thebandit27 Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 As Coach Tuesday put it earlier the Bills have a smaller margin of error. In a vacuum neither of those decisions cost the Bills a playoff berth but each negatively impacted the overall success of the team. At least Coach's response makes some sense....and like I said, I'm not advocating for Crossman or saying that ST doesn't affect the team; obviously it does. All I'm saying is that this mega overreaction is wholly unwarranted.
BillsVet Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 (edited) If Marrone is willing to put his coaching job on the line for a friend, who's not that good at his job, if I'm Whaley, I'm starting to seriously think about Marrone's decision-making. Brandon is linked directly with the Marrone hire and was actively involved in the interviewing process. And if Russ is involved, it's his reputation on the line as well, so they'll wait until the bitter end if Marrone doesn't succeed. I recall a few years ago Brandon, Overdorf, Littman, and RW meeting in Detroit to determine if DJ's fate. Rumor was Brandon voted against, but ultimately they retained a guy who'd be fired in less than a year. With this in mind, I seriously wonder if going 8-8 or 7-9 in year 2 of Marrone would result in the HC being fired. After all, every HC search opens the team up to attention from the outside which is something Buffalo despises. Edited January 6, 2014 by BillsVet
NewEra Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Way to hold people accountable Marrone. This is so frustrating. I can't even read the replies to the thread.
thebandit27 Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Brandon is linked directly with the Marrone hire and was actively involved in the interviewing process. And if Russ is involved, it's his reputation on the line as well, so they'll wait until the bitter end if Marrone doesn't succeed. I recall a few years ago Brandon, Overdorf, Littman, and RW meeting in Detroit to determine if DJ's fate. Rumor was Brandon voted against, but ultimately they retained a guy who'd be fired in less than a year. With this in mind, I seriously wonder if going 8-8 or 7-9 in year 2 of Marrone would result in the HC being fired. After all, every HC search opens the team up to attention from the outside which is something Buffalo despises. It could potentially, although given that Brandon let Nix & Whaley pick Marrone as the head coach, he'll likely leave the decision up to Whaley.
NoSaint Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 You totally disregard that the playoff teams that have below average special teams have Peyton Manning, Andrew Luck and Drew Brees. and have cost them games, and very important things like homefield advantage in the playoffs some years. just because its a smaller segment of the game, doesnt mean we should be glad with just anything thrown out on the field. as we become more competitive and start to get into wildcard chases a poor unit might not just cost a game but the playoffs.
thebandit27 Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 and have cost them games, and very important things like homefield advantage in the playoffs some years. just because its a smaller segment of the game, doesnt mean we should be glad with just anything thrown out on the field. as we become more competitive and start to get into wildcard chases a poor unit might not just cost a game but the playoffs. Not what I said, or what I implied.
Rob's House Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 I love that this is where we are as a fan base: 8 pages on Danny Crossman and 44 pages on Da'Rick Rodgers. We've literally broken out the pitchforks over the ST coach. It's unbelievable. Does special teams matter? Sure. Is it so important that you can't be good on both offense and defense and lousy on special teams and still win? No, not even close. Denver, Philadelphia, Indianapolis, and New Orleans all ranked in the bottom 1/3 of the NFL in special teams and made the playoffs. Arizona ranked 29th and had 10 wins in the toughest division in football (this is all according to Football Outsiders). What's more is that each of these teams got markedly worse in ST ranking from 2012, and yet this hasn't affected their ability to make the playoffs at all. Want to see some teams that got markedly better in ST this year? Jacksonville, St. Louis, Detroit, Dallas, NYJ...notice any commonality among them? Let's get off this ST nonsense and focus on what's important: improving the side of the ball that's responsible for scoring points. Good grief. When you have a top 10 QB to run your high output offense you can absorb some special teams gaffes (although I should point out that ST cost Denver the chance to win against Indy) but when you've got your rookie game manager QB operating a run first offense trying to out-point a team relying largely on your defense to pull these games out, special teams becomes much more important. Also, it's not that you need special teams to dominate; just that it not lose the game or steal your chance of winning.
Gerry Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Brandon is linked directly with the Marrone hire and was actively involved in the interviewing process. And if Russ is involved, it's his reputation on the line as well, so they'll wait until the bitter end if Marrone doesn't succeed. I recall a few years ago Brandon, Overdorf, Littman, and RW meeting in Detroit to determine if DJ's fate. Rumor was Brandon voted against, but ultimately they retained a guy who'd be fired in less than a year. With this in mind, I seriously wonder if going 8-8 or 7-9 in year 2 of Marrone would result in the HC being fired. After all, every HC search opens the team up to attention from the outside which is something Buffalo despises. Are you kidding me? 7-9 or 8-8 will be considered progress; the only thing that might (and I mean might) get Marrone fired is if the Bills collapse and go 3-13 or 2-14. Speaking of year 2, the travel schedule is far worse than this year (4 games out of the time zone vs. 1 this year) and the Bills are a horrible road team (I think 1-4 on the road this year with EJ starting).
4merper4mer Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Pretty fatal flaw if you are correct. I think Marrone is quite different from Gregg Williams, but only time will tell. How is Greggo Marrone different from Greggo? Here are the similarities I see: Inability to communicate to the press Inability to accept blame for a bad decision without throwing at least a little jab in someone else's direction Inability to adjust his style when it is not working....like the Dareus situation Normally correctible coaching issues that will he harder to correct due to hardheadedness I could cite several examples but the basic theme is that rather than adapt to his environment he wants his environment to adapt to him because he talks like a tough guy. I do think Greggo Marrone actually has more tangible credibility than Greggo ever did, but that is not enough to make the world do what you want it to do. What do you see about them that is different?
Rob's House Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Are you kidding me? 7-9 or 8-8 will be considered progress; the only thing that might (and I mean might) get Marrone fired is if the Bills collapse and go 3-13 or 2-14. Speaking of year 2, the travel schedule is far worse than this year (4 games out of the time zone vs. 1 this year) and the Bills are a horrible road team (I think 1-4 on the road this year with EJ starting). I wouldn't jump for joy over it, but I'd consider 8-8 progress.
bbb Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Just so we're all on the same page, here's how Danny Crossman's Special Teams units have ranked (according to Football Outsiders) since his first year at the post, 2005: 2005 - Carolina - 5th 2006 - Carolina - 24th 2007 - Carolina - 30th 2008 - Carolina - 10th 2009 - Carolina - 29th 2010 - Detroit - 11th 2011 - Detroit - 29th 2012 - Detroit - 30th 2013 - Buffalo - 30th It's like a complete mystery. Maybe he just needs a certain profile of player to put together a solid unit? I don't know... Where along the way did he become Marrone's buddy?
Maury Ballstein Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 (edited) anyone acting like special teams don't matter should watch how the eagles just lost their playoff game to a darren sproles return and horse collar penalty. crossman was a failure and there is no reason to believe he should return. the track record has already been seen by all. or maybe the cinci game should be viewed or Lagarette Blount's freaking field day. I don't get your angle Casey D but good on your if your right. Edited January 6, 2014 by Ryan L Billz
NoSaint Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Not what I said, or what I implied. fair enough, but i think its also fair to not be happy on this one.
Turbosrrgood Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 (edited) Where along the way did he become Marrone's buddy? Perhaps this will help - http://www.buffalobi...60-e4d6f2965158 But the list of his ST's units says it all...A history of terribleness. 4 of his last 5 years his teams have finished 29th or worse...At least he's consistent. Edited January 6, 2014 by Turbosrrgood
NoSaint Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Where along the way did he become Marrone's buddy? approximately 1989? they played together, then coached together two different places, then were coordinators in the same division
bananathumb Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 So is the honeymoon In Buffalo over for Marrone?
Mr. WEO Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Of course his being a friend had a lot to do with him getting the job-- that happens all the time in all walks of life. But that does not mean that because you know someone you hire or retain them even if incompetent. I assume Marrone thinks Crossman is a quality ST coach or he would not have hired him in the first place. He may be wrong, but if he is Marrone is possibly betting his HC career on it. And I believe Marrone likes his job-- and what it brings to him and his family in terms of financial security-- more than Danny Crossman. Hmm... do I do this for Danny or my kids? Easy call, don't you think? I believe Marrone would fire Crossman in a heartbeat if he felt it would bring the Bills closer to the playoffs. Why would you think otherwise? Yes, until you show me you are incompetent. I have not reached the conclusion that Marrone is incompetent. And as a manager, you need to give situations time to play out and not change course as soon as things get rough. It's called leadership. The bolded part is what's worrisome. A guy has bet his career completely unnecessarily on a guy with a long record of failure--because he's a friend and he honestly believes he can work wonders with Crossman. That's impaired judgement. And that is what's keeping him form firing him.
GA BILLS FAN Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Late to the party on this one --- First, retaining Crossman erodes Marrone's credibility -- you can't preach accountability and let a unit that was 30th in NFL and not make change --- Marrone has some serious explaining to do and spare me the "I need 6 core guys" speech --- that's a complete joke --- I would give Crossman a pass if his track record was close to average, but his unit's have underperformed consistently --- as for Brandon, I'll repeat my mantra -- "HE is the singular biggest issue with this organization" --- you want to talk accountability -- just look at Brandon --- promoted to Prez/CEO defacto owner with a horrible track record --- UGH -- this is a bad sign
bobobonators Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Ill just say it now, i dont like the job Marrone has done after a year. If im owner, he better knock my socks off next season, or i cut him loose. Average college coach, and so far a below average NFL coach.
Rob's House Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Anyone know where Marrone likes to drink? I'm considering a career change and would like to get a gig as a position coach for the Bills. I don't have any experience, but I've been watching all 22, I've played a lot of Madden, and I'm fun to drink beer with. If any of you knows where I could happen upon a chance encounter with him at such an establishment I'd be very appreciative. Thanks in advance.
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