Mario's contract is basically a 2 year deal

[3rdand12]

Some breasts lean. And as much as they may learn, they've certainly taught me a thing or two.

 

GO BILLS!!!

a keen eye you have for my subtle play.

Myself , i consider it a work of a lifetime to know intimately all i can get my hands on in this matter.

[NoSaint]

Lol .thanks . breasts learn not lean .

I hope you know my opinions change and i am full of errors. But i also am willing to learn.

We can truly hope that Mario "gets after it " this year. He has one shitton of potential and is in the right place at the right time with Pettine and the supporting cast. But i want him to change my mind . I cant accept yet that he is the best pass rusher we have . It was true last year as mentioned up stream , but it was by default.

Thank you again for being the gentleman WSS !

i expect alot more activity coming at opposing QBs this year from all over the field and that makes everyone look good : )

Go Bills!

 

I have to ask - who do you think the better rushers are? It seems to me Mario is the default best on the roster by a large amount, until proven otherwise.

[3rdand12]

I have to ask - who do you think the better rushers are? It seems to me Mario is the default best on the roster by a large amount, until proven otherwise.

Thats what i just said you fool.

But its a team game. I dont want to get into last years play by him any more. I watched every game as i imagine you did. if you were pleased with mario than we disagree.

but i am sure glad we dumped anderson.

let Pettine use Hughes and K williams and MD and bradham and lawson and Alonso and Moats and Blatnick and who ever he dials up.

yes by default he is. But i would expect him to lead by example this year and so far...............its not the pay at all its what he represents as potential, and he does not play up to his own abilities. thats not something i can look away from.

sorry Saint. i cant. i hate him.

Change my mind Mario please

evening gents. i need to hit the rack

ps I forgot someone very important gents. Alex Carrington.

and then my boy Troup and of course Branch. i must be tired

Edited August 6, 2013 by 3rdand12

[NoSaint]

Thats what i just said you fool.

But its a team game. I dont want to get into last years play by him any more. I watched every game as i imagine you did. if you were pleased with mario than we disagree.

but i am sure glad we dumped anderson.

let Pettine use Hughes and K williams and MD and bradham and lawson and Alonso and Moats and Blatnick and who ever he dials up.

yes by default he is. But i would expect him to lead by example this year and so far...............its not the pay at all its what he represents as potential, and he does not play up to his own abilities. thats not something i can look away from.

sorry Saint. i cant. i hate him.

Change my mind Mario please

evening gents. i need to hit the rack

ps I forgot someone very important gents. Alex Carrington.

and then my boy Troup and of course Branch. i must be tired

 

You said last year he was by default. I was saying the lack of pass rushers still on the roster means its remaining true unless we add a stud. I don't think I'd qualify many if any of the guys you listed as stud pass rushers. Lots of DTs, and ILBs and unknowns.... Well... I think you get the point. Real question - Mario has more sacks then the combined total of the rest of our top 5? 7? More?

 

I just don't get how you could be mad about his production but excited for Hughes. Or blatnick.

 

[Astrobot]

At the very least, Mario will make the entire DLine better. If they game plan for Mario, then sacks will be made by the others in large numbers. If they go 1:1 on Mario, he will have a Pro Bowl year. Our opponents can pick their poison.

[mitchmurraydowntown]

I hope Mario plays well, no excuses.

[BUNCH OF MULARKEY]

There is no fan base that works as hard as this one at inventing reasons to hate the team's best players.

 

There is no other player that is better at making excuses for not working hard. First the wrist. Then the ring. Now the mystery foot.

Can't wait to see what's next it's comical. Makes me cringe when the media interviews him.

Maybe I'm being too tough on this respected member of law enforcement.

[mitchmurraydowntown]

 

 

There is no other player that is better at making excuses for not working hard. First the wrist. Then the ring. Now the mystery foot.

Can't wait to see what's next it's comical. Makes me cringe when the media interviews him.

Maybe I'm being too tough on this respected member of law enforcement.

 

What we have here is a complete lack of respect for the law.

[Thurman#1]

Nothing whatsoever about Mario's contract makes it a two-year deal. The idea's ridiculous. If you want to make a deal that makes a guy easy to cut, you backload the contract, putting a couple of years at the end at a high salary that adds to the total value of the contract, and thereby strokes the player's ego. But those last two years the club knows are too expensive and the player will be cut before they pay that money.

 

Mario's deal, on the other hand, was front-loaded. The two most expensive years were the first two. Makes no sense to cut the guy now after the second year, none.

 

Here's the deal:

 

 

2012 actual money paid: $19 mill signing bonus, $100K workout bonus and $5.9 mill base salary = $25 million (guaranteed)

 

2013 actual money: $6.5 mill base salary plus $8 mill option bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $15 million (guaranteed)

 

In other words, after the first two years, they'll already have spent $40 mill in cash of the $96 - 100$ mill ... and after they've spent about 40% of the money in two years and have four years left on the deal for around 60%, averaging 15% per year, after that they're going to cut him? Why would they do that?

 

2014 actual money: $1.9 million base salary plus $10.6 million option bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $13 million

 

After paying him $40 mill in two years they would cut him before a season where they pay him $13 mill? Why?

 

2015 actual money: $12.1 mill base salary plus $1 mill roster bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $13.6 mill.

 

2016 actual money: $11.5 mill base salary plus $2.5 mill roster bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $14.5 mill

 

2017 actual money: $11.4 mill base salary plus $3.5 mill roster bonus plus no workout bonus = $14.9 mill

 

This leaves out $400K Pro Bowl incentives each year and $400K additional incentives each year, which would add up to $4.8 mill if he earned them all.

 

If Spotrac is right, if anything the contract is front-loaded, making it very likely that he'll stay through all of it as long as he plays as well as they expected.

 

http://www.spotrac.c....ario-williams/

 

Granted, all the guaranteed money will have been paid in the first two years, but that's the way it usually works out. This is a contract the Bills structured to make it reasonable to keep Mario for the whole length of the contract.

Edited August 6, 2013 by Thurman#1

[3rdand12]

What we have here is a complete lack of respect for the law.

thats funny.

 

You said last year he was by default. I was saying the lack of pass rushers still on the roster means its remaining true unless we add a stud. I don't think I'd qualify many if any of the guys you listed as stud pass rushers. Lots of DTs, and ILBs and unknowns.... Well... I think you get the point. Real question - Mario has more sacks then the combined total of the rest of our top 5? 7? More?

 

I just don't get how you could be mad about his production but excited for Hughes. Or blatnick.

i suppose because they are unknown quantities who are actually participating right now.

If i did not say it before i should now.

Just because i dont like his behaviour does not mean i dont have hope for him to make our defense better : )

[8-8 Forever?]

I think he sticks with the team for at least a couple more years. He is our best pass rusher, and I don't see him getting cut until they find someone to replace him.

If he is healthy, he will do damage. If he is always nicked up and can't play with it, then we got real problems and maybe we move on, especially if we lose out this year and get Jadaveon Clowney

[papazoid]

Nothing whatsoever about Mario's contract makes it a two-year deal. The idea's ridiculous. If you want to make a deal that makes a guy easy to cut, you backload the contract, putting a couple of years at the end at a high salary that adds to the total value of the contract, and thereby strokes the player's ego. But those last two years the club knows are too expensive and the player will be cut before they pay that money.

 

Mario's deal, on the other hand, was front-loaded. The two most expensive years were the first two. Makes no sense to cut the guy now after the second year, none.

 

Here's the deal:

 

 

2012 actual money paid: $19 mill signing bonus, $100K workout bonus and $5.9 mill base salary = $25 million (guaranteed)

 

2013 actual money: $6.5 mill base salary plus $8 mill option bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $15 million (guaranteed)

 

In other words, after the first two years, they'll already have spent $40 mill in cash of the $96 - 100$ mill ... and after they've spent about 40% of the money in two years and have four years left on the deal for around 60%, averaging 15% per year, after that they're going to cut him? Why would they do that?

 

2014 actual money: $1.9 million base salary plus $10.6 million option bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $13 million

 

After paying him $40 mill in two years they would cut him before a season where they pay him $13 mill? Why?

 

2015 actual money: $12.1 mill base salary plus $1 mill roster bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $13.6 mill.

 

2016 actual money: $11.5 mill base salary plus $2.5 mill roster bonus plus $500K workout bonus = $14.5 mill

 

2017 actual money: $11.4 mill base salary plus $3.5 mill roster bonus plus no workout bonus = $14.9 mill

 

This leaves out $400K Pro Bowl incentives each year and $400K additional incentives each year, which would add up to $4.8 mill if he earned them all.

 

If Spotrac is right, if anything the contract is front-loaded, making it very likely that he'll stay through all of it as long as he plays as well as they expected.

 

http://www.spotrac.c....ario-williams/

 

Granted, all the guaranteed money will have been paid in the first two years, but that's the way it usually works out. This is a contract the Bills structured to make it reasonable to keep Mario for the whole length of the contract.

 

 

why do some people insist on letting facts get in the way of a good story ?

[GG]

Granted, all the guaranteed money will have been paid in the first two years, but that's the way it usually works out. This is a contract the Bills structured to make it reasonable to keep Mario for the whole length of the contract.

 

In reality, it's more like a 3-yr deal. His cap hit in 2015 will be over $20 million. If Bills want to keep him, they'll have to restructure or cut him.

 

Deal cap hits

2012 - $9.1

2013 - $11.4

2014 - $9.6

2015 - $20.3

2016 - $21.2

2017 - $24.6

[papazoid]

 

 

In reality, it's more like a 3-yr deal. His cap hit in 2015 will be over $20 million. If Bills want to keep him, they'll have to restructure or cut him.

 

Deal cap hits

2012 - $9.1

2013 - $11.4

2014 - $9.6

2015 - $20.3

2016 - $21.2

2017 - $24.6

 

then your talking HUGE "dead money"...

 

assuming your cap numbers after 3 years are correct (which this site says they are NOT)

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/mario-williams/

 

this site also agrees with sportracs 2013 cap hit being $12.4

http://www.overthecap.com/teamcap.php?Team=Bills&Year=2013

 

$53 mil cash paid after 3 years

$30 mil Cap Hit taken after 3 years (your numbers)

$41 mil Cap Hit taken after 3 years (sport trac)

$12-23 mil in dead money needed to be taken in 2015 - 2016

Edited August 6, 2013 by papazoid

[RyanC883]

I think, what you're missing here, teams have to gamplan for him. It doesn't matter how pedestrian (if 10 sacks is pedestrian) he was last year. Teams still have to know where he is on the field at all times. As a defense, you want to dictate, and Mario only helps a defense do that.

 

Exactly. And 10 sacks, most of which were after his wrist was fixed, is no small number, esp. on a crappy D. Hopefully Marcell is back to form, which will take some pressure off Williams and unleash the duo everyone was hoping to see last year.

[1B4IDie]

 

 

In reality, it's more like a 3-yr deal. His cap hit in 2015 will be over $20 million. If Bills want to keep him, they'll have to restructure or cut him.

 

Deal cap hits

2012 - $9.1

2013 - $11.4

2014 - $9.6

2015 - $20.3

2016 - $21.2

2017 - $24.6

These numbers seem completely incorrect.

Where are you getting them?

[GG]

then your talking HUGE "dead money"...

 

assuming your cap numbers after 3 years are correct (which this site says they are NOT)

http://www.spotrac.c...mario-williams/

 

this site also agrees with sportracs 2013 cap hit being $12.4

http://www.overtheca...Bills&Year=2013

 

$53 mil cash paid after 3 years

$30 mil Cap Hit taken after 3 years (your numbers)

$41 mil Cap Hit taken after 3 years (sport trac)

$12-23 mil in dead money needed to be taken in 2015 - 2016

 

The difference in the numbers is the treatment of the bonuses. I'm guessing Bills will prorate each year's bonus payments over the remaining years of the contract to buy them room in 2014. If Sportrack's figures are more correct, then this is effectively a 2-yr contract, because the Bills will not have room under the cap to absorb an $18.4 mil cap hit in 2014, and will have $11.4 million of dead cap at the time. If they don't restructure, they'll face a tough choice of paying Mario $13 million in real cash and taking a $18.4 mil cap hit for 2014.

 

He better play well.

Edited August 6, 2013 by GG

[papazoid]

 

 

The difference in the numbers is the treatment of the bonuses. I'm guessing Bills will prorate each year's bonus payments over the remaining years of the contract to buy them room in 2014. If Sportrack's figures are more correct, then this is effectively a 2-yr contract, because the Bills will not have room under the cap to absorb an $18.4 mil cap hit in 2014, and will have $11.4 million of dead cap at the time. If they don't restructure, they'll face a tough choice of paying Mario $13 million in real cash and taking a $18.4 mil cap hit for 2014.

 

He better play well.

 

this is a minimum 3 year year deal and more likely 4 year deal.

 

3/15/2012: Signed a six-year, $96 million contract. The deal contains $50 million guaranteed, including a $19 million signing bonus and all of Williams' 2012 and 2013 base salaries. Another $4 million is available through incentives. Williams is eligible for an annual $500,000 workout bonus in years two through six. 2013: $6.5 million (+ $8 million option bonus), 2014: $1.9 million (+ $10.6 million roster bonus), 2015: $12.1 million (+ $1 million roster bonus), 2016: $11.5 million (+ $2.5 million roster bonus), 2017: $11.4 million (+ $3.5 million roster bonus), 2018: Free Agent

 

http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/3636/mario-williams

 

$50 million GUARANTEED = 3 year minim

 

$50 million guaranteed ($24.9 million fully guaranteed, $17.1 million is guaranteed for injury only at the time of signing, $6.5 million of it becomes fully guaranteed later)

$4 million in escalators

Signing Bonus: $19 million

2013 Option Bonus: $8 million

2014 Roster Bonus: $10.6 million

2015 Roster Bonus: $1 million

2016 Roster Bonus: $2.5 million

2017 Roster Bonus: $3.5 million

2012 Workout Bonus: $100,000

2013-2016 Workout Bonus: $500,000

$400k Pro Bowl incentives per year

$400k in additional incentives per year

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nfl/buffalo-bills/mario-williams/

Edited August 6, 2013 by papazoid

[NoSaint]

 

 

The difference in the numbers is the treatment of the bonuses. I'm guessing Bills will prorate each year's bonus payments over the remaining years of the contract to buy them room in 2014. If Sportrack's figures are more correct, then this is effectively a 2-yr contract, because the Bills will not have room under the cap to absorb an $18.4 mil cap hit in 2014, and will have $11.4 million of dead cap at the time. If they don't restructure, they'll face a tough choice of paying Mario $13 million in real cash and taking a $18.4 mil cap hit for 2014.

 

He better play well.

 

only the signing bonus is spread over multiple years. the only way to do what you did is if they sign a new contract every year converting roster bonus into signing bonus.

 

further, there isnt a large cap savings for cutting him at the close of this year, and we will still have to replace that production somehow (ie spend money on a DE making it so we end up spending more against the cap to get less production from the position potentially).

 

long story short, i think you are very much wrong, but thats simply my opinion.

Edited August 6, 2013 by NoSaint

[GG]

only the signing bonus is spread over multiple years. the only way to do what you did is if they sign a new contract every year converting roster bonus into signing bonus.

 

further, there isnt a large cap savings for cutting him at the close of this year, and we will still have to replace that production somehow (ie spend money on a DE making it so we end up spending more against the cap to get less production from the position potentially).

 

long story short, i think you are very much wrong, but thats simply my opinion.

 

I don't know how wrong I am when I'm discussing basic contract numbers. I have seen non signing bonuses prorated over the remaining life of the deal. But I'm not certain on the official NFL rules that govern the proration of different types of bonuses. But that is an aside, because the way the contract is structured, Bills will have a hard decision either at the end of 2013 season or at the end of the 2014 season to decide what to do with Mario's contract because depending on how they treat the bonus payments the cap hit will rise significantly. The other decision Bills have to make is for cash outlay.

 

Under my scenario where all bonuses are prorated, Bills will have a manageable dollar outlay, and a manageable big cap hit in 2014. But then the cap hit hits big time in 2015. Under the Sportac scenario, Mario's cap hit will rise by 50% in 2014, and the Bills will have to pay him the same $13 million in cash. In that case, they will have to determine if they still want to pay him the $13 million salary and bonus for 2014 and swallow a big cap number. Logic dictates that they will look to restructure his deal that will ease the cap.

 

Don't forget that under the current CBA rules, Bills can designate him as a June 1 cut and spread the dead cap hit over two years, similar to what they did with Fitzpatrick. Again, they would only consider doing that if Mario does not perform to expectations in 2013. Unless these are really new Bills, i don't see them paying $13 million in cash for an underperformer.