Peace Frog Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Penaties, turnovers, and not converting on 3rd down.
dollars 2 donuts Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) Pick three! Sorry, I only picked one before I knew I could pick three! I picked EJ being handcuffed. As far as I'm concerned it is incredible to think that against a poor pass defense EJ threw only 27 passes. I have absolutely no problems with the no huddle. What I do have a problem with is playing it safe with the no huddle out of fear of Brady. Of course you run the ball sometimes, but did anyone on the coaching staff really think that, of all things, NE's front 7 had gotten worse since last season and was worth exploiting? Edited September 10, 2013 by dollars 2 donuts
uncle flap Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Gee thanks, Captain Obvious! You are no fun. What, next are you gonna mention that they started a a rookie QB that didn't even have a complete preseason, and that most here didn't even give the Bills a chance to compete in this game? Or are you gonna bring up that even the veterans were playing completely new offensive and defensive schemes? Or that Marrone was making his debut against the best coach in the game for the last decade? No, you have to bring up obvious, positive points, and undercut all the fun for the negative creeps that hang out on this board. I'm gonna talk to the mods about banning you. My mistake!
JohnnyBuffalo Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Penalties by far number one. Too many self inflicted problems that cost conversions and ball control. CJ being shut down, but not just on CJ's shoulders...this is on the plays designed to get him the ball and the execution of those plays and lastly he looked like he was forcing too much. Lastly and pretty much always a theme third down conversions. The only way to have a stout D stay stout an entire game is to have them not play 1.5 games each outing. You give the opposition the chance to run the most offensive plays of the weekend....guess what your D will break down in key late game drives. Offense needs to convert and stay on the field....even more so with hurry up! Ok I am off the soap box, but man I need to vent!
The Wiz Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Again. Break it down. It comes out to 26 seconds. That's if you want to argue facts alone. Rather, what you're supporting is a play-not-to-lose strategy, at home, week one, against a division rival. No thanks. Actually I'm supporting a play-to-win strategy like every other team does late in the 4th qtr with a slim lead. Keep the ball, kill the clock, convert 3rd downs.
chris heff Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Penalties, turnovers,and the inability to convert third downs. In that order. How many drives were killed by penalties? You can't give Brady a short field. You can't give Brady more possessions.
DallasBillsFan1 Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Also, 3 and Outs, too many of them (which I guess is third down conversions)
Orton's Arm Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 I'm surprised by the lack of Manuel being held back votes This is a passing league, let your QB do his job We're talking about a rookie QB in his very first start, going up against a Belichick defense. Manuel had also missed significant practice time due to an injury. And it's not as though Manuel ran the world's most complex offense in college. The coaches made the decision to keep the offense simple--to keep the training wheels on. Maybe that was the wrong call. But they know a lot more about Manuel and his development than I do. If he wasn't ready for something more complex--and he may well not have been--then keeping the training wheels on probably gave the team its best possible chance to win. If you want to fault some aspect of the coaching, start with the coaching staff's failure to play to Spiller's strengths, or put him in a position to succeed.
Maury Ballstein Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 Sj drop/Goodwin fumble (demote for Easley please Goodwin and graham)/spiller fumble
Cash Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 I picked Inability to convert 3rd downs and Penalties, and I'm writing in for Inability to stop the run as my #3. Shane Vereen is the only RB in the league with a 100-yard performance, and he didn't even start. Apparently Marrone made an excuse in the postgame press conference that we "held" the Patriots to 4.5 yards a carry, as though that's something to be proud of. Not quite as bad as Pos saying "we imposed our will" after giving up 300 yards on the ground (to the Jets, I think?), but still not what I want to hear. Actually I'm supporting a play-to-win strategy like every other team does late in the 4th qtr with a slim lead. Keep the ball, kill the clock, convert 3rd downs. Honest question: do you think the offense would have converted additional 3rd downs by playing slow? Because I don't. The problem, to me, was just bad offense, not fast offense. I did vote for 3rd-down conversions up top, but in fairness, a lot of those were 3rd and long after 2 terrible plays. That's not so much "Inability to convert 3rd downs" as it is "Bad offense". Now, if slowing things down would have improved the offense, then I'm all for it, but I don't buy it at face value that huddling up will gain us extra yards.
timba Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 I went with: Inability to convert 3rd downs, Penalties, and Turnovers. I believe untimely penalties and drops were the largest causes of this loss. I counted 5 first downs nullified due to those reasons. That is significant, especially when seeing the Bills converted 15 total first downs in the game. Of course, turning the ball over in your own end is also a fast way to give a game away.
The Wiz Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 (edited) Honest question: do you think the offense would have converted additional 3rd downs by playing slow? Because I don't. The problem, to me, was just bad offense, not fast offense. I did vote for 3rd-down conversions up top, but in fairness, a lot of those were 3rd and long after 2 terrible plays. That's not so much "Inability to convert 3rd downs" as it is "Bad offense". Now, if slowing things down would have improved the offense, then I'm all for it, but I don't buy it at face value that huddling up will gain us extra yards. No I don't think they would have gained more yards by huddling up. As I said before that comment, you give Brady the ball with a minute left and he will find a way to win if they are within a TD. I agree with you it was more bad offense than their 3rd down % and poorly timed penalties. Though I do believe there was a correlation with the the 3rd downs and penalties. I can think of 3 that stopped them from converting(not at the end, just throughout the game). Edited September 10, 2013 by The Wiz
Cash Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 No I don't think they would have gained more yards by huddling up. As I said before that comment, you give Brady the ball with a minute left and he will find a way to win if they are within a TD. I agree with you it was more bad offense than their 3rd down % and poorly timed penalties. Though I do believe there was a correlation with the the 3rd downs and penalties. I can think of 3 that stopped them from converting(not at the end, just throughout the game). It definitely seemed that way watching it live. I think moreso than any penalty, the play that killed me the most was Chandler's drop of a 30+ yard completion. We'd have been approaching midfield with at least a chance to pin them back against their own goal line, if not score. Instead, it's punt from our own endzone time.
Prickly Pete Posted September 10, 2013 Posted September 10, 2013 We're talking about a rookie QB in his very first start, going up against a Belichick defense. Manuel had also missed significant practice time due to an injury. And it's not as though Manuel ran the world's most complex offense in college. The coaches made the decision to keep the offense simple--to keep the training wheels on. Maybe that was the wrong call. But they know a lot more about Manuel and his development than I do. If he wasn't ready for something more complex--and he may well not have been--then keeping the training wheels on probably gave the team its best possible chance to win. I can't believe that people need this explained to them. Have people gone back and looked at the debuts of some of the greatest rookie prospects? Give the coaching staff and the QB a chance to at least see where they stand. It would have been foolish to take the reins off, when they were playing in a such a close game, and with a lead no less. That game got away, but Manuel had no turnovers, and seemed to be able to handle everything he was asked to do. Now they can ask a bit more from him.
BillsFan-4-Ever Posted September 11, 2013 Posted September 11, 2013 Up until the last drive they did. 9/18. Pats* were 11/20 on the day. those are the ones that hurt the most
/dev/null Posted September 11, 2013 Posted September 11, 2013 I only picked two, turnovers and Spiller being shut down, because the third reason wasn't listed...defense rolled over when it matters That, plus lack of Tebow
Spun Posted September 11, 2013 Posted September 11, 2013 I picked inability to convert on third downs, penalties and play calling. Stevie's drop was part of the third down failures and the play calling had a lot to do with Spiller not getting room. If I was an opposing coach I would have also keyed on Spiller. Maybe they should have used Spiller more as a decoy in the first half or until the pursuit of Spiller loosened up. Brady was going to score sooner or later. So many concerns! For a while, the defense uncharacteristically sent the Pats off after three downs. But by the time the last series came around, the defense was gassed and Brady simply punished. The time of possession: Pats: 37:43 and the Bills: 22:17. Blame part of that on the no-huddle. But just like "recent" years, the Bills offense couldn't stay on the field when they needed to and the defense couldn't exit when they needed to (third downs). Onward and better!!!
RobT Posted September 11, 2013 Posted September 11, 2013 I only have two picks because several of our voting choices can be categorized under 'Coaching'. There was the crazy red-flag???; 2, count them 2, 12 men on the field penalties; The inability (or un-willingness) to adjust the game plan which is almost the same thing as having an ineffective 4 minute game plan. My second vote goes to Stevie's drop... Man we needed a first down bad, time to step up and be a leader on Sundays, not vocalize your greatness to the media Monday through Saturday... I understand Marrone wants to run a hurry-up offense and the concept has legitimate merit given the team's strengths. But I can't support any game plan that ends up giving Tom Brady almost 15 more minutes with the ball. Want the best chance to beat Brady, P. Manning, the elites? Keep them off the damn field... Re-watch Super Bowl 25 sometime... Also watch the Eagles - Redskins game from last night. The Eagles went nutz and were extremely successful running the hurry-up, but C. Kelly used the clock to his advantage after they got the lead, Granted it was a bigger lead than the Bills had at any point, but the concept of adjusting to the situation is my point. BTW does your head turn every time someone says 'Chip Kelly' on ESPN or NFL Network? Ohhh Chip Kelly.. All that said, with about 30 seconds left in the game I said 'I HOPE MARRONE LEARNS FROM THIS!! And I truly believe we will see a Rookie HC and QB grow up before our eyes this season...
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