ganesh Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 By placing him on the IR without him having a real season-ending injury, the Bills are taking away an opportunity for him to showcase his abilities that he would've likely had a chance to do if he weren't on the IR. There have been cases like that before. The only reason I think they might not file a grievance is because Hopkins might not want to get into a legal fight as a rookie. Might just ride out the season quietly and get back at it this offseason. How is that possible. He is signed to a 3 year contract with the Bills. The Bills could have kept him on the 53-man roster and not played him at all considering how well Carpenter has been kicking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 You can't use IR to "stash" a healthy player for next year without him counting against the roster limit. You can IR a player who is legitimately injured, even if he would otherwise have come back earlier in the year. Otherwise teams would have a serious challenge in fielding a healthy roster by mid season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 You can't use IR to "stash" a healthy player for next year without him counting against the roster limit. You can IR a player who is legitimately injured, even if he would otherwise have come back earlier in the year. Otherwise teams would have a serious challenge in fielding a healthy roster by mid season. You can't but you can and you do, all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 I think there is something to this. I believe you are correct, there have been cases in the past, but I'll have to do some research. A player was healthy enough to play after being IR'd and negotiated his release. But I don't see this happening with him. Negotiating an Injury Settlement and filing a grievance are 2 very different things. If he really wants an injury settlement, he could probably get one. Then he won't be paid for the rest of the year and will have to hope he catches on somewhere else (risky for a rookie kicker who has shown very little so far.) Filing a grievance would indicate that he wasn't injured at all could be playing right now, but the Bills are trying to stash him away for next year. I don't think that's the case. You can't but you can and you do, all the time. I disagree. I haven't heard anything to indicate a healthy player being IR'd recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Negotiating an Injury Settlement and filing a grievance are 2 very different things. If he really wants an injury settlement, he could probably get one. Then he won't be paid for the rest of the year and will have to hope he catches on somewhere else (risky for a rookie kicker who has shown very little so far.) Filing a grievance would indicate that he wasn't injured at all could be playing right now, but the Bills are trying to stash him away for next year. I don't think that's the case. I disagree. I haven't heard anything to indicate a healthy player being IR'd recently. What I am referring to is IRing a player for the whole season who is two weeks away from being healthy enough to play, because they need the roster spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Turk Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 What I am referring to is IRing a player for the whole season who is two weeks away from being healthy enough to play, because they need the roster spot. Doesn't matter, he attempted to do kickoffs and could not and was not close according to Marrone...that's still injured Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Doesn't matter, he attempted to do kickoffs and could not and was not close according to Marrone...that's still injured I understand he's still injured. I agree with IRing him now to save him. They solved a few problems by doing this. They don't have to make a carpenter versus Hopkins decision in a week or two when Hopkins would have been ready. If he's able to try a 59 yard FG he is close. Otherwise they would have IRd him a couple weeks ago. It also allows them to bring Lewis up without hurting another position on the roster. EJ getting hurt is the reason they are stashing Hopkins now, combined with Carpenter being 9-10. If carpenter is 7-10, or EJ doesn't get hurt, Hopkins is in all likelihood our kicker in 1-2 weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eball Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Glad to see a resolution to the K situation. Carpenter has been a great signing thus far. Boy, after threatening to turn the Bills into FSU North the Seminoles have taken a hit in the last several days (EJ's injury, Powell cut, and Hopkins to IR). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Glad to see a resolution to the K situation. Carpenter has been a great signing thus far. Boy, after threatening to turn the Bills into FSU North the Seminoles have taken a hit in the last several days (EJ's injury, Powell cut, and Hopkins to IR). Only Sanborn is still on the roster from the Snap-Hold-Kick trio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Hindsight Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Once Hopkins is healthy, he can request to be released from IR with a settlement in order to go play for another team this season. The last time I recall this happening for the Bills was with Troy Vincent probably like 10 years back. IIRC he made the request, we had no choice to comply since he was healthy enough to play and he went on to play for the Redskins the rest of the year. The CBA has changed so this may have been altered since then. Kavika Mitchell did this too after we released Trent IIRC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ricojes Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) Kavika Mitchell did this too after we released Trent IIRC Yes! That's the one I was trying to think of...That was the Coy Wire, Keith Ellison year... Edited October 7, 2013 by ricojes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 What I am referring to is IRing a player for the whole season who is two weeks away from being healthy enough to play, because they need the roster spot. Then he's not healthy. My next sentence was "You can IR a player who is legitimately injured, even if he would otherwise have come back earlier in the year." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Over 29 years of fanhood Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) Negotiating an Injury Settlement and filing a grievance are 2 very different things. If he really wants an injury settlement, he could probably get one. Then he won't be paid for the rest of the year and will have to hope he catches on somewhere else (risky for a rookie kicker who has shown very little so far.) Filing a grievance would indicate that he wasn't injured at all could be playing right now, but the Bills are trying to stash him away for next year. I don't think that's the case. I disagree. I haven't heard anything to indicate a healthy player being IR'd recently. Well but this is not really the matter at hand since Hopkins is not healthy. He has an injured Groin. Yes! That's the one I was trying to think of...That was the Coy Wire, Keith Ellison year... Really though, will this happen with a kicker? You IR him because he's hurt and the stand in is doing well. You have more chance of hanging on to him for another look next year then if you cut him as soon as he's medically cleared. With a roster as banged up as this has been you hate to carry two kickers. Edited October 7, 2013 by over 20 years of fanhood Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Then he's not healthy. My next sentence was "You can IR a player who is legitimately injured, even if he would otherwise have come back earlier in the year." Then why bring that up in this conversation? We're arguing semantics. Hopkins is very close to being healthy. If he had to, if we didn't have Carpenter, he is healthy enough to play this week. But they stashed him because we needed a roster spot and because they didn't want to have to choose between the two right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Caveman Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 (edited) I didn't bring it up, I was responding to the OP who keeps incorrectly asserting that an injury has to be "season ending" to IR someone. I was pointing out that this is not true. Edited October 7, 2013 by Captain Caveman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelly the Dog Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 I didn't bring it up, I was responding to the OP who keeps incorrectly asserting that an injury has to be "season ending" to IR someone. I was pointing out that this is not true. Got it. Cool. Carry on. All I am saying is teams stash players all the time who are minorly hurt but healthy enough to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryCletus Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 This was the best move regarding Hopkins. Slap him on the IR, get him another camp and big boy experience.... He can debut next year! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miyagi-Do Karate Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 To me, this shows that you shouldn't draft a kicker. Wasted two picks on kickers recently. Why? You can always get a decent vet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CountryCletus Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Agree, but there is something to be said for acquiring a good young kicker and locking down that position for years. Carpenter has been a pleasant surprise to almost everyone, especially considering he missed his first kick with the team. At the risk of a bunch of Brady comments, how often to players that come out of the 6th and 7th round produce quality numbers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincec Posted October 7, 2013 Share Posted October 7, 2013 Honestly, they should've IR'd him two or three weeks ago when it became clear that Carpenter was pretty good. They could've used the roster spot for a DB or OG. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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