Azalin Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 here's a link to the resolution that unfortunately failed: ballsy even to try it. http://www.cnbc.com/id/101221226 this is just where you and I look at things completely differently. as far as I'm concerned, a CEO, or anyone else for that matter, should make whatever those that pay him believe him to be worth. despite the mind-boggling amounts that some CEOs earn, the government....or anyone else for that matter....should have absolutely no say in the matter. I'm a bit disgusted at the money that people like Madonna, Tiger Woods, or George Clooney make, but they earn it fair & square and I would never set a ceiling on their earnings. I might however, banish Madonna to Switzerland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 (edited) Why should they be paid more you ask.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=48-tcRiBNj4 The most compelling argument yet on the topic of raising fast food wages to $15 an hour. Edited December 10, 2013 by Jauronimo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Man Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 More, More More - Andrea True Connection (HQ Audio) - YouTube Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 it's difficult to take a personal attack seriously as an argument. you're painting with a wide brush against my argument as it's essentially the same as krugman's but i realizre that his academic credentials are marks against him in your view. let me try again. lets say bananas are 50 cents a pound at walmart. they sell one hundred pounds a day (for simplicity). walmart's labor costs amount to 5 cents of the price. after all costs, that profit is 10 cents a pound. doubling minimum wage doesn't double labor costs overall for the bananas (not all the work product of any minimum wage worker is used on this one product and not only minimum wage workers are included in the 5 cent labor cost attributed to labor). so lets say the price goes up to 52 cents per pound and the profit down to 9 cents a pound after the wage increase. if 10% more bananas are sold because more minimum wage workers can buy more of them, it's a wash. there is some wage increase point where it's no longer a wash and more than a 10% increase in sales results. now extrapolate to other consumer products. Let's sit with Tattoo on Fantasy Island for a moment and assume this is true. Now minimum wage workers - basically, the unskilled, uneducated dropout masses of the country -- are earning the same as dental assistants, machine shop workers, etc. What next? Are companies expected to now pay those people $30 an hour? Explain to us how that works well for everyone when you expand it out. We'll wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Large Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 A few thoughts: - I don't think people working those jobs, and the skills associated with those jobs need to make $15 an hour. Kids working part time should be doing those jobs, and get benefits from their employed parents. - It makes me sad that in America, McDonalds and Walmart have been career option for low education workers, and that those are the only jobs they can find and actually get. - What pisses me off if Walmart makes Billions upon Billlons for the Waltons and Investors, but can't provide an employee with even a basic managed care plan, thereby we all get to subsidized the wealth with our tax dollars. To top it off, is that Americans know this fact, and continue to shop there... stop spending money there American, all of the sudden Walmart responds with better treatment of employees. We have the power to make real change, were just lazy and have deferred to Government i many cases. - I don't go near a Walmart or McDonalds.. low quality cheap junk just isn't my thing... I'd like to see more Americans desire better as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 More, More More - Andrea True Connection (HQ Audio) - YouTube She's the Miley Cyrus of the 70s!!! A few thoughts: - I don't think people working those jobs, and the skills associated with those jobs need to make $15 an hour. Kids working part time should be doing those jobs, and get benefits from their employed parents. - It makes me sad that in America, McDonalds and Walmart have been career option for low education workers, and that those are the only jobs they can find and actually get. - What pisses me off if Walmart makes Billions upon Billlons for the Waltons and Investors, but can't provide an employee with even a basic managed care plan, thereby we all get to subsidized the wealth with our tax dollars. To top it off, is that Americans know this fact, and continue to shop there... stop spending money there American, all of the sudden Walmart responds with better treatment of employees. We have the power to make real change, were just lazy and have deferred to Government i many cases. - I don't go near a Walmart or McDonalds.. low quality cheap junk just isn't my thing... I'd like to see more Americans desire better as well. It makes many of us sad that so many Americans refuse to do what is required to get a job better than you can get at McDonalds and WalMart. It's the only job they can get because they quit on themselves. Yeah, I know, some people have difficult situations, but you know what i'm saying is true. Throw in a broken family, welfare bennies handed from generation to generation, and an excessive world of "everyone gets a medal," and no one should be surprised how many unskilled gimme-gimme takers there are in this country. Alternately, the beautiful thing about America is you can work and save and start your own company and provide quality employment to people all on your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 (edited) These articles about fast food wages all lament the decline of manufacturing in this country before describing how the clown and the king do not pay a "livable" wage. Is the issue really McD's employees earning wages which are too low or do we have a severe structural employment problem? Why mention the decline of manufacturing? Is there a lack of skilled jobs forcing otherwise capable workers into the fast food industry? Is there a shortage of skilled labor to fill better paying jobs? http://www.nytimes.c...force.html?_r=0 The blame-the-worker mentality lurking behind the “ skills gap” thesis was more explicitly laid out by PIMCO hedge fund owner Bill Gross, who declared, “Our labor force is too expensive and poorly educated for today’s marketplace.” http://progressive.org/skills-gap-myth Edited December 10, 2013 by Jauronimo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
keepthefaith Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 cool. but the out of tune chorus will likely ignore your input here as well. For every expert opinion, there is an equal and opposite expert opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 it's difficult to take a personal attack seriously as an argument. you're painting with a wide brush against my argument as it's essentially the same as krugman's but i realizre that his academic credentials are marks against him in your view. let me try again. lets say bananas are 50 cents a pound at walmart. they sell one hundred pounds a day (for simplicity). walmart's labor costs amount to 5 cents of the price. after all costs, that profit is 10 cents a pound. doubling minimum wage doesn't double labor costs overall for the bananas (not all the work product of any minimum wage worker is used on this one product and not only minimum wage workers are included in the 5 cent labor cost attributed to labor). so lets say the price goes up to 52 cents per pound and the profit down to 9 cents a pound after the wage increase. if 10% more bananas are sold because more minimum wage workers can buy more of them, it's a wash. there is some wage increase point where it's no longer a wash and more than a 10% increase in sales results. now extrapolate to other consumer products. And how does Walmart induce the workers to spend their new pay increase on bananas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC Tom Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 And how does Walmart induce the workers to spend their new pay increase on bananas? They have electrolytes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Miner Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 A few thoughts: - I don't think people working those jobs, and the skills associated with those jobs need to make $15 an hour. Kids working part time should be doing those jobs, and get benefits from their employed parents. - It makes me sad that in America, McDonalds and Walmart have been career option for low education workers, and that those are the only jobs they can find and actually get. - What pisses me off if Walmart makes Billions upon Billlons for the Waltons and Investors, but can't provide an employee with even a basic managed care plan, thereby we all get to subsidized the wealth with our tax dollars. To top it off, is that Americans know this fact, and continue to shop there... stop spending money there American, all of the sudden Walmart responds with better treatment of employees. We have the power to make real change, were just lazy and have deferred to Government i many cases. - I don't go near a Walmart or McDonalds.. low quality cheap junk just isn't my thing... I'd like to see more Americans desire better as well. Also not how businesses work. If a company's sales decline, do you really think their reaction is to increase expenses? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jauronimo Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 They have electrolytes! Isn't that what plants crave?!?!? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vark Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 You want us to put water on the crops instead?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JuanGuzman Posted December 10, 2013 Share Posted December 10, 2013 I think economists accept thatthe dis-employment (e.g., min wage goes up total employment falls) effects of a higher minimum wage aren't as a consequential as expected. See: Card-Krueger Study. Still I think dis-employment from higher min waqes exists. I also don't think that min wage increases is the best way to reduce poverty as not all min. wage workers live near poverty line. Some are teenagers living at the family home, others may be part time workers who are not the primary earner in the family. If you want to address min.wage workers living in poverty. I'd rather see an expansion of working tax benefits or a negative income tax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Let's sit with Tattoo on Fantasy Island for a moment and assume this is true. Now minimum wage workers - basically, the unskilled, uneducated dropout masses of the country -- are earning the same as dental assistants, machine shop workers, etc. What next? Are companies expected to now pay those people $30 an hour? Explain to us how that works well for everyone when you expand it out. We'll wait. "it will tend to raise all wages since the floor is higher". i agree. most have already conceded that $15 is a starting point for negotiations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4merper4mer Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 They have electrolytes! Makes sense. Maybe instead of pay increases they could just issue banana credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 (edited) A few thoughts: - I don't think people working those jobs, and the skills associated with those jobs need to make $15 an hour. Kids working part time should be doing those jobs, and get benefits from their employed parents. - It makes me sad that in America, McDonalds and Walmart have been career option for low education workers, and that those are the only jobs they can find and actually get. - What pisses me off if Walmart makes Billions upon Billlons for the Waltons and Investors, but can't provide an employee with even a basic managed care plan, thereby we all get to subsidized the wealth with our tax dollars. To top it off, is that Americans know this fact, and continue to shop there... stop spending money there American, all of the sudden Walmart responds with better treatment of employees. We have the power to make real change, were just lazy and have deferred to Government i many cases. - I don't go near a Walmart or McDonalds.. low quality cheap junk just isn't my thing... I'd like to see more Americans desire better as well. but people making minimum wage can for the most part only afford cheap junk. walmart , mcd's and the like are their primary vendors in many cases. thus, it may well be in those particular employers best interest to increase pay to their workers and for others with less to gain, to be compelled to do so as well. Edited December 11, 2013 by birdog1960 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 "it will tend to raise all wages since the floor is higher". i agree. most have already conceded that $15 is a starting point for negotiations. Most as in....who? Who is this "most" you are referring to? Can you link to something other than a Krugman quote? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdog1960 Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Most as in....who? Who is this "most" you are referring to? Can you link to something other than a Krugman quote? do you think if mcd's comes back with 9 they can't settle on 11 or 10? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 do you think if mcd's comes back with 9 they can't settle on 11 or 10? I don't need a lesson in negotiating. Answer the question. Who is the 'most' you say agrees that $15 is a starting point? Is McDonalds or Walmart part of this 'most' or by 'most' do you mean all the people who post a comment at the bottom of a Krugman article. Who comprises this 'most?' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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