The Affordable Care Act is Coming Home to Roost

[Nanker]

You know BO is toast when James Carville says on MSLSD that B O should smoke Toronto's mayor's crack pipe.

There is no more clear indication that the king is dead and Hillary's quest for the Oval Office has begun. The Ragin' Cajun willingness to stomp on the imposter's throat in public was as clear a sign as you'll ever see.

Edited November 13, 2013 by Nanker

[DC Tom]

I think the fact that Obama is the fraud that some of us called out in 2007(not me, I actually believed for a time that he had a chance to be great), is only the minor story. Make no mistake: it's a story, and it's a story that will have a huge impact in terms of trusting the media to do it's job, and trusting the DNC to do it's job.

 

However, I think the bigger story is: the death of activist government. Liberals/Progressives/whatever: they have finally killed their own baby. I've been telling them they were going to do it since 2006 on this board. Sure enough, they have.

 

You can't combine that much arrogance with that much ingorance and not have this result.

 

Liberal bloggers/columnists have all touched this issue at some point over the last 4 years. Most have barely grazed it. Some, like in my "What if Obama can't lead" have come closer. One that I recall specifically said that Obama has a very real chance of killing activist government for a generation.

 

That is the story here. And, this guy: A liberal professor at Princeton gets it, sorta. I'm starting a thread on that article, btw.

 

Many of them are seeing the writing on the wall: If they ever try to pass another behemoth Obamacare law, Obamacare will be the chief piece of evidence used to oppose it.

 

And, it's bigger still, in that sooner rather than later, now, we are going to have to reform SSI/Medicare/Medicaid, and, the context of that discussion will be massively influenced by the failure that is Obamacare.

 

All self-delusion aside, they have to somewhat know they are now screwed in terms of the 30k foot level discussion of domestic policy.

 

Everything they say, on every issue, every time they say it, will be put into the context of Obamcare.

 

This is one of the most blindly stupid things you've ever posted in a career of posting the blindly stupid.

[IDBillzFan]

Bill Clinton: Obama Should Honor His ‘You Can Keep Your Plan’ Promise

 

This surprises me. Thought it probably shouldn't. Once Bubba realized Obama's team dropped the race card on Hillary's last run, he has probably been sitting around quietly waiting for a chance to rock Obama's boat.

 

The interesting thing is that now Obama CAN'T reverse course and change his lie to a promise kept because it'll look like he's taking advice from Clinton, and everyone knows Obama is more interested in how he looks than how he governs.

[OCinBuffalo]

This is one of the most blindly stupid things you've ever posted in a career of posting the blindly stupid.

How so?

 

Do you want me to list all of the liberal blogs I've read over the last year that specifically address or at least touch on this very issue?

 

Are you saying they don't exist?

 

Please say that. I haven't owned you in so long, I actually think it might be amusing again.

 

EDIT:

Another way to look at it: 3.5.

 

We say 3.5 here, don't we? Why do we do that? How did that come to pass? What does it mean when we say that? What thoughts does it invoke?

 

You don't think that Obamacare can easily turn into 3.5? Of course it can. It can do it on a national stage with relative ease.

 

That's what I'm saying, and you are calling it stupid, when you have an immediate example, right under you nose, on this very board, of that not being the case?

 

Are you saying you don't believe in 3.5? If so, then that is THE biggest story of the year, bar none!

Edited November 12, 2013 by OCinBuffalo

[B-Man]

HOPEY-CHANGEY: USA Today: ObamaCare Options Grim For Young People.

 

 

 

 

 

CAUGHT IN A CONTRADICTION: Obamacare Bureaucracy’s Definition of ‘Enroll’ Not the Same as the White House’s Definition of ‘Enroll.’

 

“So according to CMS, a person is not enrolled until they have paid.

 

The health insurance industry also does not count someone as enrolled until they pay.

 

The Obama White House, though, will report people who have dropped a healthcare plan into their exchange shopping cart, but not paid, as also enrolled.”

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

.

[DC Tom]

How so?

 

Because the standard response to this won't be "the death of activist government." It'll be "This is what happens when you try to compromise on activist government."

 

"Blindly," because the merest shred of common sense should tell you that. "Stupid" because the very link you provided says that.

 

While it is true that the perfect should not be the enemy of the good in American politics, it is also true that sometimes a fight for the perfect is one worth having and could produce results that only strengthen the case for more.

[IDBillzFan]

The Obama White House, though, will report people who have dropped a healthcare plan into their exchange shopping cart, but not paid, as also enrolled.”

 

 

Years ago I worked for a projector manufacturer that shipped product to its vendors -- even though the vendors didn't place an order -- so they could show the bank/lenders billables that didn't exist.

 

The manufacturer was gone about two years later.

 

But I'm certain this effort by the WH will end differently.

Edited November 12, 2013 by LABillzFan

[Koko78]

There are no alternatives now. B. O. Is between Barack and a hard place. Which is to say his endless stream of **** has caught up his his azz and no one - not even Putin is throwing him a lifeline. He's drowning in his own **** and it's entirely his own doing. He's the least effective Chief Executive the nation has ever had. He was totally overmatched for the problems facing the country. We needed a leader and what we got was the captain of the varsity golfing team and JV basketball team. Oh, and he was on the debating team too. After all, he's not entirely without qualifications for the job of Pontificator in Chief.

 

He's a 24 carat gold plated phony participation trophy of a person.

Why do you hate black people?

[Nanker]

 

Why do you hate black people?

I hate everybody.

[OCinBuffalo]

Because the standard response to this won't be "the death of activist government." It'll be "This is what happens when you try to compromise on activist government."

 

"Blindly," because the merest shred of common sense should tell you that. "Stupid" because the very link you provided says that.

You are missing the point my friend. You are living in the same delusion this guy is.

 

Cut it out. You're way better than that.

 

"Don't compromise on activist government" is the message that...the same people who thought McGovern was a good idea will take away. Remind me: what % of the country do they represent? How do they do in the context of the entire country? Not so well.

 

If anything, I WANT the far left to think that they should push for government-only solutions. I want them to go even futher to the left.

 

A stationary, easily identifiable target, is always the easiest to hit, at any range. Don't let them camoflague themselves with pretend embraces of the free market. Don't let them move around by pretending to be about results/solutions.

 

Nah, let them do exactly what this guy says, and do it as big as possible. Big targets are great for artillery.

 

Hell, let them nominate the Indian Princess Warren. Let her go out and attack business, every day, all the time, and suggest "pure governement" solutions to replace it.

 

I can't believe you don't see what I'm talking about. Or, I can't believe that you don't see it now.

[Joe Miner]

I like how people think that the actual problem with obamacare is the fact you can't keep your insurance or your doctor. And that in order to fix it, we just need another law that says you can keep them.

[DC Tom]

You are missing the point my friend. You are living in the same delusion this guy is.

 

Cut it out. You're way better than that.

 

"Don't compromise on activist government" is the message that...the same people who thought McGovern was a good idea will take away. Remind me: what % of the country do they represent? How do they do in the context of the entire country? Not so well.

 

If anything, I WANT the far left to think that they should push for government-only solutions. I want them to go even futher to the left.

 

A stationary, easily identifiable target, is always the easiest to hit, at any range. Don't let them camoflague themselves with pretend embraces of the free market. Don't let them move around by pretending to be about results/solutions.

 

Nah, let them do exactly what this guy says, and do it as big as possible. Big targets are great for artillery.

 

Hell, let them nominate the Indian Princess Warren. Let her go out and attack business, every day, all the time, and suggest "pure governement" solutions to replace it.

 

I can't believe you don't see what I'm talking about. Or, I can't believe that you don't see it now.

 

I saw what you were talking about from the start. And it's massively blindly stupid.

 

I like how people think that the actual problem with obamacare is the fact you can't keep your insurance or your doctor. And that in order to fix it, we just need another law that says you can keep them.

 

Which people? The general public? These would be the same people that can't understand that borrowing money means paying it back.

 

Or the elected officials? These would be the people that think the problem with the law is that it might lose them their seats in Congress in a year...and can't understand that borrowing money means paying it back...

[OCinBuffalo]

I like how people think that the actual problem with obamacare is the fact you can't keep your insurance or your doctor. And that in order to fix it, we just need another law that says you can keep them.

Yes, this represents the "cut the baby in half" solution.

 

Well, it does to the "just as committed as I am dopey" progressive who still can't fathom why the law s/he supports isn't working, primarily because s/he was never able to fathom the law in the first place.

 

So, it's "wrong".

 

From the libetarian perspective, nothing would be finer than having them pass that addendum, because it would virtually seal Obamcare's fate. The cost of allowing all these people to retain their doctors and plans, while also allowing all these new old/sick people FULL coverage, absolutely sinks the thing.

 

The truth is: covering the 58 year old, with pre-natal care, and drug counseling, and using that as an excuse for charging him more for his family insurance already sealed Obamacare's fate, the minute it was designed.

 

This is just the faster way it dies.

 

As many here have said all along: they have to kick middle class people off their plans today, so that they can pay for sick people tomorrow, and they will pay for that by, charging the middle class 2x what it was paying. Yeah, the middle class. This time "the rich" get a pass. The only way they justify it? Giving you coverage you don't need, telling you that your doctor was overcharging you, and so was the insurance company.

 

Does it matter than all of this was a lie?

 

Forward!

 

I saw what you were talking about from the start. And it's massively blindly stupid.

No it isn't.

 

It's simply logic

 

Who in their right mind, in the center-left, center, center-right, far-right, is going to come away from this thinking: "well, ok, next time we'll only sign up for a wildly massive, poorly designed government system...provided that it's a "pure government" system"?

 

Maybe 20% of the country has your takeaway. That means 80% does not.

 

That's the stupid here Tom. That's the wishcasting: that somehow the majority of the electorate isn't going to refuse to support the next Obamacare, or, that somehow they aren't going to remember Obamacare, when it comes to SSI/Medicare/Medicaid/Immigration reform.

 

You're an unmitigated moron if you can't see that. This isn't some DoD massive spending boondoggle, which we can't know anything about, and only judge based on whether we see it go boom/kick some ass on TV.

 

No. This is something that effects every person, and it's failing, miserably.

 

And the real thing here is: who wants to be 3.5 guy? The minute you bring that up, everybody says, "well, I might have had some dumb posts, but, at least I'm not that guy".

 

Who wants to be, right now, an Obama voter? You can bet they will be made fun of mercilessly going forward, especially on the internet. That's the price you pay.

 

So, now, remind, me...how is the very word Obamacare, causing these people to cringe, not the stimulus I say it is?

 

Rush Limbaugh was able to use the word "liberal" as such a weapon, that they changed their name.

 

Are you telling me Obamacare, which is infinitely more insidious, won't be the most deadly weapn they've ever seen. Are you telling me it won't hurt to be hit with it?

Edited November 12, 2013 by OCinBuffalo

[Jauronimo]

Because the standard response to this won't be "the death of activist government." It'll be "This is what happens when you try to compromise on activist government."

 

"Blindly," because the merest shred of common sense should tell you that. "Stupid" because the very link you provided says that.

Correct. The problem isn't bad legislation, its that the bill was always a compromise between the purely benevolent single payer system and the obstructionist republican status quo and doomed to fail. It doesn't matter that the ACA was passed without any republican votes. Thats a moot point. The solution is clear. Double down on the problem.

[OCinBuffalo]

Correct. The problem isn't bad legislation, its that the bill was always a compromise between the purely benevolent single payer system and the obstructionist republican status quo and doomed to fail. It doesn't matter that the ACA was passed without any republican votes. Thats a moot point. The solution is clear. Double down on the problem.

I get that this is the new argument from progessives.

 

I don't get why in the 9 hells anybody, including Tom, thinks it's going to work.

 

This isn't the IRS scandal. This is about real people really losing their plans/paying more.

 

And, we haven't even begun the small business fiasco yet.

 

Need I remind what % of country works for small business?

[Jauronimo]

I get that this is the new argument from progessives.

 

I don't get why in the 9 hells anybody, including Tom, thinks it's going to work.

 

This isn't the IRS scandal. This is about real people really losing their plans/paying more.

 

And, we haven't even begun the small business fiasco yet.

 

Need I remind what % of country works for small business?

Half the country thought they were basically going to receive free healthcare. Why wouldn't they believe this?

[OCinBuffalo]

Half the country thought they were basically going to receive free healthcare. Why wouldn't they believe this?

Perhaps, but, how many of those are now paying 2x for what they thought they were getting for free?

 

"Believe" is one thing, and I get it: just look at the Global Warming clowns.

 

However, being confronted with the bill is quite another.

 

Also, I don't believe only white people are being forced to pay 2x what they were, for things that they don't need. Pretty sure this effects everybody.

 

We'll see how long the D's "Demographics" Fairy Godmother holds up in the face of taking money from middle class blacks/hispanics/women.

 

That's the real thing here: women. You think the same Obama-supporting, now screwed by Obamacare woman is ever gonna look at Big Government the same way?

 

Well, in your experience, how likely are women to just forget when you've done something wrong? How many years exactly do they tend to retain that info? How accurate are the details surrounding the event, and how amazed are you that they can remember them all?

[Jauronimo]

Perhaps, but, how many of those are now paying 2x for what they thought they were getting for free?

 

"Believe" is one thing, and I get it: just look at the Global Warming clowns.

 

However, being confronted with the bill is quite another.

 

Also, I don't believe only white people are being forced to pay 2x what they were, for things that they don't need. Pretty sure this effects everybody.

 

We'll see how long the D's "Demographics" Fairy Godmother holds up in the face of taking money from middle class blacks/hispanics/women.

 

That's the real thing here: women. You think the same Obama-supporting, now screwed by Obamacare woman is ever gonna look at Big Government the same way?

 

Well, in your experience, how likely are women to just forget when you've done something wrong? How many years exactly do they tend to retain that info? How accurate are the details surrounding the event, and how amazed are you that they can remember them all?

Have you ever known a woman to admit that she was wrong and then choose an appropriate course of action? I've only known them to realize that they're completely wrong, get pissed off at me because they are wrong, become even more entrenched because it was wrong of me to prove them wrong, and then carry on down the same doomed path just to spite me.

[DC Tom]

I don't get why in the 9 hells anybody, including Tom, thinks it's going to work.

 

Uh...because people relate more to identity politics than they do their own needs? Because we have almost two generations now that have grown up believing that the government is the source of their rights, and they don't have to be responsible for them? Because people are idiots?

 

I want to know what world you're living in where everyone you know thinks rationally. It sure as !@#$ isn't this one...if it were, we wouldn't be Bills fans.

[Chef Jim]

We just had a meeting with our company's CEO with regard to the changes to our insurance plan for our employees for next year. All I have to say about this is good job Obama and all the Dems that voted for this ****.

 

Our insurance broker said our increase is light compared so some. He's see company health insurance costs go up by as much as 87%. Yeah, this is going to be great for the country.