John Bongiovi interested in buying the Bills

[vincec]

If Ralph came out and said Bills are getting sold to such-and-such group when I die to calm Bills fans, IRS could deem that sale effectively happened before he died and come after his estate for the capital gains tax.

I would strongly doubt the legality of such a claim. Just because he has a non-binding "handshake" agreement in place that doesn't mean that he's legally agreed to sell the team. I think that wishful thinking plays a part in this sounding logical.

[Kirby Jackson]

 

I would strongly doubt the legality of such a claim. Just because he has a non-binding "handshake" agreement in place that doesn't mean that he's legally agreed to sell the team. I think that wishful thinking plays a part in this sounding logical.

 

It was all in response to "why Ralph wouldn't come out and reveal his succession plan?" I do not think that it is crazy to think that the IRS could come knocking if he said, "Once I pass, Tom Golisano and Jim Kelly have a group that will be purchasing the team for $850M. There will be a new stadium built in WNY 4 years after the transaction is completed."

 

Admittedly, I am not anywhere close to an expert on tax law. I do however think that if there is $150M in place they will be looking. The point is that, there may be reasons that he does not reveal the plan. I hope that the plan is in place (which it certainly is) and I hope that plan involves a long term commitment to WNY.

Edited November 29, 2013 by Kirby Jackson

[BuffaloRebound]

I would strongly doubt the legality of such a claim. Just because he has a non-binding "handshake" agreement in place that doesn't mean that he's legally agreed to sell the team. I think that wishful thinking plays a part in this sounding logical.

 

Never suggested that Ralph has a handshake agreement in place, just that the IRS does not take kindly to tax avoidance schemes of that nature.

[Rubes]

I find it extraordinarily hard to believe that the IRS could do anything until money actually changed hands. Ralph announcing that "Bills fans should rest easy that we're working on a plan to keep the Bills in Buffalo long after I pass" would go a long way toward easing public angst, and I can't possibly imagine the IRS would be able to intervene in any way. Not until money/ownership changed hands, at least. But I'm no expert.

[3putt]

I really do not think this has anything to do with sucession planning, if so he could have set up a series of charitable remainder trusts and family ltd partnerships to effectively minimize a negative tax consequence on disposition. The thing that looms larger is that the league doesn't want to waste their time with such a small and declining market. The television rights deals are the grail the more larger markets within the league the better. However, this may change quickly. I recently attended a seminar for work hosted by the u of chicago economics department. To prove a point that markets are not truly efficient one of the phd's used the NFL as a case study. The data shows that fans, or rather the vast majority, do not care about the game as a whole. They watch their team and only a small % follow other games on tv. More people are shunning broadcast cable every year that by 2020 the majority will be watching internet streams. His point was that the NFL while highly successful, is at its apex, and that adding markets is not going to change the fundamental fact that it is really a collective of parochial interests. As consumer behavior changes, there will be a devaluation of its content in relation to that available elsewhere. It is happening in soccer overseas already. The collective broadcasts do not attract as much interest as local productions be it tv or web.

[Thirty Year Fan]

He's not a Bill. He's a cowboy. On a steel horse he rides.

He's Buffalo Bill on a Steel pony!

[BuffaloRebound]

I find it extraordinarily hard to believe that the IRS could do anything until money actually changed hands. Ralph announcing that "Bills fans should rest easy that we're working on a plan to keep the Bills in Buffalo long after I pass" would go a long way toward easing public angst, and I can't possibly imagine the IRS would be able to intervene in any way. Not until money/ownership changed hands, at least. But I'm no expert.

 

Nothing's gonna happen until money changes hands, but you can bet the IRS would be sniffing around once they are sold if Ralph publicly made assurances. If he made assurances that team will only be sold to group that keeps them in Buffalo, he's lowering the selling price. My un-informed opinion is team is sold to Buffalo group once Ralph passes and team plays 2 games in December in Toronto going forward. NFL has too much of a corporate image already. Buffalo, with all its small market warts, is an old school authentic NFL franchise. My guess is that the NFL would prefer keeping the franchise in Buffalo while getting a slice of the Toronto/Canadian market without destroying the CFL and all the negative press that would come with it.

[SRQ_BillsFan]

 

 

It was all in response to "why Ralph wouldn't come out and reveal his succession plan?" I do not think that it is crazy to think that the IRS could come knocking if he said, "Once I pass, Tom Golisano and Jim Kelly have a group that will be purchasing the team for $850M. There will be a new stadium built in WNY 4 years after the transaction is completed."

 

Admittedly, I am not anywhere close to an expert on tax law. I do however think that if there is $150M in place they will be looking. The point is that, there may be reasons that he does not reveal the plan. I hope that the plan is in place (which it certainly is) and I hope that plan involves a long term commitment to WNY.

 

 

If there was something in place that he didn't want to reveal, you don't think he would at least mention to his "buddies" in Toronto that the team won't hit the open market? Why let them waste resources, you already have other deals with them?

 

?

[uncle flap]

I think we need to start a site to take donations to keep the Bills in Buffalo. Any Buffalo based ownership group that buys the team will get it. If all of the fans and local businesses came up with say $500-1000 each we could probably end up with upwards of $100 million to add to the pot which might mean the difference between a local investor group offering $900 million and a Toronto group offering $1 billion. If we start it now I bet it can grow to a substantial size between now and 2020

 

http://www.buffalofa...lofan/HOME.html

 

Oops I see it doesn't detail their plans on the site, but one of their main goals is setting up a trust where the fans and local businesses wouldn't outright own the team but would "loan" their money to the buyer keeping the team in Buffalo. The loan would have a zero or low interest point but assuming we/they could put a dent in the cost could go a long way as you suspect.

Edited November 29, 2013 by uncle flap

[Kirby Jackson]

I really do not think this has anything to do with sucession planning, if so he could have set up a series of charitable remainder trusts and family ltd partnerships to effectively minimize a negative tax consequence on disposition. The thing that looms larger is that the league doesn't want to waste their time with such a small and declining market. The television rights deals are the grail the more larger markets within the league the better. However, this may change quickly. I recently attended a seminar for work hosted by the u of chicago economics department. To prove a point that markets are not truly efficient one of the phd's used the NFL as a case study. The data shows that fans, or rather the vast majority, do not care about the game as a whole. They watch their team and only a small % follow other games on tv. More people are shunning broadcast cable every year that by 2020 the majority will be watching internet streams. His point was that the NFL while highly successful, is at its apex, and that adding markets is not going to change the fundamental fact that it is really a collective of parochial interests. As consumer behavior changes, there will be a devaluation of its content in relation to that available elsewhere. It is happening in soccer overseas already. The collective broadcasts do not attract as much interest as local productions be it tv or web.

 

This is interesting stuff. The TV deal could get

Interesting if a team is in Toronto or London for that matter. The networks pay a premium for the NFL because they can cross promote their other shows to a market that is hard to reach and because they can get serious $ on advertising. Would those same networks that are not in play in Canada and England pay the same amount? Would they sell the rights exclusively in those countries? If so, would Toronto (or London) get a bigger piece of that pie as they are the reason for the increased rights? And to your point about it moving online, how does that impact the TV deal?All things to ponder...

[Kirby Jackson]

 

 

 

If there was something in place that he didn't want to reveal, you don't think he would at least mention to his "buddies" in Toronto that the team won't hit the open market? Why let them waste resources, you already have other deals with them?

 

?

 

Maybe they do know? Maybe, he wants them to keep investing short term? Who knows

[Doc]

Necessary? Of course not. The question is understanding the reason why, if there is a plan in place, he wouldn't. What's to gain by leaving everyone in dread-filled suspense? More ticket sales?

Potentially yes. What's to gain by saying there is a plan in place? Relieving everyone's dread?

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Potentially yes. What's to gain by saying there is a plan in place? Relieving everyone's dread?

 

Well it seems that there are a lot of people here who think Brandon is a liar and unduly secretive so maybe the transparency would be refreshing?

[Mr Info]

Ok I hate Toronto and I grew up there so i can say that.

 

Toronto is like a rich @$$hole who only wants to purchase something so it will look good in their "portfolio"

 

The city of Toronto is a corporate one no matter how you look at it and that applies to sports teams there.

 

I hate when someone thinks they are entitled to something and thinks they will get what they want just because they are big and rich. Thats the impression I get from this article.

 

I am a proud Canadian and love my country but if Toronto buys the Bills I will be sick to my stomach and have a hard decision to make as to if I would still support the Bills even though they wont be the Bills anymore.

 

Anyone else feel that Toronto is acting as a bully and taking something that is ours and trying to make us feel better by saying hey its still technicaly yours even though we own it.

 

 

Man I hate Toronto. Stick to your CFL,NHL,NBA,MLB,NLL,MLS.

 

You dont need the NFL and the NFL does not need you.

 

CBF

 

Mr. Ford,

 

It appears you are relocating. Our city could desperately use your financial acumen and infusion of levity.

 

Regards,

 

Citizens of Detroit

[Mr. WEO]

 

 

If Ralph came out and said Bills are getting sold to such-and-such group when I die to calm Bills fans, IRS could deem that sale effectively happened before he died and come after his estate for the capital gains tax.

 

You made this up, I think. You can't tax a sale until the sale is completed. You can't tax a conversation about a sale.

 

[first_and_ten]

I think if Mr Wilson had a plan to keep the team in Buffalo, It would be hard to keep it quiet. It seems to me his plan is to allow his family to sell the franchise to the highest bidder. I think it just might be that simple

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I'm not really conversant on tax law at all but it seems like there are two components to this tax discussion:

 

1) Capital gains tax

 

2) Estate tax

 

Also from purely a common sense standpoint it seems if there was a contrived and documented pre-death deal to avoid payment of taxes, that the IRS would have a case to pursue.

[Mr. WEO]

I'm not really conversant on tax law at all but it seems like there are two components to this tax discussion:

 

1) Capital gains tax

 

2) Estate tax

 

Also from purely a common sense standpoint it seems if there was a contrived and documented pre-death deal to avoid payment of taxes, that the IRS would have a case to pursue.

You can't tax a handshake. The IRS will get theirs when the heir sells the team.

[SRQ_BillsFan]

I'm not really conversant on tax law at all but it seems like there are two components to this tax discussion:

 

1) Capital gains tax

 

2) Estate tax

 

Also from purely a common sense standpoint it seems if there was a contrived and documented pre-death deal to avoid payment of taxes, that the IRS would have a case to pursue.

 

I would think they would need to prove in some way he did this to get around the taxes, selling something on a future date is not illegal. I would also think "not selling this until I die" is perfectly legidament reason not to sell as it would protect his legacy. Not sure how the IRS or anyone else could prove he did it to bypass taxes.

Edited November 29, 2013 by SRQ_BillsFan