$15 An Hour

[3rdnlng]

there is plenty of data regarding the lack of effect on unemployment on states raising the min wage next to states that didn't. he alluded to that fact. it wasn't a scholarly paper but an editorial.

 

So, an editorial now becomes data?

[DC Tom]

there is plenty of data regarding the lack of effect on unemployment on states raising the min wage next to states that didn't. he alluded to that fact. it wasn't a scholarly paper but an editorial.

 

No, there really wasn't.

 

So, an editorial now becomes data?

 

No, an allusion now becomes data.

[3rdnlng]

No, there really wasn't.

 

 

 

No, an allusion now becomes data.

 

Allusion or illusion?

[keepthefaith]

there's a large pool of data that comes to a different conclusion: http://www.nytimes.c...y-now.html?_r=0

 

Krugman? Please. We've never had an instant 66% increase in the minimum wage so there are no past result to compare. We have nobody in our company making minimum wage but if we were forced to give our lower paid workers a 66% raise I can tell you most would not survive. We'd have to cut our labor expenses and find ways to be more efficient. That would mean employing fewer people and probably replacing a few with others that can perform better. At a 66% increase we would easily find workers who can do a better job than some of the incumbents. How many business would think like this? Probably nearly all faced with the labor cost increase.

[Tiberius]

I agree that a minimum raise that high would only make companies go to automation, really, most of those job can be eliminated now, and at $15 an hour I have no doubt they will be. Then again, I'm sure it will happen anyway. So many jobs in the near future are on the way out, in the next few decades truck drivers, teachers, lawyers, most manufacturing jobs, warehouse jobs and on and on are going to be eliminated. What happened then?

[Nanker]

I agree that a minimum raise that high would only make companies go to automation, really, most of those job can be eliminated now, and at $15 an hour I have no doubt they will be. Then again, I'm sure it will happen anyway. So many jobs in the near future are on the way out, in the next few decades truck drivers, teachers, lawyers, most manufacturing jobs, warehouse jobs and on and on are going to be eliminated. What happened then?

[birdog1960]

No, there really wasn't.

 

 

 

No, an allusion now becomes data.

perhaps you can jin up another personality that can comprehend that nearly anything or anyone can be alluded to.

[TPS]

I don't think you will find too many economists who would say that an increase to $15 over a short time period would be a wise thing. I think California is doing it right, incrementally increasing over the next 2 years from $8 to $10.

[SageAgainstTheMachine]

I don't think you will find too many economists who would say that an increase to $15 over a short time period would be a wise thing. I think California is doing it right, incrementally increasing over the next 2 years from $8 to $10.

 

And isn't New York going incrementally from $7.25 to $9.00?

[TPS]

And isn't New York going incrementally from $7.25 to $9.00?

Yep

[birdog1960]

I don't think you will find too many economists who would say that an increase to $15 over a short time period would be a wise thing. I think California is doing it right, incrementally increasing over the next 2 years from $8 to $10.

i don't think anyone expects them to get $15 right away. it's an opening salvo. it's also designed to shape public opinion on what a low wage their current pay is. and it's working....

[TakeYouToTasker]

i don't think anyone expects them to get $15 right away. it's an opening salvo. it's also designed to shape public opinion on what a low wage their current pay is. and it's working....

Much like anything else, folks without a functional understanding of cause and effect will care about the "low wages" right up until it hits them in the pocket.

 

As I've pointed out before, the profit margin for an exceptionally well run restaurant is, under the best of conditions, 10%. 30% goes to overhead, 30% goes to food costs, and 30% goes to labor. Your suggestion that labor costs should roughly double to 60% of revenues not only pushes out all of the profits for the ownership, but demands that the business actually run at a 20% loss.

 

Account for that, please.

[IDBillzFan]

talk to me after you've won the nobel prize for economics and land a job a princeton.

 

There was a time having a Nobel Prize and teaching at an ivy league university equated to intelligence. That time passed with Barack Obama.

 

And I'm not one of those people who is easily impressed and doe-eyed by people with awards, degrees and professions. Then again, I'm not a progressive, so that pretty much goes without saying.

 

Much like anything else, folks without a functional understanding of cause and effect will care about the "low wages" Obamacare right up until it hits them in the pocket.

 

Funny how easily you can change that sentence and still have it make 100% sense.

[TPS]

Much like anything else, folks without a functional understanding of cause and effect will care about the "low wages" right up until it hits them in the pocket.

 

As I've pointed out before, the profit margin for an exceptionally well run restaurant is, under the best of conditions, 10%. 30% goes to overhead, 30% goes to food costs, and 30% goes to labor. Your suggestion that labor costs should roughly double to 60% of revenues not only pushes out all of the profits for the ownership, but demands that the business actually run at a 20% loss.

 

Account for that, please.

I'm not sure about CA, but NY's increase excludes workers making tips, unless adding average hourly tips to an hourly wage is < the minimum. Cooks at any decent restaurant will make more than the minimum. The only part of a restaurant's workforce impacted are the dishwashers...

[B-Man]

MINIMUM WAGE HYPOCRITES:

 

For example, Organizing For Action, that kind of creepy newfangled 4H political arm of President Obama, is looking for talented, hard-working, ambitious folks to fill

14-week unpaid

intern positions.

 

Among the work you might perform there free of charge? Agitating for an increase in the minimum wage!

 

Similarly, among those fabled dens of journalistic rabble rousing that do so much to stoke the rage against evil huge employers like Wal-Mart, Subway, McDonald’s and so many others, there are plenty of outlets looking for bright young people to man the barricades.

 

Again, for little or no pay.

 

The left-wing heroes at Mother Jones, bothered by the appearance of having unpaid interns, raised the job status to “fellows” and began paying them the royal wage of $1,000 a month. Assuming a normal work-week, alas, that’s well below the minimum wage mandated in its California editorial home.

 

Across country, in the cheap space of Manhattan, editorial interns at Salon are, alas, unpaid. That hasn’t stopped the magazine from publishing pieces excoriating the allegedly underpaid masses.

 

Well, at least former Clinton Labor Secretary Robert Reich is one man who won’t stand for that sort of thing. At the left-wing American Prospect magazine he helped found, interns get a healthy $100-per-week stipend. That’s less than a third of what some exploited slob would get working 40 hours at minimum wage, but, hey, are you only in it for the money?

 

 

 

 

Hey, rules are for the little people.

[keepthefaith]

Take a subway restaurant for example which requires a roughly $200K investment to open and generates about a $75K profit per year. A payroll for one of these with manager and payroll taxes is probably about $110K per year. If the non-manager workers (roughly 2 people) get a raise to $15 per hour from $7.50 per hour (assuming the restaurant is open 70 hours per week), the payroll rises by about $65K per year including payroll taxes. Even if I'm a little high in the estimate, who is going to keep one of these open or pay $200K to open a franchise if the annual profit is now $10K? How much business would be lost if the restaurant had to raise prices by 20+% to cover the increased labor expenses? A lot.

[TakeYouToTasker]

I'm not sure about CA, but NY's increase excludes workers making tips, unless adding average hourly tips to an hourly wage is < the minimum.

Correct. Now, keep in mind that waitstaff and bartenders only typically report 15% of their tips.

 

Cooks at any decent restaurant will make more than the minimum.

But we're not talking about some nebulous "decent" restaurant. We're talking about the dine-in chains, breakfast places, bars serving pub-grub, local family restaurants, Chinese, Mexican, and Indian cuisine, fast food, ect. Most of those places start at or near the minimum, especially in a down economy where people aren't eating out nearly as much as they used to, and accounting for an absolute saturation of the labor market.

 

The only part of a restaurant's workforce impacted are the dishwashers...

Wholely untrue.

[Tiberius]

I'm not sure about CA, but NY's increase excludes workers making tips, unless adding average hourly tips to an hourly wage is < the minimum. Cooks at any decent restaurant will make more than the minimum. The only part of a restaurant's workforce impacted are the dishwashers...

 

That's right! When I delivered pizza in Buffalo we were paid $2 an hour, .50 a delivery and whatever else we could get for tips

 

MINIMUM WAGE HYPOCRITES:

 

For example, Organizing For Action, that kind of creepy newfangled 4H political arm of President Obama, is looking for talented, hard-working, ambitious folks to fill

14-week unpaid

intern positions.

 

Among the work you might perform there free of charge? Agitating for an increase in the minimum wage!

 

Similarly, among those fabled dens of journalistic rabble rousing that do so much to stoke the rage against evil huge employers like Wal-Mart, Subway, McDonald’s and so many others, there are plenty of outlets looking for bright young people to man the barricades.

 

Again, for little or no pay.

 

The left-wing heroes at Mother Jones, bothered by the appearance of having unpaid interns, raised the job status to “fellows” and began paying them the royal wage of $1,000 a month. Assuming a normal work-week, alas, that’s well below the minimum wage mandated in its California editorial home.

 

Across country, in the cheap space of Manhattan, editorial interns at Salon are, alas, unpaid. That hasn’t stopped the magazine from publishing pieces excoriating the allegedly underpaid masses.

 

Well, at least former Clinton Labor Secretary Robert Reich is one man who won’t stand for that sort of thing. At the left-wing American Prospect magazine he helped found, interns get a healthy $100-per-week stipend. That’s less than a third of what some exploited slob would get working 40 hours at minimum wage, but, hey, are you only in it for the money?

 

 

 

 

Hey, rules are for the little people.

Stupid! There is a reason its called volunteer work! How dumb can you get man?

[boyst]

 

 

That's right! When I delivered pizza in Buffalo we were paid $2 an hour, .50 a delivery and whatever else we could get for tips

 

Stupid! There is a reason its called volunteer work! How dumb can you get man?

did that job motivate you? It was while you were a student or early on in life when you had no skills right? Arguably you learned anything from the education you received and still lack skills so really this will go over your head, but those are entry level jobs. Only a fool would make a career of a position like that. And only a fool would start off a family or depend upon that type of work sustaining them in their life.

[Wacka]

Take a subway restaurant for example which requires a roughly $200K investment to open and generates about a $75K profit per year. A payroll for one of these with manager and payroll taxes is probably about $110K per year. If the non-manager workers (roughly 2 people) get a raise to $15 per hour from $7.50 per hour (assuming the restaurant is open 70 hours per week), the payroll rises by about $65K per year including payroll taxes. Even if I'm a little high in the estimate, who is going to keep one of these open or pay $200K to open a franchise if the annual profit is now $10K? How much business would be lost if the restaurant had to raise prices by 20+% to cover the increased labor expenses? A lot.

 

The Subways near me got rid of the $5 footlong except for sales. The minimum is now $6 or $6.50