The Matrix

[RuntheDamnBall]

I think people forget that Sith was actually met with very positive critical reception...it has an 80 on Rotten Tomatoes, which is an extremely strong score.

Stockholm Syndrome.

[Mark Vader]

Great? From start to finish? You mean you didn't laugh your azz off at "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO"?

 

Wow.

 

I thought it was a mess but it was a lot more fun than the first two snooze-fest prequels. I say that as a person who loved and grew up with the originals. The acting was just too poor in all 3 of the prequels for any to be called great. To be fair, it is really hard to act well with that much green screen / CGI. The directing has to be top-shelf, and Lucas never really had that as far as directing actors goes. He was a vision guy and he was good with the story when he had some constraints to deal with. Without them, there was just too much flab.

 

For an example of acting interaction with CGI done really well, I'd say "Life of Pi" was about a billion times better.

 

Lucas got lapped by the game. It's not really too hard to admit. He had his day.

Yes even with "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!", "Revenge of the Sith" was great all the way through. That's just my opinion, and I to grew up on the original Star Wars films.

 

That's the only scene you are going to point to in "Sith"? Because there is a lot of great stuff in that movie.

 

I don't want to hijack this thread, so let me just say again that I understand all the criticisms that "Phantom" & "Clones" got, but "Sith" was far and away the best of the prequels. I would rank it above "Jedi" as well.

[ajzepp]

I don't know how any fan of Star Wars could NOT geek out when General Grievous whipped out his extra arms and started going apeshiit with the quadsabres...that was intense as hell!

 

To me, the 2nd and 3rd Matrix films completely took away from a brilliant original. The Star Wars prequels were sloppy in doing so, but they found a way to still add to the legacy of the franchise. They didn't advance it nearly as far as we had hoped, but it certainly didn't detract from it, IMO. To me, Phantom Menace was sort of like Jedi. If you take out all the Ewok crap in Jedi, you have some incredibly intense sequences, particularly when Luke is refusing to fight Vader at the end. In TPM, if you take out JarJar and a few other pieces of crap, you can salvage some pretty cool stuff there, as well. Darth Maul is probably my favorite character from the entire prequel trilogy.

 

If the Matrix sequels would have tied a better story to the incredible effects, it would have been completely badass. I don't think there's any possible way they could have bettered the first film, but they could have found other ways to advance the franchise, IMO.

 

And let me be clear, the only reason why I have as much hatred for the Matrix sequels as I do is because of how much I LOVED the original. If I had been lukewarm to the frist one, I wouldn't be this passionate in my hatred. It's just that the disappointment is so severe that I can't help but hate the latter efforts - particularly Revolutions.

[26CornerBlitz]

I don't know how any fan of Star Wars could NOT geek out when General Grievous whipped out his extra arms and started going apeshiit with the quadsabres...that was intense as hell!

 

To me, the 2nd and 3rd Matrix films completely took away from a brilliant original. The Star Wars prequels were sloppy in doing so, but they found a way to still add to the legacy of the franchise. They didn't advance it nearly as far as we had hoped, but it certainly didn't detract from it, IMO. To me, Phantom Menace was sort of like Jedi. If you take out all the Ewok crap in Jedi, you have some incredibly intense sequences, particularly when Luke is refusing to fight Vader at the end. In TPM, if you take out JarJar and a few other pieces of crap, you can salvage some pretty cool stuff there, as well. Darth Maul is probably my favorite character from the entire prequel trilogy.

 

If the Matrix sequels would have tied a better story to the incredible effects, it would have been completely badass. I don't think there's any possible way they could have bettered the first film, but they could have found other ways to advance the franchise, IMO.

 

And let me be clear, the only reason why I have as much hatred for the Matrix sequels as I do is because of how much I LOVED the original. If I had been lukewarm to the first one, I wouldn't be this passionate in my hatred. It's just that the disappointment is so severe that I can't help but hate the latter efforts - particularly Revolutions.

 

In a word.....Yep.

[RuntheDamnBall]

I don't know how any fan of Star Wars could NOT geek out when General Grievous whipped out his extra arms and started going apeshiit with the quadsabres...that was intense as hell!

 

To me, the 2nd and 3rd Matrix films completely took away from a brilliant original. The Star Wars prequels were sloppy in doing so, but they found a way to still add to the legacy of the franchise. They didn't advance it nearly as far as we had hoped, but it certainly didn't detract from it, IMO. To me, Phantom Menace was sort of like Jedi. If you take out all the Ewok crap in Jedi, you have some incredibly intense sequences, particularly when Luke is refusing to fight Vader at the end. In TPM, if you take out JarJar and a few other pieces of crap, you can salvage some pretty cool stuff there, as well. Darth Maul is probably my favorite character from the entire prequel trilogy.

 

If the Matrix sequels would have tied a better story to the incredible effects, it would have been completely badass. I don't think there's any possible way they could have bettered the first film, but they could have found other ways to advance the franchise, IMO.

 

And let me be clear, the only reason why I have as much hatred for the Matrix sequels as I do is because of how much I LOVED the original. If I had been lukewarm to the frist one, I wouldn't be this passionate in my hatred. It's just that the disappointment is so severe that I can't help but hate the latter efforts - particularly Revolutions.

That last part is fair, but I really just thought the SW prequels benefited a lot from us WANTING them to be good. I think the notion that any of them were better than Jedi suggests that this storyline was anywhere near as compelling. With acting and dialogue this bad, it seriously wasn't. No one in the prequels was the equal of Harrison Ford or any of the small role players in the originals. JMO. You were seriously able to get wrapped into the action and tension in Jedi even though you figured the good guys would win.

 

As a good example that you cite, Darth Maul is a character that had no dimension for me - the "why" and "how" motivations for character action in these movies was just so weakly executed. You knew the basic plotline of what was going to happen, and when it did, it was just kind of like, "OK, so that happened," for me. That Christensen was such a whiny b*tch of an actor made it more difficult to buy in. Think of a guy like Cillian Murphy or Joseph Gordon-Levitt and what they could have done with that role.

[Rubes]

If the Matrix sequels would have tied a better story to the incredible effects, it would have been completely badass. I don't think there's any possible way they could have bettered the first film, but they could have found other ways to advance the franchise, IMO.

 

And let me be clear, the only reason why I have as much hatred for the Matrix sequels as I do is because of how much I LOVED the original. If I had been lukewarm to the frist one, I wouldn't be this passionate in my hatred. It's just that the disappointment is so severe that I can't help but hate the latter efforts - particularly Revolutions.

 

Basically, you could just substitute "Star Wars" for "the Matrix" in your statements and it would apply perfectly. The problem with the SW prequels, as I see it, is precisely what you say: they would have been great if they could have tied a better story to the incredible effects. The story in the prequels was so convoluted and incoherent it had no flow and made little sense, and on top of that the dialogue is so bush-league it's embarrassing. Contrast the prequels to the original SW movie -- in the prequels, there are no characters that draw our attention and emotion. Who are we supposed to care about? The guy who we already know is going to become a ruthless villain, acted by a horrible actor with the worst lines of dialogue quite possibly ever written or delivered? The young Obi Wan, who runs around doing...something vaguely political and confusing, while spewing grade school dialogue? The "queen"? Really? Everyone else is just a cardboard cutout.

 

The problem with both of these series is that the writers and directors tried to do far too much with the sequels, to the point where it just seems like (1) they're trying to cram far too much material into the allotted space, and (2) they're trying way too hard to come up with creative, complex explanations for all of the cool things in the original films that made them so fascinating. The great things about both The Matrix and SW:IV are: (1) they tell simple, classic stories in the context of cool sci-fi settings, and (2) they focus on a small number of clearly defined characters. Neither the Matrix sequels nor the SW prequels followed this formula -- they both evolved from simple to complex, and from few interesting characters to large numbers of characters that I couldn't give a crap about.

 

Not that there is anything intrinsically wrong with complexity in movies or stories, of course. If you're going to do it, though, it has to be done carefully and gracefully. Both the Matrix sequels and SW prequels come across as anything but.

 

 

As a good example that you cite, Darth Maul is a character that had no dimension for me - the "why" and "how" motivations for character action in these movies was just so weakly executed. You knew the basic plotline of what was going to happen, and when it did, it was just kind of like, "OK, so that happened," for me. That Christensen was such a whiny b*tch of an actor made it more difficult to buy in. Think of a guy like Cillian Murphy or Joseph Gordon-Levitt and what they could have done with that role.

 

I'm not sure any actor could overcome the horrid dialogue in those movies, but good points. I mean, I consider Samuel Jackson and Ewan MacGregor to be pretty solid actors, and even they are forgettable in these roles.

[ajzepp]

That last part is fair, but I really just thought the SW prequels benefited a lot from us WANTING them to be good. I think the notion that any of them were better than Jedi suggests that this storyline was anywhere near as compelling. With acting and dialogue this bad, it seriously wasn't. No one in the prequels was the equal of Harrison Ford or any of the small role players in the originals. JMO. You were seriously able to get wrapped into the action and tension in Jedi even though you figured the good guys would win.

 

As a good example that you cite, Darth Maul is a character that had no dimension for me - the "why" and "how" motivations for character action in these movies was just so weakly executed. You knew the basic plotline of what was going to happen, and when it did, it was just kind of like, "OK, so that happened," for me. That Christensen was such a whiny b*tch of an actor made it more difficult to buy in. Think of a guy like Cillian Murphy or Joseph Gordon-Levitt and what they could have done with that role.

 

Okay, compare Darth Maul to Boba Fett. Can you seriously say that Boba Fett had a better fleshed out "why" and "how" motivations in the original films? This guy is one of the most popular characters ever, yet he did basically nothing. I think what has happened for a lot of people is that they're realizing that Star Wars really IS for kids. I've noticed FAR less objection to the prequels from those who are younger and weren't around when the originals were in the theaters. Those of us who grew up with Star Wars saw the films when we were still young, far less cynical, and far more willing to allow ourselves to get transported into another world for the sake of entertainment. George Lucas was focused far more on creating a new lesion of Star Wars fans - i.e. kids who saw it for the first time at the theater - than he was appeasing his long time fans who were hooked from their own childhood. I truly believe that's where a lot of the backlash comes from...and I can understand the resentment to a degree, but I think Lucas did get around to giving us original fans what we've been waiting for when he made Sith...we got our Darth Vader origin story.

 

Segue this to Rubes comments...we already basically KNEW the story, so for that reason alone we're not going to have the same degree of discovery that we would have with a fresh story. We already knew it was a Vader origin story to begin with, and probably many of us had an idea of how it should go in our minds already. At least the Prequels didn't break their own rules...there were inconsistencies, of course, but the example I always beat to death in the matrix sequels is Neo developing abilities OUTSIDE the matrix, namely, psychokinesis and "force-like" abilities. That was the final straw for me, and it COMPLETELY took me out of the game. Definitely agree about how The Matrix and SW IV succeeded by telling "simple, classic stories in a cool sci-fi setting". That's a brilliant formula, IMO...and it certainly worked in both instances.

 

 

EDIT: One more quick point that I thought of...I often hear people saying how there was no Han Solo/Harrison Ford level of awesomeness in the prequels. Keep in mind, we're talking about one of the most charismatic actors, not only of his generation, but ever. It's really not fair to use that as a point of contention when discussing the prequels, cause there just aren't lots of Harrison Fords walking around on the streets that we can just go sign up for the film. The guy is iconic, and he's played iconic characters his entire life. He's in very, very rare company.

Edited August 7, 2013 by ajzepp

[Clippers of Nfl]

All of this was typed for the very end. The oracle and the architect meet and have a conversation. Humans will be free to leave the Matrix if they choose (which has been discussed in the first movies that some people will chooose to stay even though they know it isn't reality). The architect mentions that the Oracle played a dangerous game and asked if she always knew the outcome. She says no but that she believed. To me the Oracle led the humans down a path that if succesful would end the war. Which is why there were several editions of the Matrix as she kept trying to end the war. Did all of the people do the things they did because it was their destiny (fatalism) or did they do them because they decided to (determinism). That answer is up to the viewer to decide.

 

Close second to me is Neo as a savior (Jesus) and the story being about faith and what it can help you accomplish. Sometimes faith is the strongest thing in the world and can conquer everything. Or love conquers all as I previously stated. Take your pick. I just spent way to long typing to leave it as you decide but that is how I started my post and how I will end. I hope I just gave you some ideas to chew on. If you really are interested there are many websites dedicated to the discussion and can help you formulate your own opinion.

 

The original movie is perfection to me. One of the best movies I have ever seen. I think it being so great is what leads people to discount 2 and 3. They are good movies just not the perfection that 1 was. Also there is the animatrix if you really want to dive deep into the world and they are very interesting on their own.

Very nice take. Why was part one so straight forward and 2 and 3 so dubious. Religion/fate take your pick...

 

For easy explanation. 6th sense. Bruce realizes he has been dead all along. Cool. Surprise. Great!!! This doesnt mean all intellectual movies suck. No. But it would be nice if they could be pieced together nicely. That's all. Is that too much to ask for?

 

For Aj, you hated the last 2? Wow. I remember I enjoyed them. Probably the cool action scenes the most. But strong dislike. Really?

 

Since I'm the stupid guy without the ba, I'm just going to say it was all about computers. Lmao. Why couldn't it be about computers? Viruses, shutdowns, resets, programs? Just kidding.

 

It was mentioned way at the beginning of this thread, how at the end of the day, the wacky producers laughing all the way to the bank. They mixed pretty much everything into the movies. Religion, fate, etc. etc. They meant to confuse us. That's probably what annoys me the most.

[LeviF]

What people normally don't realize (which makes them under-appreciate the sequels) is that Agent Smith is actually the protagonist of the series, whereas Neo and Co. are the collective antagonist.

 

 

 

 

[Rubes]

Okay, compare Darth Maul to Boba Fett. Can you seriously say that Boba Fett had a better fleshed out "why" and "how" motivations in the original films? This guy is one of the most popular characters ever, yet he did basically nothing. I think what has happened for a lot of people is that they're realizing that Star Wars really IS for kids.

 

I've always wondered by Boba Fett is such a popular character. You're right in that he was a complete mystery, did almost nothing, and probably spoke what, three lines total in V-VI? I think he was just a fascination for people; evil, hidden face, mysterious. I don't consider him an important character, though -- in fact, if you think about it, he's probably the shallowest of characters, and in that sense about equal to Darth Maul, who was another complete mystery who did little to nothing, said even less, and somehow earned the fascination of the public. I say it's because of his makeup.

 

As to your point about Star Wars being for kids -- I would say that I disagree in that SW IV was not necessarily for kids at all. It was great storytelling that connected with people of all ages. Once Lucas got past his first movie, though, it most definitely evolved into a series and franchise targeting kids, starting right with V, and really hitting stride with VI. I don't know if that was entirely a purposeful marketing move, but it certainly suited him.

 

 

I've noticed FAR less objection to the prequels from those who are younger and weren't around when the originals were in the theaters. Those of us who grew up with Star Wars saw the films when we were still young, far less cynical, and far more willing to allow ourselves to get transported into another world for the sake of entertainment. George Lucas was focused far more on creating a new lesion of Star Wars fans - i.e. kids who saw it for the first time at the theater - than he was appeasing his long time fans who were hooked from their own childhood. I truly believe that's where a lot of the backlash comes from...and I can understand the resentment to a degree, but I think Lucas did get around to giving us original fans what we've been waiting for when he made Sith...we got our Darth Vader origin story.

 

I see where you're coming from, but I can't really agree with it. I don't think it has to do with growing older and more cynical, or being less willing to engage with a fantastical story. I mean, I was already old enough and cynical enough when the Matrix came out, and I was transfixed. I still experience that with movies, even if they require a major suspension of disbelief, but only when there is a solid story, good storytelling, and a focus on the goals and emotions of characters that are nicely fleshed out. Lucas became childish in V and VI, and by the time I-III came about the storytelling and character development took a major back seat to the technology and marketing. The story throughout I-III is horribly convoluted, and he cut all sorts of corners with the storytelling and character development to the point where it's just a bunch of cardboard characters spewing silly dialogue while they run around doing a bunch of things that either don't seem to make sense or I can't seem to care about.

 

 

Segue this to Rubes comments...we already basically KNEW the story, so for that reason alone we're not going to have the same degree of discovery that we would have with a fresh story. We already knew it was a Vader origin story to begin with, and probably many of us had an idea of how it should go in our minds already.

 

I don't necessarily agree with this, either. We knew the end point of the story, but we didn't really know the story at all. All we knew is that some dude named Anakin, who was a good guy, fell into darkness and became an evil guy, and a couple of kids were involved. That actually has all the makings of a fascinating tragedy, even if we already know the ending. I mean, Titanic is one of the most loved movies out there, and everybody already knew how that one was going to end. There's plenty Lucas could have done with that storyline that could have allowed for discovery, fascination, and elicitation of emotion. Instead, he settled for something incoherent and silly.

 

 

EDIT: One more quick point that I thought of...I often hear people saying how there was no Han Solo/Harrison Ford level of awesomeness in the prequels. Keep in mind, we're talking about one of the most charismatic actors, not only of his generation, but ever. It's really not fair to use that as a point of contention when discussing the prequels, cause there just aren't lots of Harrison Fords walking around on the streets that we can just go sign up for the film. The guy is iconic, and he's played iconic characters his entire life. He's in very, very rare company.

 

Great actors can take good characters and make them iconic. Almost nobody can take a crappy character and script and do much with it. Actors like Ewan MacGregor, Samuel Jackson, and Natalie Portman are all very good actors capable of elevating characters to high levels. Each, however, was dealt a hand of **** and found out there's no bluffing in Hollywood with a pair of two's.

Edited August 8, 2013 by Rubes

[ajzepp]

 

 

For Aj, you hated the last 2? Wow. I remember I enjoyed them. Probably the cool action scenes the most. But strong dislike. Really?

 

 

 

Yeah, I wish I didn't feel that way...lol If you take the level of hatred for the Vader "Nooooooooooo!!!" in Sith, it's x100 for me when Neo was outside the Matrix and all of a sudden had magical psychokinetic abilities to just knock drones out of the sky with his mind. It just was a singular moment that represented the frustration that was building up by the time I got about half way through part 3. I've seen them both several times over the years to try and reconcile my hate for them, but ultimately it's a fail by the end every time. I can enjoy the second one enough in terms of how cool the effects are, but I'm always left with, "I know where this is all going.." and I just can't get away with it.

 

I'm actually planning to watch the Wachowski's latest film, Cloud Atlas, pretty soon...so hopefully I can put the Matrix sequels behind me and get back to enjoying their work...cause I do find them both very interesting, and I'm grateful to them for giving us the first Matrix film to enjoy

[section122]

 

 

Yeah, I wish I didn't feel that way...lol If you take the level of hatred for the Vader "Nooooooooooo!!!" in Sith, it's x100 for me when Neo was outside the Matrix and all of a sudden had magical psychokinetic abilities to just knock drones out of the sky with his mind. It just was a singular moment that represented the frustration that was building up by the time I got about half way through part 3. I've seen them both several times over the years to try and reconcile my hate for them, but ultimately it's a fail by the end every time. I can enjoy the second one enough in terms of how cool the effects are, but I'm always left with, "I know where this is all going.." and I just can't get away with it.

 

I'm actually planning to watch the Wachowski's latest film, Cloud Atlas, pretty soon...so hopefully I can put the Matrix sequels behind me and get back to enjoying their work...cause I do find them both very interesting, and I'm grateful to them for giving us the first Matrix film to enjoy

I've been a but absent in this thread and I apologize. Aj it boils down to you like Star Wars and not the matrix and there is nothing wrong with that. It is making you excuse a lot in stars wars that was bad and not allowing the same for the matrix again that is okay.

 

Allow me if I may though to talk about Neo using his powers outside of the Matrix. He is an anomaly to the system. He is also the counterbalance to agent smith. Agent smith escapes the matrix which has never happened. It is a program living outside of the system which is exactly what Neo is. He is a program working outside of the system. Try to stop viewing Neo as a human being but as a host for the program that is the one. Much like the agents ability to transfer hosts. Neo is killed in the first movie. The program lives on through him.

 

Also I would like to add that you allow Jedis to have magical and mystical powers but somehow won't allow your mid to accept Neo having them

:-p

 

What people normally don't realize (which makes them under-appreciate the sequels) is that Agent Smith is actually the protagonist of the series, whereas Neo and Co. are the collective antagonist.

 

 

 

 

I love stories of the bad guy and how they become that way. I looked forward to the Star Wars sequel and will grant that the Sith was an excellent movie. When he murdered the kids my jaw dropped. That said 1 and 2 were decidedly okay. So I get ajs view on the Matrix. I stand by my theory of the awesomeness of the first ruining 2 and 3 for some people.

 

Holy crap I'm watching Revolutions right now and the Oracle explained his powers as extending beyond the Matrix and all the way to where it came from (machine city).

 

In that same conversation to add to Levi's point she also states that Smith balances the equation while Neo unbalances it.

 

 

Aj just watch the conversation that happens in the first half hour of revolutions between the Oracle and Neo. It answers many of the questions you have asked in ITT. Much better than my brain that is missing so many cells ;-)

Edited August 9, 2013 by section122

[ajzepp]

I've been a but absent in this thread and I apologize. Aj it boils down to you like Star Wars and not the matrix and there is nothing wrong with that. It is making you excuse a lot in stars wars that was bad and not allowing the same for the matrix again that is okay.

 

Allow me if I may though to talk about Neo using his powers outside of the Matrix. He is an anomaly to the system. He is also the counterbalance to agent smith. Agent smith escapes the matrix which has never happened. It is a program living outside of the system which is exactly what Neo is. He is a program working outside of the system. Try to stop viewing Neo as a human being but as a host for the program that is the one. Much like the agents ability to transfer hosts. Neo is killed in the first movie. The program lives on through him.

 

Also I would like to add that you allow Jedis to have magical and mystical powers but somehow won't allow your mid to accept Neo having them

:-p

 

 

 

If you're getting the impression that I didn't like the Matrix, I'm not doing a very good job of articulating my position...I LOVE the Matrix!

 

And c'mon man, you can't be serious about the Jedi thing lol

[RuntheDamnBall]

Yeah, I wish I didn't feel that way...lol If you take the level of hatred for the Vader "Nooooooooooo!!!" in Sith, it's x100 for me when Neo was outside the Matrix and all of a sudden had magical psychokinetic abilities to just knock drones out of the sky with his mind. It just was a singular moment that represented the frustration that was building up by the time I got about half way through part 3. I've seen them both several times over the years to try and reconcile my hate for them, but ultimately it's a fail by the end every time. I can enjoy the second one enough in terms of how cool the effects are, but I'm always left with, "I know where this is all going.." and I just can't get away with it.

 

I'm actually planning to watch the Wachowski's latest film, Cloud Atlas, pretty soon...so hopefully I can put the Matrix sequels behind me and get back to enjoying their work...cause I do find them both very interesting, and I'm grateful to them for giving us the first Matrix film to enjoy

Cloud Atlas is pretty complete emotional experience. Having Tom Tywker on board is a pretty great addition, too. It's not perfect but it hits some heights. Might depend a bit on how bothered you are by the makeup.

[ajzepp]

Cloud Atlas is pretty complete emotional experience. Having Tom Tywker on board is a pretty great addition, too. It's not perfect but it hits some heights. Might depend a bit on how bothered you are by the makeup.

 

very cool, that makes me more interested in seeing it...I have a long weekend, so going to try to check it out tonight or tomorrow.

 

I've heard mixed reviews on it, but I have a feeling it's going to strike a positive chord with me...

[RuntheDamnBall]

very cool, that makes me more interested in seeing it...I have a long weekend, so going to try to check it out tonight or tomorrow.

 

I've heard mixed reviews on it, but I have a feeling it's going to strike a positive chord with me...

It is better than it is given credit for, but definitely intense. I will be interested to hear what you think.

[ajzepp]

It is better than it is given credit for, but definitely intense. I will be interested to hear what you think.

 

I just watched "The Place Beyond the Pines" last night, so might as well make it an "intense" double feature!

[ajzepp]

wow, I'm about 42 mins into Cloud Atlas and I'm exhausted! All this damn jumping around and tons of different characters thrown at you at once...ugh!

 

Going to take a break and then continue with it...hopefully I'll feel different when it's over, but typically this is the sort of movie I have a hard time enjoying...way too much damn work!

[LeviF]

wow, I'm about 42 mins into Cloud Atlas and I'm exhausted! All this damn jumping around and tons of different characters thrown at you at once...ugh!

 

Going to take a break and then continue with it...hopefully I'll feel different when it's over, but typically this is the sort of movie I have a hard time enjoying...way too much damn work!

 

It took me a solid 75 minutes to really start liking that movie.

[RuntheDamnBall]

wow, I'm about 42 mins into Cloud Atlas and I'm exhausted! All this damn jumping around and tons of different characters thrown at you at once...ugh!

 

Going to take a break and then continue with it...hopefully I'll feel different when it's over, but typically this is the sort of movie I have a hard time enjoying...way too much damn work!

Knowing that the book is written in different literary styles (historical record, pulpy detective novel, dystopic sci-fi future, dystopic barbarian future) might help. That, and that each successive storyline is "read" or otherwise integrated into the following subject's life. It is a lot of work. I think the 75 minute mark is a fair point of where it starts accelerating into something more cohesive. There is some disturbing stuff to come!