thebandit27 Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 Thank you, I think the comparisons of QB play past and present are getting harder to make all the time. In 2010, the NFL basically did the equivalent of officially adding a designated hitter to the offensive lineup by effectively eradicating the kill-shot to the QB and to WR's. They basically made it easier to produce offensively while at the same time extending the careers of their most marketable players. It's changed the mentality of teams about rookie QB's. Teams used to be afraid that the beating would shell-shock the rookie QB's. That's not the case any longer. It's still not EASY for a rookie QB but the biggest obstacle was the fear of the big hit while working thru reads......and now it just isn't anywhere near as dangerous. Even going back to 2006 or 2008 takes things out of perspective now. Since 2010.....8 of the top 10 all-time individual passing yardage seasons have happened. Since 2010....5 of the top 10 all-time individual passer rating seasons have happened. Those numbers are crazy out of whack with numbers even from 5 years ago. The league is simply not the same so comparing EJ Manuel's rookie season to guys like Ben Roethlisberger is not an apples/apples comparison any longer. There's a caveat to this statement--it'll never be apples-to-apples, I agree; there is something to be said, however, for the fact that the coaching staff ran the offense much, much closer to the type you'd find in 2004 than the type you see around the league now. Nearly 50/50 run-pass split is about as close to a replica of an old Steelers' offense as you'll get.
BADOLBILZ Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 (edited) There's a caveat to this statement--it'll never be apples-to-apples, I agree; there is something to be said, however, for the fact that the coaching staff ran the offense much, much closer to the type you'd find in 2004 than the type you see around the league now. Nearly 50/50 run-pass split is about as close to a replica of an old Steelers' offense as you'll get. Anytime your offense can be at least balanced running/passing the football it should help a young QB.........but it doesn't help draw anymore of a parallel pre-2010 because the significant change is league wide. Up until that point, there were still teams that would take a flag for the chance to destroy a QB or defenseless WR. As soon as Goodell started handing out those big fines the spearing and head targeting of quarterbacks all but vanished. Edited January 6, 2014 by BADOLBEELZ
4merper4mer Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 I haven't read through this thread but am wondering if the conclusion is: Botch a home playoff game so badly that your team is down 4 touchdowns at home to a bad team and then hope about 15 starters on the other team get hurt. Does that qualify you for the Hall of Fame these days?
BuffOrange Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 (edited) Of course, I am not sure how important the first 30 years after the merger really are to the debate. As Bills fans can tell you.....there was a time when journeyman QB's could win a SB with a dominant roster. Free agency evened out the rosters and then a heavy rules emphasis on the passing game basically made it impossible for Doug Williams, Mark Rypien and Jeff Hostetler to win a Super Bowl in any given season. An eternity ago, Brad Johnson was the last QB to win a SB that wasn't on his way to enshrinement. Or should I say ISN'T on his way, as they are all still active. Some of these dudes might play 20 seasons the way the league is now. I think this is an important point. Guys like Bradshaw and Kelly were pretty much shot after a decade in the NFL. Sixteen years in.....Manning just had his best season ever. There is going to be a lot of overlap in franchise QB careers.......which means MORE chances for teams to get theirs. This year there is likely to be another future HOF QB hoisting the Lombardi trophy.......all 4 remaining AFC passers are having HOF careers......in the NFC there are 3 dynamic and supremely talented and very young QB's with a very good chance at HOF careers and of course, the LOCK in Drew Brees. I've thought a lot about this (why QB is so important now) & something about the chalk answer of "it's easier to throw now" never made sense to me. I mean if the NBA moved the 3pt line closer teams would shoot more 3's, sure. But would that really make good 3pt shooters more valuable? I would think the opposite. The bolded part is the one that gets overlooked imo (and the salary cap). There just isn't the talent gap in overall rosters that there used to be; thus the importance of the most important position is amplified. I am starting to think it's less important in the postseason. The idea that Eli & Flacco are elite is obviously 'circular logic'. They are elite in the same way Dalton would be considered elite if he played a good 4 games starting yesterday and won it all this year. If you're not considered a stud before a playoff run you're not a true stud imo. Everyone knew Rodgers was a stud before his run in 2010. Or at least everyone not named Colin Cowherd and the simpleton "sort by playoff wins" fans. I wonder if maybe so much of Peyton's edge in the reg. season is his obsessive preparation & film study which is more likely to be matched by opposing defenses in the playoffs. Edited January 6, 2014 by BuffOrange
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted January 6, 2014 Posted January 6, 2014 I've thought a lot about this (why QB is so important now) & something about the chalk answer of "it's easier to throw now" never made sense to me. I mean if the NBA moved the 3pt line closer teams would shoot more 3's, sure. But would that really make good 3pt shooters more valuable? I would think the opposite. The bolded part is the one that gets overlooked imo (and the salary cap). There just isn't the talent gap in overall rosters that there used to be; thus the importance of the most important position is amplified. I am starting to think it's less important in the postseason. The idea that Eli & Flacco are elite is obviously 'circular logic'. They are elite in the same way Dalton would be considered elite if he played a good 4 games starting yesterday and won it all this year. If you're not considered a stud before a playoff run you're not a true stud imo. Everyone knew Rodgers was a stud before his run in 2010. Or at least everyone not named Colin Cowherd and the simpleton "sort by playoff wins" fans. I wonder if maybe so much of Peyton's edge in the reg. season is his obsessive preparation & film study which is more likely to be matched by opposing defenses in the playoffs. I see what you aregueing, but I think the 3 point line example is off. A better basket ball analogy would be if they fined every foul occurring on a any jump shot, but not lay ups in the paint. This would certainly increase the value a shooter has to teams and magnify the impact a good one would have as the defenses could not d up as aggressively on that mode of offense.
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