Coach Marrone

[NoSaint]

 

1) Replace Whaley

2) Replace replacement Whaley

3) Covert action to harvest Harbaugh stem cells

4) ?????

5) Hoist Lombardi Trophy

 

Lucky we already phased in the biomedical "analytics" department. Just gotta keep turning over staff until our genetically engineered winners are ready to figure out #4, you know, so no one catches on

Edited December 28, 2013 by NoSaint

[YoloinOhio]

Lets not pretend that we knew that our offseason free agent QB would slip on a bath mat and then knock himself out of playing 1 down for the Bills...or know that injuries would decimate our secondary and doom our season early, or that some our key vets would choke at key moments of season changing games...I for one will take this group of players and know that with a few FA moves and another strong draft class, we WILL be in the playoffs next year...there will be NO excuses

 

As for some of thread starters in the forum, seems some just crave attention...either way love this site and you all kept me sane during my tour here in Africa...thanks and Go Bills!!!

This

 

OK. while we're piling on the troll (deservedly):he has something of a point:

 

I don't want Marrone pleased with the result of this season. I want him to keep that frustration burning all offseason as he plans for next year. I want him interviewing people to change out some of the coaching staff, looking through prospective free agents, looking through film on draft prospects.

 

The Colts had a fire sale the year they released Manning, cutting a lot of their veterans. They have now made the playoffs two years in a row.

 

This year, the Chiefs got a brand new head coach, brought in a QB that people said was mediocre to good and then built a dominating team.

 

Marrone isn't making excuses and 6-10 or 7-9 is about or better what national media expectations were. I just wish we'd defied them for once.

This is a totally different situation than the Bills are in, although I see your point. They admitted they were a year late in cutting all their vets... the SB was in Indy in 2011 and they wanted to make one last run so they hung onto Freeney, etc. Then Peyton got hurt and it was all for naught. I personally don't think the Colts are better now than they were then. Their division is trash this year and they won by default. I love Luck, but he is carrying the offense. Mathis is great but the rest of their D is pretty bad. They have had some injuries, but I think overall Irsay and Grigson's vision of the "new Colts" will not surpass Polian's version. I will be shocked if they make it out of the 1st rd of the playoffs this year. They need to have a huge draft to get to the next level and they don't even have a 1st rounder this year.

[EasternOHBillsFan]

I was born in 1969. Do you know HW many head coaches the Pittsburgh Steelers have had in my life time? Hint it's less than the Bills have had in this century.

 

Whether you are trying to be sarcastic or not, another idiotic thread on the head coach is unnecessary. The staff isn't going anywhere, nor should they.

 

+1,000,000

 

This is an excellent point!! The talent level on this team needs tweaking and major improvement at QB and TE. Marrone has shown a heck of a lot in his first year and I'm optimistic with the staff. I'd give him more rope than a Jauron or a Gailey who've done it before coming here. I love historical comparisons... before Noll, the Steelers STUNK for decades.

[Leelee Phoenix]

I think Marrone is awful and brings nothing in the way of innovation or intelligence, but even I wouldn't fire him now, unless there's a potential hire that's too good to pass up. Which isn't happening this offseason. Let him build his system... whatever it is... before the requisite 3 years passes and the public finally starts turning on him.

Edited December 28, 2013 by Leelee Phoenix

[3rdand12]

Players talking about "getting it done?" That's your proof that he's changing the culture?

 

Give Marrone 2 more years. Unless we get a top 10 QB, our squad will give up once again.

agree ! the team need to define the QB of the future or Marrones best efforts will be for naught.

I am giving Marrone and Co. till next season to make a big improvement in the Offense (QB especially) .

Edited December 28, 2013 by 3rdand12

[BADOLBILZ]

agree ! the team need to define the QB of the future or Marrones best efforts will be for naught.

I am giving Marrone and Co. till next season to make a big improvement in the Offense (QB especially) .

 

Marrone can extend his shelf life by having an alternative potential franchise QB next year if EJ plays poorly or blows out a knee in camp and is lost for the season, etc..

 

He really can't afford to play 10 games with a backup qulaity NFL QB.....be it a Ryan Fitzpatrick FA or a UDFA like Thad Lewis...... next year.

 

All the people saying they don't want EJ in an open competition against another 1st round prospect will not be forgiving of the plan if the team is out of the playoffs again next year and desperately trying to get a new QB with the 10th pick in the draft.

 

If Manuel fails and Marrone has a top prospect in waiting then he doesn't go into year three with a rookie QB.

 

As bad as Gailey's defense was, what ultimately did him in in year 3 was not having a promising young QB to turn to when all that technique work by David Lee didn't make Fitz a better QB.

 

If he had something cooking he would have gotten a fourth year. You would think that Whaley and Marrone would know this and not risk their careers on Manuel.

[RuntheDamnBall]

Because he was never that good here in Syracuse. And I just didn't see anything that he did this year to give me much hope for the future. Marrone is like Barack Obama - inexperienced and completely in over his head.

Oh, good.

[3rdand12]

Marrone can extend his shelf life by having an alternative potential franchise QB next year if EJ plays poorly or blows out a knee in camp and is lost for the season, etc..

 

He really can't afford to play 10 games with a backup qulaity NFL QB.....be it a Ryan Fitzpatrick FA or a UDFA like Thad Lewis...... next year.

 

All the people saying they don't want EJ in an open competition against another 1st round prospect will not be forgiving of the plan if the team is out of the playoffs again next year and desperately trying to get a new QB with the 10th pick in the draft.

 

If Manuel fails and Marrone has a top prospect in waiting then he doesn't go into year three with a rookie QB.

 

As bad as Gailey's defense was, what ultimately did him in in year 3 was not having a promising young QB to turn to when all that technique work by David Lee didn't make Fitz a better QB.

 

If he had something cooking he would have gotten a fourth year. You would think that Whaley and Marrone would know this and not risk their careers on Manuel.

Do you think Whaley and Marrone dont have something at stake here ? How they deal with it we shall see.. So far not kinda bad not horrid considering

 

you are correct about Gaileys eggs in one basket.

i think his hands were tied a bit

[timtebow15]

The real problem for the Bills this year has been the inconsistency of mediocre QB's. I think Hackett did a great job given this problem, and Marrone has the team ready to play most weeks, even though they are out of playoff contention. The key issue is the Bills FO failing to adequately address the most important position on the team AGAIN by pinning their hopes on a rookie and injury prone veteran, and then when the injury prone veteran got injured, by hoping said rookie, who himself missed training camp, and an undrafted rookie and practice squad QB could get the job done.

I agree with this 100%. When the Kolb option fell through they were in a tough spot. That was on the front office. I think Marrone has potential to be a good coach. They need another good draft but they also need an experienced option at QB in case Manual doesn't progress as hoped. After next year we'll know.

[BADOLBILZ]

Do you think Whaley and Marrone dont have something at stake here ? How they deal with it we shall see.. So far not kinda bad not horrid considering

 

you are correct about Gaileys eggs in one basket.

i think his hands were tied a bit

 

I think everybody in that building has an urgency to establish themselves as winners. Marrone's urgency is that new coaches are expected to win right away so time is a wasting for him. And at Ralph's age ownership could easily change entirely in as little as a year and a new owner isn't likely to pay $1B and retain losers. Like it or not, Russ has 15 years with a losing franchise and Whaley is in year 4.

[YoloinOhio]

I think everybody in that building has an urgency to establish themselves as winners. Marrone's urgency is that new coaches are expected to win right away so time is a wasting for him. And at Ralph's age ownership could easily change entirely in as little as a year and a new owner isn't likely to pay $1B and retain losers. Like it or not, Russ has 15 years with a losing franchise and Whaley is in year 4.

This is a good point.... while I would give Marrone time, and the Bills don't want to go find someone new already, a new owner may not think twice about buying out his contract if he wanted to make a change and new owners usually do if things aren't already where they want them.

[hondo in seattle]

Really? Tell me how Chip Kelly looks. His team was circling the drain until Vick gets injured and Foles took over. Heck, Kelly waited 3 weeks before he would even commit to Foles as his starter. You would think such an offensive genius could tell what he had in Foles and played him sooner.

 

PTR

 

PTR, it's all about production. The Eagles are producing more wins this year than last. And are you really knocking Kelly about Foles? Foles was a nobody until Kelly transformed him into a star. Apparently that process took a while because, by all accounts, Vick outplayed Foles in camp & preseason. Eventually, though, Kelly taught Foles to run his offense at a high level.

 

I'm not a Chip Kelly fan by any means. But - if you're an Iggles fan - you've got to be awfully encouraged by his first year. The Eagles had the 15th ranked offense in 2013 but are currently 2nd. Chip is an offensive guy and he's delivering.

 

Marrone is also an offensive guy but his impact has been less impressive. We'll probably finish the season with the same number of wins as last year. Our offense was ranked 17th last year but has slipped to 23rd this year despite running more plays. We averaged 5.6 yards per play last year. This year, we're gaining a paltry 4.8! And you can't blame it all on QB play. Spiller gained 6.0 yard per carry last year. Running in the Marrone/Hackett scheme, he's averaging only 4.5.

 

Marrone was smart enough to hire Pettine as his DC but he hasn't done crap with the offense - his specialty. Marrone may turn out to be a great NFL head coach some day but the naysayers have room to talk based on current production - especially when compared to Kelly's (or Andy Reid's).

[YoloinOhio]

PTR, it's all about production. The Eagles are producing more wins this year than last. And are you really knocking Kelly about Foles? Foles was a nobody until Kelly transformed him into a star. Apparently that process took a while because, by all accounts, Vick outplayed Foles in camp & preseason. Eventually, though, Kelly taught Foles to run his offense at a high level.

 

I'm not a Chip Kelly fan by any means. But - if you're an Iggles fan - you've got to be awfully encouraged by his first year. The Eagles had the 15th ranked offense in 2013 but are currently 2nd. Chip is an offensive guy and he's delivering.

 

Marrone is also an offensive guy but his impact has been less impressive. We'll probably finish the season with the same number of wins as last year. Our offense was ranked 17th last year but has slipped to 23rd this year despite running more plays. We averaged 5.6 yards per play last year. This year, we're gaining a paltry 4.8! And you can't blame it all on QB play. Spiller gained 6.0 yard per carry last year. Running in the Marrone/Hackett scheme, he's averaging only 4.5.

 

Marrone was smart enough to hire Pettine as his DC but he hasn't done crap with the offense - his specialty. Marrone may turn out to be a great NFL head coach some day but the naysayers have room to talk based on current production - especially when compared to Kelly's (or Andy Reid's).

IMO, it seemed like there were only a few games in which the Offense and Defense both played well. In the ATL game the offense was really good and despite the fumbles at the end had the team in place to win and the defense sucked. In the Cincy game - same thing (defense sucked in 1st half). In the KC game, both played well (600 yds offense on top D in league) but the TOs killed them. The Tampa game was an all-out fail but many teams have that flat game at least once a season, yes, even playoff teams. I saw enough in the 1st year to make me optimistic for next year, especially the division wins that Gailey never seemed to get.

[Hapless Bills Fan]

Did you hear that? It was PTR'S point flying right over your head. Chip Kelly made the wrong QB decision but luckily the QB he thought was better got injured. Foles blew up and now Chip is a genius. Funny how that works.

 

Love the Bart Scott description of Belicheck a few years back: "One Mo Lewis hit away from the unemployment line"

[Mr. WEO]

Did you hear that? It was PTR'S point flying right over your head. Chip Kelly made the wrong QB decision but luckily the QB he thought was better got injured. Foles blew up and now Chip is a genius. Funny how that works.

 

Yeah, really!! I mean who didn't know Foles was a 25 TD/2 int, 110 rating QB sitting on Philly's bench all that time!

 

Stupid Chip Kelly starting the season with the team's starting QB instead of the backup who had lost 7 out of 8 games under Andy Reid!

 

I definitely "hear that"--awesome point!

[LB3]

 

 

Yeah, really!! I mean who didn't know Foles was a 25 TD/2 int, 110 rating QB sitting on Philly's bench all that time!

 

Stupid Chip Kelly starting the season with the team's starting QB instead of the backup who had lost 7 out of 8 games under Andy Reid!

 

I definitely "hear that"--awesome point!

 

So you agree with me that picking a QB is sometimes a crapshoot that can make a coach look better/worse depending on the outcome? Hard to see your point through all the exclamations!!!!!

[machine gun kelly]

 

 

+1,000,000

 

This is an excellent point!! The talent level on this team needs tweaking and major improvement at QB and TE. Marrone has shown a heck of a lot in his first year and I'm optimistic with the staff. I'd give him more rope than a Jauron or a Gailey who've done it before coming here. I love historical comparisons... before Noll, the Steelers STUNK for decades.

 

+1

 

Teams that win create a winning front office staff and coaching and stick with them. I want to give thismgroupmat least 4 years which it will not take that long to evaluate. That's what winning teams do. Andy Reid, Jeff Fisher, Tom Coughlin had bad years. They had consistency and it paid off in playoffs. I feel this is the best staff I've seen from management to coaching in a long time. Give them time and don't rush the fire threads so quickly.

 

It reminds me of companies that are so panicky to show positive earnings each quarter vs. having a good long term financial strategy. The difference is inmbulkmorders to look good for the quarter which means you play from behind the next quarter. It's short sighted strategy. It never ever works.

[Mr. WEO]

So you agree with me that picking a QB is sometimes a crapshoot that can make a coach look better/worse depending on the outcome? Hard to see your point through all the exclamations!!!!!

 

I was mocking your and PTR's contention that Kelly was foolish to go with Vick when the great Nick Foles was sitting on the bench.

 

I'm certainly no fan of Kelly, but he had to scrap a significant portion of his high speed offensive which was built around Vick when Vick got hurt. He had to adapt to Foles as a drop back pocket passer and he turned this notably mediocre backup into the hottest QB in the league.

 

That's not luck.

[LB3]

 

 

I was mocking your and PTR's contention that Kelly was foolish to go with Vick when the great Nick Foles was sitting on the bench.

 

I'm certainly no fan of Kelly, but he had to scrap a significant portion of his high speed offensive which was built around Vick when Vick got hurt. He had to adapt to Foles as a drop back pocket passer and he turned this notably mediocre backup into the hottest QB in the league.

 

That's not luck.

 

Maybe my point wasn't clear. I just used the example given by PTR (the first year coach used as example was arbitrary to me)to the poster that said Marrone was finished. You read far more into my post than what I actually wrote. I never said it was foolish or that Nick Foles was a known asset. I never said Chip was a bad coach. You made those inferences yourself. I did say that luck is sometimes involved. See Brady and Warner's first Super Bowl wins where they were both back ups to start the year. Here is what I meant. Please refute anything I say.

 

Based on how the season has played out:

 

Kelly made the wrong QB choice. Vick was not cutting it. Would I have started Vick? Yes. It still ended up being the wrong choice.

 

Kelly was forced to play Foles due to injury.

 

Kelly opted to stick with Foles after determining he was more effective after a few weeks of indecision.

 

Foles has been unbelievable.

 

Chip was getting beat up for not being an NFL coach before Foles blew up.

 

Chip is now getting praised as an offensive NFL genius because of Foles' play.

 

Did he change his offense? Yes. Complete overhaul? No.

 

Does he deserve credit? Yes.

 

Is Marrone already a failure? No.

 

 

Edit: I just looked up Foles stats from last year. They weren't awful. They look like rookie back up QB'S numbers. I think "notably mediocre" is a bit of a stretch.

Edited December 29, 2013 by KikoSeeBallKikoGetBall

[BUNCH OF MULARKEY]

I have always tried to remain positive. i know the OP was a bit trollish, but he is on to something.

I just saw a lot of moments this year where the team looked not ready and Marrone in particular looked out of his league during a game and how he managed EJ.

I hope Marrone has learned a great deal this year and will grow from it. I do not really want to fire him.

One of the things Marrone needed to learn was that Hackett can not be both QB coach and OC in the NFL.

Marrone also needs to show his ST's coach the door.

During the year Marrone showed he was not afraid to make player changes in hopes of improvement, he now needs to apply that philosophy to his staff.

Address the SJ issue. Personally SJ to me is not a gamer. I am not talking about his character but about his inability to make plays when you need them. Please do not bring up the Carolina catch, even a broke clock is right twice a day and that was a catch anyone of us on here could have made. This type of person is not needed on this team. SJ needs to be traded for something while he has some value.

 

Marrone makes some of these moves and he will show me he has learned something and i will buy back into him. IF Marrone comes back with the same staff then we should be prepaired for much of the same next year.

I agree with every point you made.

First and foremost I agree with replacing crossman. Punt return team makes me sick. Do they ever hold up the gunners? Leodis has a history of being successful returning punts and I can't even think of a good one he's had this year. And the penalties for blocks in the back are like clockwork. Punt team isn't much better. Doug has to know its bad. Replace crossman.

I'm warming up to the idea of a dedicated qb coach that works specifically on technique. If we had a seasoned vet and ej maybe it wouldn't be that important, but heck we have three very young qbs here. Has ejs footwork been improving? How bout Thad and ejs ball security in the pocket? Accuracy and reads improving? Two running qbs, have they even perfected sliding?

Counting on Stevie in crunch time is not a good idea. I don't like how he shows up his qb. Granted I like him better than graham.

Sorry I'm making old obvious points. Just trying to kill time before the game starts..