Jauronimo Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) Why do you say Brandon was a "yes man?" I mean, ya' know, other than the fact you don't like him. Do you have any evidence he has never taken a principled stand? And hiring "some of the worst coaches?" What does that even mean? Google Harvey Johnson, John Rauch, Jim Ringo, Kay Stephenson, Hank Bullough, etc. Or do you not mean "some of the worst coaches in Bills history?" Do You mean "some of the worst coaches available?" Which coaches did he hire? And who, realistically - don't start yelling Shanahan, Gruden, or Cowher because none of them would've come to Buffalo - was available at the time? Who else did they interview that you wanted them to hire so badly? That's the beauty of hindsight, I guess: Just sit on the sidelines scream bloody murder when people who are trying don't succeed. Well, good on ya' I suppose, but it's not how I roll. Before we discuss the quality of the coaches he "hired", I think it would nice to see a shred of evidence that he was even responsible for hiring those coaches. Edited December 18, 2013 by Jauronimo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mead107 Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Some people just like to type crap on the keyboard. On to the game this Sunday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 I will get jumped for this but the answer is none of it. Football operations is not his department. Other than expressing an interest in signing Terrell Owens once I don't believe he's had any input on personnel moves. He's strictly marketing, until this season when he hired Whaley and Marrone as team president. Up until this year it was Ralph Wilson who directly or indirectly affected all decisions of personnel. Ralph hired every GM and would occasionally stick his nose into draft room. Blaming Brandon is like blaming the secretaries and janitors. He's the latest straw man invented by frustrated fans looking to blame someone. This is the first season that Brandon actually has the responsibility we have been accusing him of having for the last decade. PTR Thanks PTR...somedbody has to keep the whiners straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nucci Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 The thing that bothers me most is the game in Toronto. I don't know whose doing that was, but if the Bills are truly serious about winning (like Brandon says) they would not give away a home game every year. I agree! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dezertbill Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 After Brandon's failed effort of playing GM in 2007, he was stricken of all Football Operational decisions, period. It was made clear by the Bills time and time again that Football decisions were in the hands of Buddy Nix and whoever the head coach was, along with the Director of Player personnel and College Scouting. Any decision that went above him was made by Ralph himself. The only decisions you can hold Brandon responsible for are the ones made after January 1st of this year, or any marketing decisions (such as Toronto) that where made on his watch. Based on that, I think the Bills have done well since January based on the fact that it was repeated time and time again that this was a learning season for the Bills and their new staff, and playoffs seemed a bit of a pipedream. Moving forward if the teams' decisions don't pan out, it's on Brandon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) lol. Comparing Brandon's position to that of a janitor or secretary isnt building a straw man? This is just going in circles with me. The bottom line is the discussion is a waste of time until A. The team has a new owner and they move or B. The team has a new owner and they clean house Until then, I just dont see this team getting pulled from the mud. I can kind of see where this is going: 2014 no QB is taken EJ flounders a bit, written off as his true rookie season as he was injured too much in 2013. Maybe some injuries to sweeten the pot. 2015 EJ doesnt improve, team still has 5 wins, EJ and Marrone shipped out, both pinned on Nix. Brandon and Whaley have another chance to start fresh 2016 See 2013 Trust me, I hope Im wrong, and will give credit to Brandon if they turn this around next year. Ive just seen this movie play out too many times. Around the league, teams go up and down quickly. It shouldnt be this difficult. Edited December 18, 2013 by May Day 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Before we discuss the quality of the coaches he "hired", I think it would nice to see a shred of evidence that he was even responsible for hiring those coaches. Agreed. I asked him to identify coaches hired by Brandon because I'm not aware of any. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Agreed. I asked him to identify coaches hired by Brandon because I'm not aware of any. He was heavily involved in the Marrone hire as he and Whaley conducted the initial interviews. So, other than Marrone and under his new title, I can't think of any other time Brandon was involved in hiring the HC. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GunnerBill Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) Part of the problem on this board is that people want it both ways. Last year this place was full of "Fire Nix / Fire Gailey / Cut Fitzpatrick". So the Bills did - they cleared house and appointed a new GM, a new Head Coach and drafted a Quarterback. The reaction to which (from the same people) is "oh here we go again another botched re-boot". I'm not sure with these people if there is any combination of decisions that would satisfy them. We will only know if it's another failed re-boot when we are a year or two down the line. And if it is a failure, the only answer is to re-boot again and no doubt they won't like that re-boot either. It's ok people sitting there behind their computers and declaring that they appointed the wrong GM and the wrong Head Coach and drafted the wrong Quarterback but it's all opinion at the end of the day. I suppose people on here all presume their opinion is worth more than the opinion of the decision makers at OBD and will support that position with "14 years".... but the reality is half of these people would have made not just equally poor decisions over the years but worse ones. Doug Marrone wasn't my first choice as Head Coach but it's not like he was a total left field selection, he was considered a viable candidate for 4 teams as has already been said. Edited December 18, 2013 by GunnerBill Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. WEO Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 They most certainly should be beating bad teams. Thing is, they haven't really played many bad teams. They played Atlanta, who they failed to finish against; I can't blame the coaches for the mistakes that cost them that one. Tampa Bay I'll absolutely give you; that was a disaster. I don't see how you can add that they almost lost to Jax and use it to bolster your point, without giving credit for almost beating NE, KC, and hanging tough against NO. They've also beaten some likely playoff teams (Carolina and Baltimore) and played very tough against others (Cincinnati). It's awfully hard to come down on the coaching staff that had to play a 3rd string QB for 4 games. We lost to NO by 18 points. Steelers, AtL, Bucs and JAgs are bad teams. Teams we all thought we would handle in the second half of the season after a promising start (as I conceded--go back and read my post)--even with 3rd string QBs. Yet down the stretch, we look no better than we did with the 3rd string guys. The D gives up a lot of points and the passing offense isn't good. We've won 2 of the last 7. Yes, they do. Not as much as a franchise QB, as I mentioned, but to say that adding talent at the WR position simply doesn't matter is flat out incorrect. And no, I didn't initially argue that at all...I asked you why the 2013 draft wasn't the best in years. You really didn't answer that, except to say that the 2009 draft, which was 4 draft classes ago, was good. You said this: "has this past draft not been the best that the Bills have had in a long time?"--clearly you are stating you believe this is the best draft in a long time. Anyway, I did answer. I disagreed--to this point in time. And I told you why. Also, 4 years ago falls within the "a long time" definition, I think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloBillsForever Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) I stand corrected it was after Levy stepped down, Brandon has been involved in the football operations which has been 5-6 years now. That is a long time in a football job sense. Whether or not he is calling the shots at the end of each decision we will never know, but he is obviously heavily involved in the process. If you think Brandon defers control of the football operations to the GM, headcoach etc why was Brandon at the combine this offseason? Wasn't he tweeting from there or something at one point? Edited December 18, 2013 by BuffaloBillsForever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Brandon throwing the failures of his team on the fans is a slap in the face (as a loyal STH). He does not go anywhere out of his way to thank or show appreciation to the fans... at least on a regular basis. We hear more about our inadequacies. I challenge you to find me a quote of Brandon's that "throws the failures of the team on the fans" or that speaks of our inadequacies. And by the way, I'm a STH and club seat holder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Part of the problem on this board is that people want it both ways. Last year this place was full of "Fire Nix / Fire Gailey / Cut Fitzpatrick". So the Bills did - they cleared house and appointed a new GM, a new Head Coach and drafted a Quarterback. The reaction to which (from the same people) is "oh here we go again another botched re-boot". I'm not sure with these people if there is any combination of decisions that would satisfy them. We will only know if it's another failed re-boot when we are a year or two down the line. And if it is a failure, the only answer is to re-boot again and no doubt they won't like that re-boot either. It's ok people sitting there behind their computers and declaring that they appointed the wrong GM and the wrong Head Coach and drafted the wrong Quarterback but it's all opinion at the end of the day. I suppose people on here all presume their opinion is worth more than the opinion of the decision makers at OBD and will support that position with "14 years".... but the reality is half of these people would have made not just equally poor decisions over the years but worse ones. Doug Marrone wasn't my first choice as Head Coach but it's not like he was a total left field selection, he was considered a viable candidate for 4 teams as has already been said. I have been beating the same drum for years and expressed fury here on tbd as the "changes" happened last january. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) He was heavily involved in the Marrone hire as he and Whaley conducted the initial interviews. So, other than Marrone and under his new title, I can't think of any other time Brandon was involved in hiring the HC. GO BILLS!!! I should have added the caveat of "prior to January 3rd, 2013." I think it was Promo who upthread said Brandon's just the latest target for people who are frustrated beyond their ability to comprehend and deal with it and need a (another) scapegoat. To paraphrase a former Secretary of Defense, "there is no 'there' there." There are a lot of things that could've broken a different way over the past decade-plus. To blame it on one guy is inane. Edited December 18, 2013 by Campy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 (edited) I challenge you to find me a quote of Brandon's that "throws the failures of the team on the fans" or that speaks of our inadequacies. And by the way, I'm a STH and club seat holder. It is wrong to say the team needs to leave the area to remain viable after 200 million dollars are handed to them and they haven't delivered in what's going on 2 decades. Every time he does that interview he alludes to that as well as their difficulty to sell out games. Each time he says this, he points to the early 90s, which implies that even if they were good we wouldn't show up. 90's are not relevant Stub hub resales/everybody is a broker Internet insta-sales Regionalization hadn't occurred. Those blackout attendance totals would fill the current stadium and then some. Nfl popularity has gone through the roof Visiting fans are better travelled. Also I recall the sabres ' playoffs of the early 90s we were able to walk up and buy oranges the day of. Post 2000, forget about it. Playoff tickets are gobbled up well in advance now. Edited December 18, 2013 by May Day 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FLFan Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 "People are dumb, panicky animals and you know it." K to J, Men in Black Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 It is wrong to say the team needs to leave the area to remain viable after 200 million dollars are handed to them and they haven't delivered in what's going on 2 decades. Every time he does that interview he alludes to that as well as their difficulty to sell out games. Each time he says this, he points to the early 90s, which implies that even if they were good we wouldn't show up. 90's are not relevant Stub hub resales/everybody is a broker Internet insta-sales Regionalization hadn't occurred. Those blackout attendance totals would fill the current stadium and then some. Nfl popularity has gone through the roof Visiting fans are better travelled. Also I recall the sabres ' playoffs of the early 90s we were able to walk up and buy oranges the day of. Post 2000, forget about it. Playoff tickets are gobbled up well in advance now. When, exactly, and to whom, did he say ever that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
May Day 10 Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Well I know he said it on December 4th on wgr Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Well I know he said it on December 4th on wgr Well, I know he didn't say it in the GR interview I heard. It's okay to not like the guy. It's not okay to resort to pulling crap out of your arse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thewildrabbit Posted December 18, 2013 Share Posted December 18, 2013 Allow me to reiterate, Russ Brandon is the current CEO! Adding, he is also the president of the team, which was the owners old job. Fact, In 2006 Russ Brandon was hired to be director non-football operations along side of GM Marv Levy, who was also named vice president of football operations. Belief, when Levy retired Brandon then assumed Levy's responsibilities as a de facto GM of the team. So one could easily say that Brandon has also had his hands on the football side of operations since 2008. Although never given the actual title of general manager of the team. I would think that he must have shown some ability in that fashion to recently be promoted to not only president of the team. But also to chief executive officer of the entire organization. Meaning that Russ Brandon now has total control of the non football side and the football side of the team. What is the teams win-loss record since 2008? What football people have been hired as coaches - GM's, and has the team had a winning season in that time? Although perhaps Brandon didn't directly hire Buddy Nix, Chan Gailey, Doug Marrone, Doug Whaley I'm fairly confidant that Brandon has had some influence with every hiring decision that has been made since that time. Conclusion, I won't be content with any aspect of Russ Brandon at the controls until he is able to field a winning team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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