NoSaint Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 i doubt there are fans of any other team that could devote almost 50 pages of arguments to how we screwed the pooch on a UDFA, that no team - including the one he's playing for - thought enough of, to draft in the first place.. this place should have it's own reality show.. id venture if you want to most other teams boards you would be amazed what they have threads on. this one has been especially long because it isnt just a fresh 6 page thread every week, people have kept the talk contained to one location. id also guess 3 pages of the 50 are "i cant believe this is 8, 12, 18, 22, 40 50 pages" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BackInDaDay Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 You must not be familiar with the origin of the word fan. sorry to say, that like you, i'm living proof.. just don't understand what's accomplished from beating dead horses.. dead Patriots, maybe.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 See the post above and my prior comments on the theory why Marrone let Rogers go. It was a bigger issue than waiting for Rogers' talent to emerge. Marrone & rest of the coaches obviously felt the risk vs reward weren't there in their juncture with the organization. Blame timing on this stroke of bad luck. I'm highly confident that if Rogers was in Bills' camp last year, Gailey would have extended a longer leash, just like if Rogers was in camp in 2014, Marrone would also have a different outlook. I don't blame Marrone for having a lot more priorities in building his first roster than worrying what to do with a talented but UDFA WR. I'm not so sure of that. Rogers' football acumen, dedication, and attitude, not to mention performance in camp and pre-season games, made it pretty obvious why he was cut at the time. That would have been apparent to most coaches. Can't blame a coach for not wanting to spoon feed a player with a checkered past and big question marks coming in who was doing more to prove why he had those question marks than vice-versa, when he has others that don't require that special attention. Especially in his first year as a head coach as you point out. It's beyond me why this is so hard for some to understand. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YoloinOhio Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 id venture if you want to most other teams boards you would be amazed what they have threads on. this one has been especially long because it isnt just a fresh 6 page thread every week, people have kept the talk contained to one location. id also guess 3 pages of the 50 are "i cant believe this is 8, 12, 18, 22, 40 50 pages" haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) I'm not so sure of that. Rogers' football acumen, dedication, and attitude, not to mention performance in camp and pre-season games, made it pretty obvious why he was cut at the time. That would have been apparent to most coaches. Can't blame a coach for not wanting to spoon feed a player with a checkered past and big question marks coming in who was doing more to prove why he had those question marks than vice-versa, when he has others that don't require that special attention. Especially in his first year as a head coach as you point out. It's beyond me why this is so hard for some to understand. GO BILLS!!! which is odd, cause his college position coach says hes the smartest football player not named cris carter that hes ever coached. "He’s the smartest football player I’ve ever coached besides Cris Carter,” Baggett said. “Cris Carter was the smartest as far as studying and knowing game and understanding the game. If Da’Rick learns to study the game, he’ll be the smartest football player on the Colts.” http://espn.go.com/blog/indianapolis-colts/post/_/id/2596/rogers-had-to-learn-from-past-mistakes Even reading that article you get the impression that hes still a young kid with growth to be done -- but its not the lazy ass that cant be bothered to practice image that i think many want to paint as much as the insanely talented and not used to having to put in as much work and learning what that means. that he was a project shouldnt have surprised anyone. im not sure why we brought him in if we wanted a finished product from day 1. Edited January 7, 2014 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rdand12 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Failure to succumb to peer pressure is highly frowned upon. in that case i retract my puny comment . thanks for the clarification sorry to say, that like you, i'm living proof.. just don't understand what's accomplished from beating dead horses.. dead Patriots, maybe.. Could you rephrase your postion please ? and then reiterate it . I would imagine we are not talking about the nearly famous now DR as much as value systems as applied to the Bills ( via the fanbase ) : ) which is odd, cause his college position coach says hes the smartest football player not named cris carter that hes ever coached. "He’s the smartest football player I’ve ever coached besides Cris Carter,” Baggett said. “Cris Carter was the smartest as far as studying and knowing game and understanding the game. If Da’Rick learns to study the game, he’ll be the smartest football player on the Colts.” http://espn.go.com/blog/indianapolis-colts/post/_/id/2596/rogers-had-to-learn-from-past-mistakes Even reading that article you get the impression that hes still a young kid with growth to be done -- but its not the lazy ass that cant be bothered to practice image that i think many want to paint as much as the insanely talented and not used to having to put in as much work and learning what that means. that he was a project shouldnt have surprised anyone. im not sure why we brought him in if we wanted a finished product from day 1. SPIN ! He was so smart he decided with his actions not to play for the Bills ? I read that comment before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 "He's the smartest football player I've ever coached besides Cris Carter," Baggett said. "Cris Carter was the smartest as far as studying and knowing game and understanding the game. If Da'Rick learns to study the game, he'll be the smartest football player on the Colts." http://espn.go.com/b...m-past-mistakes A bit of a contradiction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 which is odd, cause his college position coach says hes the smartest football player not named cris carter that hes ever coached. "He's the smartest football player I've ever coached besides Cris Carter," Baggett said. "Cris Carter was the smartest as far as studying and knowing game and understanding the game. If Da'Rick learns to study the game, he'll be the smartest football player on the Colts." http://espn.go.com/b...m-past-mistakes Even reading that article you get the impression that hes still a young kid with growth to be done -- but its not the lazy ass that cant be bothered to practice image that i think many want to paint as much as the insanely talented and not used to having to put in as much work and learning what that means. that he was a project shouldnt have surprised anyone. im not sure why we brought him in if we wanted a finished product from day 1. Big if. I would expect his coach to be effusive in his praise but it's too bad Rogers didn't exhibit enough of those qualities while in Buffalo. And I wouldn't characterize his attitude as a laziness that doesn't want to practice. It's more of a laziness born out of selectivity. There were times he hustled and times he didn't. Times when he knew his playbook in film review and times he didn't. Times when his concentration was rewarded with good play and times when his lack of focus hurt his chances. Bottom line is he was too inconsistent while others clearly outperformed him. And he was growing more and more impatient with the diminishing reps as a result of being outperformed by the very scrubs everyone likes to mock. That says more about Rogers than it does about any scrub he didn't beat out when he had the opportunity. I can only imagine how frustrating that was for Rogers at the time. Maybe the kid was pressing too hard knowing he was coming in with all those marks against him. That's perfectly understandable. But so is knowing, as a coach, that I've got to reward those that have done more to earn further opportunities moving forward. GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billsfan1959 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Activated only because of injuries. Targeted 23 times in 5 games. 14 catches for a 13.7 yard per catch average. Sorry, don't get all the consternation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) A bit of a contradiction? i took it as him naturally being very smart on the field from the second he steps on it, and if he continues to learn the good habits to go with his natural gifts he will be the most educated on the roster. not contradictory in that sense. and between his immense physical talent, the game coming naturally to him, his short (and interrupted) college career, and yes that it was a known issue that he never had developed those habits in his 2 years at tennessee -- its not shocking that hed be lacking polish in the film room or practice field. we drafted a WR that worked with him all spring, id assume we surely spoke with coaches and teammates that likely said very similar that he was sharp as a tack, but still putting together the professional half of professional athlete. as i said before, id think that would be 100% expected that youd have to spend extra attention getting him in good habits that less gifted guys almost certainly already have established to get to this point and if you didnt want to work with him on those qualities why bring him in from the get go? Edited January 7, 2014 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 i took it as him naturally being very smart on the field from the second he steps on it, and if he continues to learn the good habits to go with his natural gifts he will be the most educated on the roster. not contradictory in that sense. and between his immense physical talent, the game coming naturally to him, his short (and interrupted) college career, and yes that it was a known issue -- its not shocking that hed be lacking polish in the film room or practice field. we drafted a WR that worked with him all spring, id assume we surely spoke with coaches and teammates that likely said very similar that he was sharp as a tack, but still putting together the professional half of professional athlete. as i said before, id think that would be 100% expected that youd have to spend extra attention getting him in good habits that less gifted guys almost certainly already have established to get to this point and if you didnt want to work with him on those qualities why bring him in from the get go? Are you suggesting the Bills staff didn't work with Rogers? Are you suggesting the Bills staff expected a polished professional the minute Rogers hit the field? Tell me, other than them being a bunch of really stupid people that are clearly out of their depth in the NFL with no clue about talent assessment , why did Marrone and Co. decide to cut Rogers? GO BILLS!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 i took it as him naturally being very smart on the field from the second he steps on it, and if he continues to learn the good habits to go with his natural gifts he will be the most educated on the roster. not contradictory in that sense. and between his immense physical talent, the game coming naturally to him, his short (and interrupted) college career, and yes that it was a known issue that he never had developed those habits in his 2 years at tennessee -- its not shocking that hed be lacking polish in the film room or practice field. we drafted a WR that worked with him all spring, id assume we surely spoke with coaches and teammates that likely said very similar that he was sharp as a tack, but still putting together the professional half of professional athlete. as i said before, id think that would be 100% expected that youd have to spend extra attention getting him in good habits that less gifted guys almost certainly already have established to get to this point and if you didnt want to work with him on those qualities why bring him in from the get go? Considering that 18 teams never contacted Rogers, it's safe to say that Bills had an idea of who they were getting. Suffice to say that they were probably as surprised as anyone by his lack of total dedication to make the roster, given the hill he needed to climb. Looks like the cut and snub by Miami finally woke him up, because it certainly didn't look like he was ready to do it in Buffalo. And that's the part you could be missing. What if, after getting into town, he decided he didn't like the staff and the opportunity, and he decided to slack off. Would you still blame the staff for cutting a player who gave a half-hearted effort? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubs Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) I just want to applaud NoSaint and Kirby Jackson for being totally on point and 100% correct in their assessment of the Da'Rick situation and the Bills mistake. You guys are a beacon of hope in this raging blizzard. Good work. GG, I'm sure you're a great guy but your arguments are based almost totally on speculation. You may be in fact correct, but buffalo's glaring deficiency at wr, lack of production from hogan and Easley, and Rogers progress in the colts organization say otherwise. Edited January 7, 2014 by dubs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GG Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 I just want to applaud NoSaint and Kirby Jackson for being totally on point and 100% correct in their assessment of the Da'Rick situation and the Bills mistake. You guys are a beacon of hope in this raging blizzard. Good work. GG, I'm sure you're a great guy but your arguments are based almost totally on speculation. You may be in fact correct, but buffalo's glaring deficiency at wr, lack of production from hogan and Easley, and Rogers progress in the colts organization say otherwise. Good guy or not, I understand how organizational decisions are made when you have to account for talented but mercurial malcontents who could spoil the entire business environment. Even in retrospect, it was the right decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kirby Jackson Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Good guy or not, I understand how organizational decisions are made when you have to account for talented but mercurial malcontents who could spoil the entire business environment. Even in retrospect, it was the right decision. If an undrafted rookie had any sort of influence over anyone in the locker room there are much bigger issues with this team than what we are discussing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoSaint Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 (edited) Are you suggesting the Bills staff didn't work with Rogers? Are you suggesting the Bills staff expected a polished professional the minute Rogers hit the field? Tell me, other than them being a bunch of really stupid people that are clearly out of their depth in the NFL with no clue about talent assessment , why did Marrone and Co. decide to cut Rogers? GO BILLS!!! im suggesting that they seemingly valued production week 1 of 2013 over the long term potential too heavily (common coaching issue) im questioning whether they weigh too heavily towards the "program" over long term potential that comes with hiccups and hard work along the way(common coaching issue) that our coach might let likability or personality cloud professional opinions (common everyday problem) and based on the performance of our offense, our WRs coach being fired, and more, whether they may have simply blown the decision i do question whether they had expectations in line and the correct plans in place, and i dont think thats as unreasonable as you are trying to frame it. are you suggesting that because they took the action, it should be regarded the right action? Edited January 7, 2014 by NoSaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB3 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Don't know if anyone posted this already but Marrone getting rid of talented players is nothing new. He preached accountability at Syracuse as well. He booted his best WR (TB'S Mike Williams) during the season because he kept making poor choices. He was a proven college receiver that was a finalist for the Belitnikoff. It looks like he practices what he preaches (Crossman excluded pending reports to the contrary). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubs Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Good guy or not, I understand how organizational decisions are made when you have to account for talented but mercurial malcontents who could spoil the entire business environment. Even in retrospect, it was the right decision. Again, you may be right or you may be wrong. I'm saying that your opinion is based totally on speculation. Basically saying that Marrone and co had to have cut him because of X, Y, and Z. There's just no evidence to support that then the cut itself. It's equally speculative to say teams including buffalo have to much of a short term view of things and not enough patience with players that need time to develop. Both points are simply guesses. What we do know based on observations is that: 1) buffalo lacks a big, physical receiver 2) we had a guy that could potentially fill that role 3) we cut him 4) he's developing nicely in Indy as evidence by his increase in playing time and incredible clutch catch he made in a playoff game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LB3 Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 What we do know based on observations is that: 1) buffalo lacks a big, physical receiver 2) we had a guy that could potentially fill that role 3) we cut him 4) he's developing nicely in Indy as evidence by his increase in playing time and incredible clutch catch he made in a playoff game. The only point I would disagree with is that I think injuries played the biggest role in his increased playing time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnykterstein Posted January 7, 2014 Share Posted January 7, 2014 Don't know if anyone posted this already but Marrone getting rid of talented players is nothing new. He preached accountability at Syracuse as well. He booted his best WR (TB'S Mike Williams) during the season because he kept making poor choices. He was a proven college receiver that was a finalist for the Belitnikoff. It looks like he practices what he preaches (Crossman excluded pending reports to the contrary). But Da'Rick didn't actually do anything wrong while he was on the Bills rosters. Would be stupid to punish a guy for things he did several years ago, in college, on a different team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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