A Few Thoughts About The Game, in no particular order.....

[Kelly the Dog]

 

Stop on this. I think we are alllllllll frustrated by it, but it was not that far out of line. The guy was on the sideline, Williams clearly did not look down and notice that - he should have. He didn't light the guy up or hit that hard but he did hit the guy in mid air and that hurts. That, while a penalty and could have been bigger then it was, sent a message to Panthers players. The Panthers WR's didn't quite go for the passes after that like they had been. They realized they were going to get hit.

You're one of my favorite posters lately but you're nuts on this one for three reasons.

 

1] late in the game, on third down and long, on a pass that is 10 yards over his head, that is NOT the time to send a message. Early in the game, maybe. Second down, maybe. Ahead by 10 points, maybe. When he did it was an insanely bad play. It's the equivalent of EJ's fumble or INT.

 

2] it was 3-4 yards out of bounds. There is ZERO chance that is not a penalty. It's not as if it was close and he couldn't stop. It was the other side of the white sideline marker. It wasn't even close.

 

3] He shoved him, he didn't smack him. It wasn't even a hit. It would not in any way imaginable discourage a player from catching a ball. It was a B word slap at the very best. It would be WAY different if Williams blistered him and hurt him. It was a kitty shove and barely felt.

[Reed83HOF]

The entire production team was atrocious. My favorite moment was when he was lining up for his last field goal, and they flashed a stat that he was 1 for 2, missing from 42 and hitting from 20. Uh, geniuses...he hit a 55-yarder, what game are you watching?

 

If I heard 'Steven Gilmore' one more time....How hard is it for the broadcasters to know the names of the damn players??

 

The graphics were annoying as hell too. The players would be lining up and graphics that took up the bottom half of the screen would still be up...

[CSBill]

This is always the best thread to give your personal observations of the game. Thanks again, Bill.

 

My observations:

 

1] After two games, the MVP of this team and biggest difference is Mike Pettine. I think we have to give some credit to Marrone and Brandon for getting him. On defense especially, you need talent, scheme, and play calling (knowing when to pressure and rts when not to). Play-calling on defense is highly underrated. And Pettine called a terrific game. I only had one problem with him, backing off the pressure with 2 minutes left in the first half. But Pettine is a very, very good coach. We will be lucky to have him for two years.

 

2] EJ missed a lot of passes. No question. He must be better. He really only had the one good drive. But I'm not worried about that long term. He did a lot of good things. How confident he is, and his leadership is off the charts for a rookie, especially on a team like the Bills. The composure he shows is extraordinary. He missed at least five passes he needs to hit though. His stats look WAY better than he played. The fumble I don't blame him for but the INT was terrible and he missed at least four passes he needs to hit.

 

3] TJ Graham stinks. He's woefully bad. The INT was a terrible pass by EJ but if TJ just came back for the ball it would have been an INC and not an INT.

 

4] Kiko and Woods are flat terrific players and draft picks. I'm not sure whether it was Buddy or Brandon or Whaley or a combination of the three, but turning the #8 pick into EJ and Kiko was brilliant. Woods is one of the most polished rookie WR I have ever seen. He's everything expected and more. Graham stinks, but if Goodwin or Easley become a reliable deep threat, this offense has tremendous potential with EJ, CJ, and FJ.

 

5] The Aaron Williams penalty was criminally stupid and unconscionable. He actually looks decent as a safety, way better than I imagined. But the stupidity of that play gives me serious worry.

 

6] It almost seems impossible to fathom but I'm not sure Mario's 4.5 sacks fully exhibits what a great game he had.

 

7] Fred Ex still has it and is still a huge part of this team.

 

8] I really liked both the play calling and the play design of Hackett, especially the final TD which was brilliant. I assume that EJ is still a little hampered in the knee so they don't want to run him much and will later. I was wrong when I thought, according to EJ and Marrone that Manuel was 100% in the Patsie game. He wasn't.

 

9] Justin Rogers and Jim Leonhard still stink overall even though they have made some singularly good plays. Nickell Robey actually looks good. I'm not sure specifically what Donny Henderson has done but he seems like he has done a terrific job.

 

10] Kyle Williams was a stud the whole game, the best game he has played in two years IMO.

 

11] Marcus Easley needs to be on the field ahead of TJ Graham. Easley is a playmaker, or could be.

 

12] I still can't say enough about EJ as a leader and a face of the franchise and as quarterback of this team. He missed five easy passes he needs to hit. But he's impressive as hell.

 

Concerning this thought, #11: "Marcus Easley needs to be on the field ahead of TJ Graham. Easley is a playmaker, or could be." I agree, and I would add Hogan, did you notice he was on the field on the winning score. I hope both he and Easley see the field more, Easley is a big and fast target, and Hogan was open all pre-season

[Fixxxer]

2.) Kiko - what pick...DROY?

 

Barring injury, I can see him being a top 3 finalist, at least.

 

6.) Brown - we need a LG badly.

 

I'm a ball follower during the game unless it's a really bad play, can you give examples of him struggling today? I really didn't notice him.

 

7.) FJ - this is all you need to know (heads up play by a smart player)

 

Fred Jackson ‏@Fred22Jackson 2m

Everyone asking. Yes, that was an intentionally drop on 2 min drive. Can't get tackled there and have clock run.

 

Fred is awesome.

[CodeMonkey]

Was it just me, or did I see SJ13's left foot twist and slip a little on the final catch. My heart stopped

.

[thewildrabbit]

EJ showed us today he can be the QB we have all been waiting for. FJax is a beast. Kiko & KW both played great.

 

Gotta love what Pettine has done with this defense

[boyst]

You're one of my favorite posters lately but you're nuts on this one for three reasons.

 

1] late in the game, on third down and long, on a pass that is 10 yards over his head, that is NOT the time to send a message. Early in the game, maybe. Second down, maybe. Ahead by 10 points, maybe. When he did it was an insanely bad play. It's the equivalent of EJ's fumble or INT.

 

2] it was 3-4 yards out of bounds. There is ZERO chance that is not a penalty. It's not as if it was close and he couldn't stop. It was the other side of the white sideline marker. It wasn't even close.

 

3] He shoved him, he didn't smack him. It wasn't even a hit. It would not in any way imaginable discourage a player from catching a ball. It was a B word slap at the very best. It would be WAY different if Williams blistered him and hurt him. It was a kitty shove and barely felt.

The replay I saw it looked like he was on the hash. It was a boneheaded penalty and was late in the game. If we lost I'd feel different, I promise.

[Reed83HOF]

I'm a ball follower during the game unless it's a really bad play, can you give examples of him struggling today? I really didn't notice him.

 

I meant to say TE and point to Chandler. I originally was going to mention that I didn't notice Brown too much today as opposed to last week; but changed my mind and forgot to edit that point all of the way and hopped onto the next point.

[maddenboy]

4] Kiko and Woods are flat terrific players and draft picks. I'm not sure whether it was Buddy or Brandon or Whaley or a combination of the three, but turning the #8 pick into EJ and Kiko was brilliant. Woods is one of the most polished rookie WR I have ever seen. He's everything expected and more. Graham stinks, but if Goodwin or Easley become a reliable deep threat, this offense has tremendous potential with EJ, CJ, and FJ.

 

 

Uh, based on my Sig, from March, I totally disagree.

 

 

(Life is pretty good, right about now)

Edited September 15, 2013 by maddenboy

[Dan]

 

You're one of my favorite posters lately but you're nuts on this one for three reasons.

 

1] late in the game, on third down and long, on a pass that is 10 yards over his head, that is NOT the time to send a message. Early in the game, maybe. Second down, maybe. Ahead by 10 points, maybe. When he did it was an insanely bad play. It's the equivalent of EJ's fumble or INT.

 

2] it was 3-4 yards out of bounds. There is ZERO chance that is not a penalty. It's not as if it was close and he couldn't stop. It was the other side of the white sideline marker. It wasn't even close.

 

3] He shoved him, he didn't smack him. It wasn't even a hit. It would not in any way imaginable discourage a player from catching a ball. It was a B word slap at the very best. It would be WAY different if Williams blistered him and hurt him. It was a kitty shove and barely felt.

I'm gonna disagree with you. At that point in the game, it was still very close. It was anyone's game. We were gaining momentum and the defense was setting the tone. We weren't rolling over today. The Panthers were going to have to fight for every inch.

 

Yes, I agree, it was definitely a penalty and he needs to be aware of where he is in the field. But, for a team needing an identity, I can live with it once or twice this early season.

 

It looked harder to me than just than just a shove. But, I could easily be wrong. Either way, I'm glad we got a safety playing with some fire and passion out there.

[BuffaloBill]

5. I was more upset with the two fades that were called from the Carolina 2 yard line. That is Fred Jackson territory. Was happy to see him get the ball from there on the next possession. Result? TD!

 

Amen but I am not going to nitpick over a victory. Fred is clearly a leader on this team.

 

Lost in the shuffle of the win is that the Bills D overall was stout. This game could have been a runaway had the D not held up more than their fair share.

 

[TPS]

I dont think anyone mentioned him yet, but Moats had another solid game.

[Kelly the Dog]

 

I'm gonna disagree with you. At that point in the game, it was still very close. It was anyone's game. We were gaining momentum and the defense was setting the tone. We weren't rolling over today. The Panthers were going to have to fight for every inch.

 

Yes, I agree, it was definitely a penalty and he needs to be aware of where he is in the field. But, for a team needing an identity, I can live with it once or twice this early season.

 

It looked harder to me than just than just a shove. But, I could easily be wrong. Either way, I'm glad we got a safety playing with some fire and passion out there.

The most important element of this was that it was third and long and WAY out of bounds! How anyone can argue that's a time to send a message is insane. There was ZERO chance of a completion, and we were down, late in the fourth quarter!! That's 100% textbook, inarguable NOT the time to send a message. I think if you look at it again you can see that it was not only WAY out of bounds but not a big hit. It was a shove. That makes a receiver pissed it doesn't make them scared to go over the middle.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

I believe that this hasn't been mentioned yet:

 

Just before leading the offense out for what would be the game-winning drive, the network camera caught EJ rallying the troops on the sidelines, exhorting them and giving everyone skins.

 

You could see that there was a tangible vibe going on.

[BRH]

As for AW, us old-timers (sort of) remember Leonard Smith. 46 hit hard, early, late and often and though there were times I wished he would have played the ball and not the man, he definitely had receivers hearing footsteps. That's the kind of safety you need. It was a dumb and costly play but you know what? Given the dumb and costly plays this team has made over the years that didn't even get the other guy's jersey dirty, I can live with it once in awhile.

[San Jose Bills Fan]

Agree with Kelly 100%.

 

Williams' actions were completely indefensible.

 

Those arguing that the defense needs to "send a message" and "show an attitude" are way off. The message that Williams sent was that he can't clearly understand situational football.

 

As Kelly already pointed out, there would have been dozens of better ways to "send a message" and "show an attitude" if physical intimidation is the goal.

 

What Williams did wouldn't intimidate anyone.

 

As for AW, us old-timers (sort of) remember Leonard Smith. 46 hit hard, early, late and often and though there were times I wished he would have played the ball and not the man, he definitely had receivers hearing footsteps. That's the kind of safety you need. It was a dumb and costly play but you know what? Given the dumb and costly plays this team has made over the years that didn't even get the other guy's jersey dirty, I can live with it once in awhile.

 

This argument would actually have some merit if what Williams did was actually intimidating.

 

He didn't even hit the intended receiver hard.

[voodoo poonani]

First off, the numbers:

1) First Downs: Car – 25; Buf – 24

2) Third Down Efficiency: Car – 7/16 = 43%; Buf – 6/14 = 42%

3) Total Net Yards: Car – 308; Buf – 436

4) Penalties: Car – 3 for 30 yards; Buf – 7 for 55 yards

5) Turnovers: Car – 1 INT; Buf – 1 INT and 1 Fumble

6) Red Zone Efficiency: Car – 1/3 = 33%; Buf – 2/3 = 67%

7) Time of Possession: Car – 33:41; Buf – 26:19

I think most things have already been covered by some good posts, so apologies if I repeat something. My thoughts:

1) We really need to get a handle on these penalties. Boneheaded plays gave the Panthers the ball and were essentially turnovers. I was also disappointed in some no calls (there was plenty of holding of receivers and DL).

2) Our offensive play calling still puzzles me. 3^rd and long and you through down the LOS to Chandler? Lots of garbage dump offs.

3) Hopefully with more practice EJ can improve his intermediate and deep pass accuracy. Also needs to improve timing routes, touch passes, pocket presence, progressions, and not staring down his receivers.

4) Hurry up needs to slow down. Second week, and the D looked gassed again. We’re still losing the time of possession battle. Poor clock management at the end of the first half.

5) Biggest off season addition: Mike Pettine.

To borrow from Stephen Colbert:

6) Tip of the Hat:

a. Leodis McKelvin: I wanted you to prove it against someone like Steve Smith and you did, so Kudos!

b. Kiko Alonso: This guy will be a stud! Correction, this guy is a stud! Nine tackles and an interception for his second game.

c. Mario Williams: Super Mario showed up! Kept Cam Newton bottled up and had 4.5 sacks. Great Job!

d. Kyle Williams: Not big in the stat sheet but provided lots of pressure throughout the game.

e. EJ Manuel: An uninspiring game at the beginning, missed some wide open receivers, lots of check down throws, but the Rookie came right down the field with a minute and a half and won the game. We’ve been lacking that for a long time.

7) Wag of the Finger:

a. Aaron Williams: Great game but a boneheaded play with late hit out of bounds to give the Panthers the ball back.

b. Frank Summers: A couple great catch and runs but a penalty on 4

^th

down gave the Panthers the ball back. Poor blocking allowed Manuel to be strip sacked.

c. Scott Chandler: For someone who our QBs have come to rely on as sure handed had some miscues. A few short passes that he made go absolutely nowhere. Also blew up a run play essentially blocking Spiller instead of blocking for him.

Edited September 15, 2013 by voodoo poonani

[Astrobot]

1. EJ Manuel is the 5th QB since 1960 to have a 4th quarter comeback in either the 1st or 2nd game of his career.
   
2. Stevie was wearing a mike during the game, so that should be fun to hear.
   
3. Bills OL yielded just one sack (Mikell).
   
4. Newton 183 pass, Manuel 287. Newton 15 rush, Manuel 13. Newton 1 for 3 in the red zone, Manuel 2 for 3 including game winner. Manuel Out-Cammed Cam.
   
5. J-Gun Offense: CJ 6.4 ypc, 103 yds; EJ 27 for 39 for 296 1 td; SJ 111 yds 1 td; FJ 1 td.
   
6. Pettine Zoo: Williams, Williams, and Williams had 24 tackles combined; Kiko-Searcy-Moats added 25 more.
   
7. Mario has arrived. Beat Bruuuuce's single-game sack record with 4.5.
   
8. D kept Deangelo to 5 carries 4 yards, 1 carry for 8 yards. Now he's 7 for 22.
   
9. Ramping my DraftTek positional needs for TE up to second-highest priority. Also Searcy forces S up as well.
   
10. Justin Rodgers. awful. He's the reason I am keeping CB as our P1 need, and adding a Multiple setting that triggers in RD4.
    
11. I was wrong about Alan Branch. He's gumming up the middle quite well.
    

[Dan]

 

The most important element of this was that it was third and long and WAY out of bounds! How anyone can argue that's a time to send a message is insane. There was ZERO chance of a completion, and we were down, late in the fourth quarter!! That's 100% textbook, inarguable NOT the time to send a message. I think if you look at it again you can see that it was not only WAY out of bounds but not a big hit. It was a shove. That makes a receiver pissed it doesn't make them scared to go over the middle.

I'm not disagreeing that it was a stupid penalty, but actually the play happened late in the 3rd quarter with the game tied at 14. It was the drive right after our score and 2pt conversion. In other words, prime time when the Bills D has historically laid down and let the other team run right back down the field and score to take the lead right back.

 

This team needs an identity. It needs some leaders. It needs to show they want to win. It needs players to step up and impose their will on other teams. That's what they did today. And it started in the 3rd quarter, and for me.. that play was part of it. The defense was flying around the field hitting every one on that series.

 

Agreed, its not the type of play we need to see all the time, but for me, watching this team play soft for so many years... it was nice to see them finally look like they actually wanted to win out there. So, in this instance, I didn't have a problem with it.

[Coach Tuesday]

As always Bill, great work with the thread. My observations:

 

1) Dareus continues to play at a near-Pro Bowl level. He takes a lot of unnecessary heat on this board. He's a baller.

 

2) Moats - this guy is a surviver. He has switched positions like 18 times over his bungled career here and has finally morphed into a very solid contributor.

 

3) Carrington, on the other hand, disappoints me. I'm not sure what he's being asked to do - perhaps he's playing the traditional 3-4 LDE role where he's being asked to tie up blockers and not much else. I just don't see the explosion and playmaking ability I was expecting from him this year.

 

4) Justin Rogers does not belong on an NFL roster. Putting aside getting toasted because he was watching Cam like he was in the stands, he also is absolutely horrible in run support. I despise him.

 

5) Graham is not a football player. He does not fight, as a blocker or a receiver. Easley, by contrast, fights like mad whenever he is on the field and is one of the better blocking WRs in the entire league. I don't know what is going on in practice but eventually they need to make the switch. Just imagine having Woods, Stevie and Easley on the field together. It's baffling to me that it hasn't happened yet.

 

6) Is Gragg hurt? This team needs a TE playmaker sooooo badly... time to get him on the field.

 

7) I don't know what it is but the special teams kick and punt return units just don't look organized or confident to me. Not sure if the problem is the coaching but it's something to keep an eye on.

 

8) Lots has been said about Pettine and rightfully so. Makes me hate Wanny even more, seeing how simple it is to just switch things up a bit with these good players in the front seven. On one play, Mario faked like he was dropping into a zone blitz, then rushed Cam; Cam was so confused watching Mario that he didn't see the DB blitzing from the other side and it resulted in a negative play for the offense. It's the little things - attacking the ball, disguising where the attack is coming from.

 

9) I can't wait for the Jets game. Should be a real war.