]

Rising Cost of Inpatient Care Linked to Medical Devices and Supplies

 

 

If that study is correct that would be a startling find.

 

Cost to Develop New Pharmaceutical Drug Now Exceeds $2.5B

 

It's a contributing factor as I noted, but doesn't make FC's statement true.

 

 

 

And some would be stupid to not know that price controls always lead to shortages.

 

I'm no fan of price controls but it is an argument made by many.

[Nanker]

http://assets.aarp.org/www.aarp.org_/cs/gap/ldrstudy_prescdrugs.pdf

 

From the above AARP study:

 

Another key public policy consideration related to prescription drugs is pricing.

U.S. prescription drug prices are essentially unregulated;

3

pharmaceutical manufac-

turers are free to set any price they want for their products. In principle, market

mechanisms such as competition, discounts, and rebates may help to moderate drug

prices, but the impact of the market can be subtle. Pharmaceutical manufacturers

segment the brand-name prescription drug market by charging different prices to

different clients, just as the airline industry charges different prices to different fare

classes.

4

Drug manufacturers use differential pricing to compensate for income dif-

ferences across countries and to adjust for regulatory payment systems, with some

national system payment systems limiting the prices companies may charge. The

U.S. pays the highest prices and bears the greatest portion of the global burden of

R&D costs for developing new products. Although prescription drug price regula-

tions are national, prescription drug development and industry benefits are global.

Numerous studies have compared brand-name drug prices in the U.S. with prices

in other countries. More recently, as prescription drug prices have continued to

increase, more sophisticated analyses have confirmed that Americans, to varying

degrees, appear to pay higher drug prices than consumers in other countries.

5

Therefore, important unanswered questions include, how much higher are U.S.

prescription drug prices than drug prices in other countries? and, what value does

the U.S. economy get for bearing these higher prices?"

The US is unregulated wrt drug pricing - unlike most of the rest of the world. Their Formularies dictate the prices they will purchase drugs at. Think of them as our FDA - but also the purchaser of drugs, or at least the price-setter of drugs for their country/countries. So, when they say, "We'll pay you $3.00 per pill," and the expense to bring the drug to market is $5.00 per pill, who do you think picks up the tab for the R&D? There's nobody left but the American consumer. In the article there is also a blurb about the need to fund the research, and if those costs aren't recoverable, it would have a negative impact on future research... just like removing the patents from medicines. Sounds great, but why would any company spend hundreds of millions of dollars developing a drug that they would have to hand over to the jackal generic manufacturers?

[FireChan]

That's not quite true. Yes, R & D is becoming increasing expensive and is contributing to the cost of prescriptions but it certainly isn't the main factor to rising prescription costs in the US and subsidizing R & D for the rest of the world? Not sure how you come to the conclusion that this is a major factor, please explain.

It's quite simple, as Nanker's post below shows. Drug prices are relatively unfixed in the US compared to the rest of the world. When the rest of the world is paying less, it means we have to pay more to keep companies in the green/fund their R&D departments. Which makes the average American subsidizing the creation of new and better drugs directly by having to pay more per pill.

 

 

http://assets.aarp.org/www.aarp.org_/cs/gap/ldrstudy_prescdrugs.pdf

 

From the above AARP study:

 

Another key public policy consideration related to prescription drugs is pricing.

U.S. prescription drug prices are essentially unregulated;

3

pharmaceutical manufac-

turers are free to set any price they want for their products. In principle, market

mechanisms such as competition, discounts, and rebates may help to moderate drug

prices, but the impact of the market can be subtle. Pharmaceutical manufacturers

segment the brand-name prescription drug market by charging different prices to

different clients, just as the airline industry charges different prices to different fare

classes.

4

Drug manufacturers use differential pricing to compensate for income dif-

ferences across countries and to adjust for regulatory payment systems, with some

national system payment systems limiting the prices companies may charge. The

U.S. pays the highest prices and bears the greatest portion of the global burden of

R&D costs for developing new products. Although prescription drug price regula-

tions are national, prescription drug development and industry benefits are global.

Numerous studies have compared brand-name drug prices in the U.S. with prices

in other countries. More recently, as prescription drug prices have continued to

increase, more sophisticated analyses have confirmed that Americans, to varying

degrees, appear to pay higher drug prices than consumers in other countries.

5

Therefore, important unanswered questions include, how much higher are U.S.

prescription drug prices than drug prices in other countries? and, what value does

the U.S. economy get for bearing these higher prices?"

The US is unregulated wrt drug pricing - unlike most of the rest of the world. Their Formularies dictate the prices they will purchase drugs at. Think of them as our FDA - but also the purchaser of drugs, or at least the price-setter of drugs for their country/countries. So, when they say, "We'll pay you $3.00 per pill," and the expense to bring the drug to market is $5.00 per pill, who do you think picks up the tab for the R&D? There's nobody left but the American consumer. In the article there is also a blurb about the need to fund the research, and if those costs aren't recoverable, it would have a negative impact on future research... just like removing the patents from medicines. Sounds great, but why would any company spend hundreds of millions of dollars developing a drug that they would have to hand over to the jackal generic manufacturers?

 

Thanks for assist.

Edited May 4, 2016 by FireChan